EE/Orange/T-Mobile - Reclaim ALL price rises AND cancel contract re T&C change - 2

ulaggy

I forwarded my email from Mr Howell to your website email address earlier just in case you wanted a copy!

RandomCurve

I have created an EXCEL version of the CISAS case - it is available from the Fight Mobile Increases Website. It is much easier to use than the WORD document as the editing is "automatic"


http://fightmobileincreases.com/fight-ee/complete-camapaign-against-ee/

RandomCurve

grumbler wrote: »

The title of the thread makes no sense whatsoever. Introduction to what?!

Thanks - I changed the title of my first post - never noticed that changes the Thread title too!
You live - You learn!

Irreverent

I'm a bit lost off now - I'm at the stage where CISAS had accepted my case and then emailed me to say that they've changed their mind and now can't accept it. Am I sending off these emails from the previous thread (post 361 I think), or am I awaiting further developments?

Thanks

ulaggy

Irreverent wrote: »

I'm a bit lost off now - I'm at the stage where CISAS had accepted my case and then emailed me to say that they've changed their mind and now can't accept it. Am I sending off these emails from the previous thread (post 361 I think), or am I awaiting further developments?

Thanks

You've got 2 options at this stage - either you wait and see what develops, which I believe most of the folk here are doing, or you go to Small Claims Court. That's what I'm doing. My letter before action was posted Friday!

Mikmonken

Irreverent wrote: »

I'm a bit lost off now - I'm at the stage where CISAS had accepted my case and then emailed me to say that they've changed their mind and now can't accept it. Am I sending off these emails from the previous thread (post 361 I think), or am I awaiting further developments?

Thanks

we should hear in a day or two weather OFCOM are going to intervene, to those of us who have had the claim rejected under rule 2b.

this may force our hand somewhat, if OFCOM tell CISAS they have to accept the claim, hopefully all of ours will go straight to an adjudicator. If not in all likelihood it'll be the SCC route.

it would be worth at least sending an email to CISAS requesting a full breakdown as to why the claim has been rejected, and also drop OFCOM and email too as the more people who email, the more pressure they come under to review.

it only took 15 complaints for OFCOM to consider looking into cheating of bake off so the more people that complain the more of a chance we have of us getting a positive outcome.

Mikmonken

Email to CISAS copying in OFCOM along the lines of... taken from Barrowvian post in the old thread

CISAS,

Please explain how rule 2 b is relevant when the new claim is in regards to:
Price increases applied under the Pre March 2014 price variation clause AND
The change in T&Cs effective March 2014,

Whilst the original claim related to;
The price increase applied under the new Post March 2014 price variation clause
As per CISAS rule regarding transparency, please also provide copies of all correspondence and transcripts of all meetings/telephone calls between CISAS and EE. CISAS rules are clear that both sides see all materials in relation to the case.

As EE have been given the opportunity to object to the decision to handle this case, I would now like to take the opportunity to object to CISAS as I feel you have not properly understood the basis of the claim. Claim one related to 'PRICE RISES' and claim two related to 'TERMS AND CONDITIONS CHANGES'. Please explain how these are the same thing. I require a full written response detailing your decision and reasoning.

Regards,

XXX

Mikmonken

Email to OFCOM pressuring them to look at the case

Email to Ofcom/CISAS/EE/Media/Olaf
OCCtelecoms@ofcom.org.uk;
Lynn.Parker@ofcom.org.uk
graham.howell@ofcom.org.uk
Ed.Richards@ofcom.org.uk
info@cisas.org.uk
olaf.swantee@ee.co.uk
Edwin.lane@bbc.co.uk
joel.taylor@ukmetro.co.uk
your.problems@observer.co.uk




Dear Ofcom


Ofcom Ref 1-257538305


Thank you for your email of 11-9-14 in response to my email of 6-9-14.


I think Ofcom have missed the point of my email (as you initially did in May 2013 when EE interfered with CISAS due process in regards to their March 2013 price increase, and again in July when the OS refused to accept cases in regards to the Vodafone out of bundle price increases).


