MSE News: Flight delay reclaiming boost as Supreme Court throws out airline appeals

Vauban

For those interested in a compare and contrast exercise, why not compere this:

http://ec.europa.eu/transport/themes/passengers/air/doc/neb-extraordinary-circumstances-list.pdf

with this:

http://airlinecounsel.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/11/Extraordinarycircumstanceslistmodifiedinlightofjet2UKCAA.pdf

michaels

SpannerMonkey wrote: »

That's a good quote & a fair point. Though to take a middle view, I would guess they were trying to protect their business interests, rather than simply being malicious towards Mr H.

On a side-note to the comment further up the thread, I read somewhere that there are potentially 11.8 million claims. If we said £400 as an average claim, my infant school maths works that out to just under £4.75 billion. :shocked:
I agree it's unlikely that everyone will be jumping on the bandwagon now, but even if a third of them did, I think flying just might become the preserve of the rich once again.

Edit: Just to correct the above figure, the official estimates are 'only' £3.9 billion.

I agree with this, whilst the law should be obeyed, perhaps the level of compensation currently enshrined in the law makes operating a low cost airline uneconomic, if prices rise sharply many routes will be lost and many will people not be able to travel (basic economics economies of scale comes into play) . In the end all or us who can only afford to travel on the bargain basement fares (and be willing to accept the consequences of disruption in order to do so) will no longer be able to fly.

2 cheers only from me.

And of course this is likely to increase the pressure on pilots not to decide a plane is not airworthy where it is a judgement call rather than err on the side of safety :eek:

phritchie

The figure i have in my head for the number of eligible flights is ~1%? Remember we're talking 4hr + delays. So if the average payout is £400, that adds just £4 to to the cost of every ticket - not a significant amount, and that's assuming everyone is clued up enough to claim. I'd certainly rather pay that than be stranded for hours without the hope of a shred of recognition for my lost time. Certainly not going to make flying the preserve of the rich again.
And it's not true that it week mean the end of low cost. Effective low cost airlines like easyjet and Ryanair are typically more punctual than the full fares airlines - see easyjet's recent tv ads.

The ones it will impact most will be the bad airlines.

jamesg123

I am not raising a glass to this decision.

I fly often to visit family & friends.

Next week I am travelling EMA-NOC total cost £14.99 each flight sector.

Now assume they are both delayed I can claim upto £400 per sector

Hands up everyone who thinks I will still be able to avail of good deals like this moving forward?

My point is that I don't need the EU to bully airlines on my behalf to pay compensation for low cost flights.
Quite simply all that I expect is the option to travel later or avail a £14.99 refund.
Back 10 years ago people could make decisions which airline to fly with and poor performers would simply fail. If you are concerned about flight delays then make your decision and book with an airline who freely publishes it on time performance data before you fly.
It's quite easy to do and you should the be able to book a good value flight like I do without paying for an overpriced seat.

Not everything is is the consumers interest.
I am off to pay my gas bill not the base price but also a price which includes green levies.. Please just give me the best price not the levied price.

Happy Flying

Caz3121

jamesg123 wrote: »

Next week I am travelling EMA-NOC total cost £14.99 each flight sector.

Now assume they are both delayed I can claim upto £400 per sector

EMA-NOC is 509km, so if both delayed over 3 hours due to reasons within the airlines control, you could claim €250 each sector

raddy59

My airline stayed my claim because they are awaiting a high court ruling mid 2015. Is there another case pending?

Vauban

raddy59 wrote: »

My airline stayed my claim because they are awaiting a high court ruling mid 2015. Is there another case pending?

Answered on your other thread - pls don't double post.

jamesg123

EMA-NOC is 509 km, so if both delayed over 3 hours due to reasons within the airlines control, you could claim €250 each sector

€500 for a £29.98 Flight.

If I travel London to Carlisle by train I am entitled to the following according to national rail website

As a minimum, if you are one hour late at your destination, you are entitled to:
20% of the price paid for a single ticket
10% of the price paid for a return ticket if the delay is only on one leg of the journey
20% of the price paid for a return ticket if both legs are delayed
Train companies consider claims on a case by case basis and are only contractually obliged to pay compensation in certain circumstances.

Now tell me that flight compensation €500 is correct and justified....
If i was traveling by train and delayed on both legs my compensation would be £5.99. (IE 20% of the price paid for a return ticket)

Don't even mention "Stranded" Here's an idea if you are worried about been stranded purchase travel insurance... Simple

Don't pass these costs onto every passenger. If i want insurance and compensation for flight delays purchase OPTIONAL travel insurance and choose reliable airlines.

End of rant

mandc

Great news about the resent court ruling. We've been trying to get a refund for a 5 hour delay on Norwegian Air from Tenerife South to London Gatwick on 28th July'14 and have had our claim rejected. It was a technical fault, apparently the flaps where not working and needed a repair. Norwegian have rejected our claim sighting extraordinary circumstances and the following European Court Rulings:

"European Court of Justice – C-402/07 (Sturgeon):
The EC Regulation 261/2004 does not expressly provide compensation for cases where the flight has been delayed as it does in the case of cancellations. According to the decision of the European Court of Justice in case C-402/07 (Sturgeon), the passengers affected by a delay should be compensated under the terms laid down in Article 7 of regulation 261/2004, when they reach the final destination three hours or more after the original scheduled arrival time. The airlines are exempt from further compensation if the reason for the delay is extraordinary circumstances outside the airline's control.

European Court of Justice – C-549/07 (Wallentin-Hermann):
Judgement C-549/07 (Wallentin-Hermann) is trying to define what can be classified as extraordinary circumstances. According to the judgement, technical problems that are found during the scheduled maintenance of an aircraft cannot be defined as extraordinary circumstances, unless the technical problem stems from events which, by their nature or origin, are not inherent in the normal exercise of the carrier’s activity and are beyond the operating carrier’s actual control. Circumstances that are not inherent in the operation of air services are events that do not routinely occur during the operation of the aircraft."

We don't think they are playing by the rules. The CAA won't investigate as the flight did not take off from a UK airport, the Spanish aviation authority say on their website that they can't help, so we have written to the Norwegian national enforcement agency using their online form - will they be interested if the flight did not touch Norwegian soil?

So, is our only option to take Norwegian Air to the small claims court and does the GOV.UK website allow claims against Norwegian companies?

Any gurus out there

richardw

jamesg123 wrote: »

..... Don't pass these costs onto every passenger....

They won't because these costs will come out of the airlines profit pot.