Co-sleeping and overnights with NRP

mgdavid

duchy wrote: »

....... The child won't sleep at your house-and he wants to use a six year old to be forced somewhere she is unable to sleep by an access order ? ........

In case you're speed-reading and missing salient points, the child does sleep, it's just the initial going to bed that is the problem.
She's 8 not 6 - huge difference.

plumpmouse

duchy wrote: »

Nothing to do with a child getting their own way (but possibly a lot to do with Dad wanting his -and prepared to enforce a contact order to do so even at the expense of upsetting the child rather than letting the situation calm down and routines reestablish again before trying a sleepover)

And what about the Mum trying to get what she wants above her child's needs?

Come on it is completely unreasonable that his partner of over 4 years can't collect an 8 year child to help both parties particularly as the Mum is so reluctant to help.

In my view the Dad is there wAnting to show his child that he loves her and have her at his house. Mum isn't happy and is making reason to try to stop it. How can that be in the best interest of her child.

It always gets me on here how slated absent fathers are (rightly so) and yet when a father wants to be in his child's life he gets slated too. They just can't win can they?

Mothers don't always know what is best and don't always act in the best interest of the child.

Op hope you resolve this somehow. If the overnight visit do stop just try to make sure he gets the contact he should and make sure his daughter knows how much he loves her no matter. One day she will be old enough to be allowed to think for herself.

splishsplash

Who looks after your SD in your house has nothing whatsoever to do with your husband's ex, unless there are child protection issues. Some ex-wives seem to want to cause trouble in any way they can - like 'insisting' on things being the way they want them when in fact they have no right to do this. (I'm presuming for the sake of argument that your husband has parental rights). The only person hurt by this is the child caught in the middle.

Your SD's mother is messing with the child's head - infantilizing the child by keeping her dependent. At eight she should be well able to settle herself to sleep or read herself to sleep. Isn't this the age where they start having sleepovers and trips away? Has she refused the school trip because she's afraid of going to bed? How sad.

It sounds like the mother is trying to sabotage the child's relationship with her father and she should not be allowed to do this. It's very wrong of her to let her own bitterness and anger get in the way of her child's best interests.

If the only way to get the mother to see sense is to enforce the contact order, then you need to get back to court maybe.

Marisco

plumpmouse wrote: »

. One day she will be old enough to be allowed to think for herself.

IMO she's old enough now, has anyone asked the child what she wants? I'm not a fan of co sleeping at any age, and certainly not an 8 year old!!

I think some are being a bit unfair on the op's oh, until you've come across an awkward, bitter ex, no one has any idea what it's like!! I can tell you from experience it's bloody awful! And because the mother has charge of the kids there is very little that can be done, apart from ploughing on, and hoping for the best.

duchy

It isn't a matter of slating -it's a matter of dealing with the situation as it is right now.

In an ideal world the needs of the child would always be put first by both parents and those parents and their new partners would make one co-operative network for the child with everyone talking any issues through and making decisions completely child based .......sadly this isn't the case so you have to deal with real life instead.

There are always reasons parents are still not communicating. After all at one time they got on well enough to have a child together .

Saying things "should be" a certain way is all very well but they aren't and all the kevetching about it in the world won't change the fact that Mum is the NRP and her reaction that it isn't good for a child to be made to stay in a situation that distresses her isn't acceptable (in this case a sleepover). Dad is now getting angry-understandable -but it's not going to help the situation. To get what he wants long term he's going to have to get past that and find ways to communicate. Going to court is a short term solution that will cause a lot of bad feeling and anger on both sides so should be the last resort

If Mum is single and sees Dad as having moved on and getting to be "fun dad" once a week whilst she does all the less fun bits of child raising day in and day out solo that could be part of the reason for her stubborness for example. Dad may not want to see it from Mum's viewpoint but if he can (helped by his partner who can maybe see the women's viewpoint) then it could help no end. There obviously is*some* communication still between the parents -and more a case that Mum won't get into "discussion" which may actually feel like him just arguing if he's angry-so letting the overnight drop for now and have her for the day and letting things calm down - and the child may actually be asking her Mum if she can stay herself - however I'd certainly not do what a poster above suggested in trying to emotionally blackmail a six year old into staying. The child is six - a few months of her not staying in the big picture of having her in your lives until she is at least eighteen isn't as huge as it feels right now but staying calm and not making the situation worse but rebuilding the daughter's confidence -and with it Mum's will pay big dividends - whereas shouting and threats of court can damage the situation long term.

The important thing to remember is situations change, Mum may get a new partner and appreciate her co-sleeping daughter staying with her Dad, daughter will get older and more confident -and anger fades if you don't keep fueling it with new resentments.

splishsplash

The OP says the child is 8.
The mother's had it all her own way for the past three or four years. Time to try a new approach? Mum clearly isn't interested in talking and her current approach is working fine for her.
Just not for her daughter.

silvercar

OH works nights, had to work on his night with SD and his ex won't allow me to watch her.