I am not asking Ofcom to “review an individual compliant”, As you have correctly identified this is the role of the ADR scheme, You also correctly state that “The Communications Act REQUIRES that individual complaints are dealt with by either of the approved schemes”, and this is what my email to Ofcom is in relation to.


There is a body of consumers who want CISAS to review if:



The EE change in T&Cs, and
All prices rises prior to May 2014 (under the OLD I,e the old price variation clause) are compatible with:


The UTCCRs
General Conditions of Entitlement
EEs contract
The Consumer Protection from Unfair Trading Regulations.

As all of the above fall within the remit of the ADR process – then under the Communications Act that you reference the ADR must accept the cases.

CISAS initially accepted cases in relation to the above – including those from consumers who had previously submitted CISAS cases (and lost) in relation to EEs price increase of May 2014 under its NEW price variation clause. Following SECRET negotiations between CISAS and EE CISAS are now claiming that they cannot accept the cases as follows:

“Further to our previous correspondence in relation to your application to CISAS, we write to advise that we are unable to accept your application.

In accordance with Rule 2 b) of the CISAS Rules, the scheme cannot be used to settle disputes that are the subject of a previous valid application made under the Scheme.”

It is obvious from even the most basic review of the basis of the claims that the new claim is NOT “…to settle disputes that are the subject of a previous valid application made under the Scheme”

Under Section 54 of the Communications Act Ofcom can only approve ADR schemes which:



Approval of dispute procedures for the purposes of s. 52E+W+S+N.I.


(1)Before giving their approval to any dispute procedures, OFCOM must consult the Secretary of State.


(2)OFCOM are not to approve dispute procedures unless they are satisfied that the arrangements under which the procedures have effect—


(a)are administered by person who is for practical purposes independent (so far as decisions in relation to disputes are concerned) of both OFCOM and the communications providers to whom the arrangements apply;


(b)give effect to procedures that are easy to use, transparent and effective;


(c)give, in the case of every communications provider to whom the arrangements apply, a right to each of his domestic and small business customers to use the procedures free of charge;


(d)ensure that all information necessary for giving effect to the procedures is obtained;


(e)ensure that disputes are effectively investigated;


(f)include provision conferring power to make awards of appropriate compensation; and


(g)are such as to enable awards of compensation to be properly enforced.




The secret negotiations between EE and CISAS are clearly in breach of:


S 54 (2)a, - as it impinges on CISAS’s independence;
S 54 )(2)b - as secret negotiations are NOT transparent
S54 (2)c - as they have denied the consumers right to use the procedure free of charge on a matter that clearly falls within the ADR remit
S54 (2)e – as even the most basic of reviews would have noted that earlier cases are in connection with entirely different matters. Additionally as CISAS have not sought he consumers view on EEs assertions then CISAS could not have effectively investigated.



(As an aside in previous cases when customers have won compensation and EE and have been very slow to comply CISAS have said that they do not have any enforcement powers – if this is the case then Ofcom have failed to set up an ADR scheme in accordance with The Communications Act S52 and S54(2)g – and I would appreciate your comments on the enforcement powers that ADRs have).

I trust that Ofcom now understands the situation is about compliance with the Communications Act and that Ofcom (as in previous instances of this nature) will contact CISAS and remind it of its obligations under the Communications Act as if those obligations are not adhered to by CISAS then Ofcom has failed to fulfil its statutory duties under that Communications Act S52

I also request that Ofcom remind EE and CISAS that the ADR process must not only be independent, but must be SEEN TO BE INDEPENDENT. Therefore EE should not be allowed to approach CISAS once CISAS have accepted cases (which they have) other than to submit a defence. Once the adjudicator is appointed then the adjudicator determines if they are able to accept the case or not.- and gives the reasons for their decision. This is as per the Communications Act and CISAS own rules.



Regards

alansmith7

has anyone been paid out by ee?

Mikmonken

alansmith7 wrote: »

has anyone been paid out by ee?

Not in this thread, but there are 2 others dotted around (cancelling for different reasons, and success rates for those including payouts is 80% plus.