Salmond and Sturgeon Want the English Fish for More Fat Subsidies

elantan

kabayiri wrote: »

There is another dynamic.

Independence is not the only way to regional autonomy.

What if the additional powers given to Manchester councils starts to show through improved services at lower cost?

What if the unified budget of NHS and social funding in the area shows that local councils can work with local NHS more efficiently?

There would be calls for other regional cities to be allowed to follow this lead.

What if Aberdeen were one such area? Does this undermine independence?

I'm a fan of progressive local autonomy, specifically where something is trialled in one region and if successful extended elsewhere. This is almost completely opposite to the introduction of Police Scotland though.

To me that is not the answer, I want Independence ... incidentally if I lived in England I would want England to be independent, I dont however, I live in Scotland so I want Scotland to be independent, I believe that every country should be ran by itself ... not another country, and in all things.

I would have no problem if we had independence and we chose to work in conjunction with other countries ... say Scotland has found a way to deal with its alcohol abuse problem ( I know I am dreaming now) and say England would like to deal with the same problem, I have no issue in us sharing ideas and helping each other achieve the stated goal, but I believe that we should all be independent, we should all rule ourselves.

Thats intrinsic to my belief system, always has been always will be

kabayiri

Generali wrote: »

Interestingly, in Aus we are moving away from localism as it is seen to be inefficient and breeding cronyism and corruption.

The states and territories are seen by many as being a pointless additional layer of Government, spending money we haven't got on things we neither want nor need.

You see the same dynamic in companies all the time.

One moment there's a move towards centralising functions, using things like outsourcing. Then disenchantment sets in and departmental heads talk about gaining control, bringing the function closer to the customer contact points etc.

You can't win!

.string.

Shakethedisease wrote: »

If you emigrate to Spain after paying into a UK pension.. you still get it even if you've been in Spain for the last 25 years. I don't think there's a problem there. Would only apply to those becoming pensioners after independence. And even then.. the 'pot' would have to be split somehow to take into account payments in up until then.

I think it's more complex than that (in the unlikely event of Natland existing).

British Pensioners who go to live abroad get their pensions OK, but they don't have it indexed; as I understand it is frozen. ... So no increase with time.

There is a voluntary scheme (or used to be because (or used it for high on 30 years) to make voluntary contributions, but whether it will be applied I don't know.

Scots who retain British Citizenship (that would show which SNP types are pure-in-heart wouldn't it!) who live (and therefore spend) in the UK, would do better, presumably, than those in a foreign Natland. For those in Natland would stop accumulating a UK Pension and would have to turn to the SNP to top them up, not that I think the SNP would remain in power for very long.

The small matter of the currency would have an impact and my guess is that the £value of the Scottish part of the Pension would not be as high as that of the UK. I can see some public disquiet over that one, where people have degraded Pension entitlement.

Finally, in the aftermath of an SNP refusal to honour its debts, it is, at the very least, questionable that the UK would honour any sort of payment to Natland Residents.

The SNP has been successful in pi××ing off everyone South of the Border; that's not a scenario generating "Good Will" for the SNP, nor trust.

Oh, incidentally, as for "sharing out assets" - forget it as any sort of bargaining chip. Natland would be entitled, essentially, to Scotland-specific buildings In Scotland, but little else. Salmond's claims for looting English Museums, sharing Institutions etc were pure bunkum.

CLAPTON

.string. wrote: »

I think it's more complex than that (in the unlikely event of Natland existing).

British Pensioners who go to live abroad get their pensions OK, but they don't have it indexed; as I understand it is frozen. ... So no increase with time.
.

although irrelevant to the thread

you are, frankly, simply wrong

elantan

.string. wrote: »

British Pensioners who go to live abroad get their pensions OK, but they don't have it indexed; as I understand it is frozen. ... So no increase with time



.

My understanding is if you move to another European country you do get the rises... If you move outside of Europe then no you dont get any increases ...

CLAPTON

elantan wrote: »

My understanding is if you move to another European country you do get the rises... If you move outside of Europe then no you dont get any increases ...

better, but not correct either

.string.

CLAPTON wrote: »

although irrelevant to the thread

you are, frankly, simply wrong

Yes it seems I am wrong as far as Europe is concerned
see here. Scotland not being in the EUROPEAN UNION could loose out. Those living there would need a favour from the UK to avoid that.

Edit:. Even more complex it seems, exceptions to the rule being subject to certain reciprocal arrangements ... see here. It's a controversial matter, with cost driving the UK Government's perspective it seems. The size of the Scottish population would loom large in the minds of those dealing with these matters methinks.

Tromking

.string. wrote: »

The SNP has been successful in pi××ing off everyone South of the Border; that's not a scenario generating "Good Will" for the SNP, nor trust.

I managed to catch Salmond on Newsnight the other day and rather predictably he managed to shoe horn in the phrase "little Englander" in his rant. The Scots pride themselves in not scaring easily but as we saw in the GE there is real political capital in being anti-SNP in UK politics now. I wouldn't for example underestimate the burgeoning antipathy in England toward the SNP and ergo the Scots now.

.string.

Tromking wrote: »

I managed to catch Salmond on Newsnight the other day and rather predictably he managed to shoe horn in the phrase "little Englander" in his rant. The Scots pride themselves in not scaring easily but as we saw in the GE there is real political capital in being anti-SNP in UK politics now. I wouldn't for example underestimate the burgeoning antipathy in England toward the SNP and ergo the Scots now.

Yes care must be taken to distinguish between the SNP and Scots.

Shakethedisease

skintmacflint wrote: »

I much prefer reading the Ahdinnaeken blog written by longshanker. His blogs on Joan MacAlpine are excellent. The ones he did earlier in the year on Angela Constance, and her failing Education standards, SNP trying to grab the benches in Westminster and Eck the has been , as the new SNP members allocated guardians were hilarious.

It was Paul's ( wee ginger dug ) vivid and heartbreaking descriptions of both his love for his partner, and him slowly dying of vascular dementia that had us in tears. Nothing really to do with the politics, though he's good at that too.