How would the UK fare without Scotland?

Generali

Shakethedisease wrote: »

Ooooh let me think... oh yes. The Scottish Government has only been in existence for the last 15 years and in that time.. has had absolutely no say whatsoever on EU issues concerning Scotland or anything vaguely connected with it. Even when it directly affects Scottish businesses, agriculture or fishing. Or the economies that surround them.

So no I haven't had the chance to carefully check anything that has never actually ever been in existence...

Mabye it's time we had a stab at it ?

Scotland would no more be consulted than any other part of the UK. It's no different to England or Anglesea in that respect.

CLAPTON

Shakethedisease wrote: »

Ooooh let me think... oh yes. The Scottish Government has only been in existence for the last 15 years and in that time.. has had absolutely no say whatsoever on EU issues concerning Scotland or anything vaguely connected with it. Even when it directly affects Scottish businesses, agriculture or fishing. Or the economies that surround them.

So no I haven't had the chance to carefully check anything that has never actually ever been in existence...

Mabye it's time we had a stab at it ?

one of your many faux points is that Westminster doesn't represent the views of Scottish voters and how this justifies separation from the UK


my question was does EU represent those same Scottish voters : one wouldn't want to jump from the frying pan into the fire would one.


So it appears that you have no idea whether Scottish voters' views would be 'even' less represented in the EU council of minsters : but of course it doesn't matter because your sole objective is separation at any price using any ludicrous argument that comes to hand.




and of course no mention in my post of the Scottish government ; just another of your nonsense points

Shakethedisease

Generali wrote: »

Scotland would no more be consulted than any other part of the UK. It's no different to England or Anglesea in that respect.

Yes that's the point.

Shakethedisease

CLAPTON wrote: »

one of your many faux points is that Westminster doesn't represent the views of Scottish voters and how this justifies separation from the UK


my question was does EU represent those same Scottish voters : one wouldn't want to jump from the frying pan into the fire would one.


So it appears that you have no idea whether Scottish voters' views would be 'even' less represented in the EU council of minsters : but of course it doesn't matter because your sole objective is separation at any price using any ludicrous argument that comes to hand.




and of course no mention in my post of the Scottish government ; just another of your nonsense points

Scotland as a region is represented as part of the UK.. I don't really understand what you're trying to get at ?

Independence would mean far more representation for Scotland than at the present time where we return 6 MEP's.. the same as Malta, Cyprus and Luxembourg.

But of course that's only if we're in the EU at all.. Either as part of the UK or as an independent entity in the next few years.

And no, I don't think some area's of Scottish farming and fishing are completely over the moon so far with Westminster EU representation.

CLAPTON

Shakethedisease wrote: »

Scotland as a region is represented as part of the UK.. I don't really understand what you're trying to get at ?

Independence would mean far more representation for Scotland than at the present time where we return 6 MEP's.. the same as Malta, Cyprus and Luxembourg.

But of course that's only if we're in the EU at all.. Either as part of the UK or as an independent entity in the next few years.

And no, I don't think some area's of Scottish farming and fishing are completely over the moon so far with Westminster EU representation.

as I understand you, you feel the central UK government doesn't represent Scottish voters as e.g. Tories in power but few Scots vote for them.


so I just wondered whether you feel that over that same time frame, the 'central EU ' government better represented Scottish voters than central UK government.

Generali

Shakethedisease wrote: »

Scotland as a region is represented as part of the UK.. I don't really understand what you're trying to get at ?

Independence would mean far more representation for Scotland than at the present time where we return 6 MEP's.. the same as Malta, Cyprus and Luxembourg.

But of course that's only if we're in the EU at all.. Either as part of the UK or as an independent entity in the next few years.

And no, I don't think some area's of Scottish farming and fishing are completely over the moon so far with Westminster EU representation.

So at the moment Scotland has her views represented as part of the UK, one of the most powerful voices in Europe. In future you want Scotland to have the influence of Malta and Luxembourg!

I have my doubts as to whether that will deliver substantial gains to Scottish farmers or fishermen. :rotfl:

It's stuff like this that really gives the lie to the arguments for Yes. If you hate the English then fine, stomp off. If you really want the best for Scotland then stay in the Union.

zagubov

Generali wrote: »

So at the moment Scotland has her views represented as part of the UK, one of the most powerful voices in Europe. In future you want Scotland to have the influence of Malta and Luxembourg!

I have my doubts as to whether that will deliver substantial gains to Scottish farmers or fishermen. :rotfl:

It's stuff like this that really gives the lie to the arguments for Yes. If you hate the English then fine, stomp off. If you really want the best for Scotland then stay in the Union.

I don't know if Australia's been following the commonwealth games but it should be obvious that there's no anti-English feeling there.

What Scotland wants is devo-max. What it's told it'll get will be either independence or the current mess.

If it was that obvious that the Union was best for Scotland, I'd be surprised if the Yes camp had any following at all. The No side is taking far too much for granted and that's not too wise.

Generali

zagubov wrote: »

I don't know if Australia's been following the commonwealth games but it should be obvious that there's no anti-English feeling there.

What Scotland wants is devo-max. What it's told it'll get will be either independence or the current mess.

If it was that obvious that the Union was best for Scotland, I'd be surprised if the Yes camp had any following at all. The No side is taking far too much for granted and that's not too wise.

Scotland doesn't get whatever she wants any more than the rest of the UK.

Surrey probably fanicies keeping more of the tax raised there and the ability to set planning permission laws. Unfortunately it sits in a broader community.

Devo max smacks of wanting cake and eating it, rather like the SNP version of independence. Want NATO but no nukes, want a Government but no head of state, want the assets but not the liabilities.

zagubov

Generali wrote: »

Scotland doesn't get whatever she wants any more than the rest of the UK.

Surrey probably fanicies keeping more of the tax raised there and the ability to set planning permission laws. Unfortunately it sits in a broader community.

Devo max smacks of wanting cake and eating it, rather like the SNP version of independence. Want NATO but no nukes, want a Government but no head of state, want the assets but not the liabilities.

Unfortunately "having your cake and eating it" has become a meaningless phrase trotted out whenever it becomes clear that Scotland only wants to end the joint parliament.

It seems to imply that anything short of North Korea style isolation is somehow perverse, when in the modern world of international diplomacy, the reverse is true.

Shakethedisease

Generali wrote: »

So at the moment Scotland has her views represented as part of the UK, one of the most powerful voices in Europe. In future you want Scotland to have the influence of Malta and Luxembourg!

I have my doubts as to whether that will deliver substantial gains to Scottish farmers or fishermen. :rotfl:

It's stuff like this that really gives the lie to the arguments for Yes. If you hate the English then fine, stomp off. If you really want the best for Scotland then stay in the Union.

No at the current time Scotland only returns the same number of MEPS as Luxembourg.. With independence there will be more ? Are you drunk ? Where do you go from that to people voting Yes hating English people ?

Genuinely puzzled.. And probably says more about your mindset than mine to be honest. Why bring 'hate' into these things all the time.