Did his ex have the right to insist that you can't watch her?

Today ex has insisted that OH can no longer have SD for overnight stays. He's obviously heartbroken.

In the mean time, she makes the decisions about days and times yet refuses to assist with any travelling or allow anyone else to. His relationship with his daughter exists entirely at her mother's whim and his parenting is constantly undermined.

Could it be that the ex is used to getting her own way? Your OH has never stood up to her, so she continually pushes the boundaries. Now you get to what seems to be the straw that is breaking the camel's back and the ex is again getting her own way.

On the other hand, I can't see the point of a contact order allowing your partner one night a week if he is going to be working on that night - how does that give him contact?

FBaby

My only advice is don't see it as a 'battle' with mum but maybe one with the child. You say that mum has indicated that it is your SD who doesn't want to stay overnight and that is very possible. It is quite common that step children don't dare telling the nrp how they feel about something, so tell the pwc, pwc gets anxious as see the child upset and rule the roost.

My advice would be for your OH not to focus on the nights themselves, but try to discuss with her and understand the basis for her fears and anxieties. I went through a phase at that age when I was petrified that a man would come into our house and kill us all. It started after a event on the news. I would have done anything to sleep with my mum, but she would have none of it. So instead, i used to go to bed at 8pm, stay awake willingly until she went to bed, and then I used to get up and put pieces of paper in the lock as I convinced myself they would not be able to put a key in and get in. The anxiety was such that used to love storms because I convinced myself that the 'bad man' wouldn't choose a day like this to come and get us. 35 years later and storms still bring a sense of relief in me!!! I did get over it as months went by and it was never an issue again.

I think the anxieties your SD is facing should be the priority and then once, she opens up about them and reassurance can be provided, the overnight can start again with her own willingness to do them. She wil feel a urge sense of relief and pride when she feels ok about it, and she will not forget that it is her dad who got her through it.

plumpmouse

Marisco wrote: »

IMO she's old enough now, has anyone asked the child what she wants? .

I agree. The point I was trying to clumsily make was she isn't being allowed now but one day she will.

Lieja

Lots of things to respond to - sorry if I miss anything out!

Duchy - while I'm posting in the hope of hearing some differing opinions, I feel as though you're either failing to understand or not reading properly. SD is 8, not 6. It isn't long until she's 9. OH has tried to talk calmly to his ex on plenty of occasions, but she won't have any of it. He doesn't do shouting and screaming, and is very capable of having a proper grown up discussion and he's more than willing to compromise and see things from other perspectives. He is not some 'angry dad' that wants things his own way for a few days a week, and for mum to do all the boring parent bits when it isn't 'his day'.

In terms of his ex having the 'right' to dictate how things happen while SD's in his care - of course she doesn't have the 'right' and he has parental responsibility, but the reality is that if he allows me to look after her or drop her home, ex will not allow her to come back. If I turn up to pick her up, she wouldn't allow SD to come with me. Having been through the court process once and not seeing SD for 6 months, he's not willing to allow this to happen again so he doesn't have much choice but to give in to her demands.

OH has discussed the issue with SD, but she's entirely of the mindset that what mum says goes, and if mum doesn't think she should be able to sleep alone then she shouldn't.

There has been no pressure at all on her about the school trip, she just mentioned it a couple of weeks ago and said she wasn't going. OH told her some stories about trips and sleepovers he had as a child to try to get her to see what fun they could be, but at no point did he say she should be going. Just that it will be a lot of fun to spend the night with her friends instead of adults. The sad thing is that she does seem to want to grow up and do these things, and during a proper discussion will admit that she wants to be more grown up, but it's too easy to be the baby. She's actually written on her Christmas list that she wants to stop being scared during the night!

Silvercar - the contact order is for one afternoon and one overnight a week, made years before OH had to work that night. He changed jobs (no choice about this) and for the first few months had to work on his night with SD. He asked ex whether he could change nights or have me look after her (he goes to work after she's already asleep) but the answer to both was no. He now no longer works that night, but obviously the damage has been done.

As for ex getting her own way - yes she does, and he's challenged her numerous times but the fact is that if he doesn't agree then he doesn't see SD.

I think keeping calm and patience is the answer, but obviously it's hard for OH to accept that he's so totally uninvolved with parenting his child. He isn't involved in any parenting decisions, and SD often challenges his decisions when she's here with 'I don't have to do that because mum doesn't make me' or 'I can't do that, mum won't let me'. I really don't see a solution to any of this other than wait for his ex to get over whatever it is she's got an issue with, and I really don't see that happening at all.

Thanks everyone