Did the 999 responder act correctly? Very sensitive question

Noctu

BigJockKnew wrote: »

This is why the call handler insisted the man was pulled from the car, don't know about you but it seems obvious to me. The call handler did nothing wrong, I'm surprised the OP couldn't work it out on his own though.

Man poisons himself with co2 in confined space... he's discovered unresponsive in co2 filled confined space... best way to increase chances of survival is remove him from co2 filled confined space.

I can't believe the OP would leave out such a vital piece of information from the initial post.

Mm. When I did my first aid training with St John's Ambulance, we were told not to get involved in any situation where someone had gassed themself, or were injured/dying as a result of a gas leak.

This extended to the exam, where you get one or two scenarios (the injured is acted out by the examiner). In the exam, you walk into the room, the examiner tells you the context of the situation, and you do what is necessary and appropriate under your training. We were told very clearly, if the examiner says "you can smell gas", that in order to pass the exam you simply do the following: turn around, and close the door behind you.

I appreciate the situation of someone who has been gassed/gassed themselves in a car, rather than in a room, is different - however if the person had recently died and the gas was still in high concentrations within the car, the first aider could well be incapacitated themselves when reaching in to pull the body out. Especially if the victim was large, and it takes a lot of effort to get them out (necessitating big gasps of air whilst within the vehicle...)

Noctu

Also devout Muslims (and some other religions, perhaps Orthodox Jews but don't quote me on that one) cannot touch the opposite sex unless it is absolutely necessary to preserve life ('necessity preserves the forbidden', IIRC, from the Koran). If that person had a well-reasoned belief, like your parents did, that the person (if they were the opposite sex) inside the car was dead, s/he would not touch that person as it would be futile, not preserving life, and indeed forbidden under their religion.

Big_Tree

Noctu wrote: »

Mm. When I did my first aid training with St John's Ambulance, we were told not to get involved in any situation where someone had gassed themself, or were injured/dying as a result of a gas leak.

This extended to the exam, where you get one or two scenarios (the injured is acted out by the examiner). In the exam, you walk into the room, the examiner tells you the context of the situation, and you do what is necessary and appropriate under your training. We were told very clearly, if the examiner says "you can smell gas", that in order to pass the exam you simply do the following: turn around, and close the door behind you.

I appreciate the situation of someone who has been gassed/gassed themselves in a car, rather than in a room, is different - however if the person had recently died and the gas was still in high concentrations within the car, the first aider could well be incapacitated themselves when reaching in to pull the body out. Especially if the victim was large, and it takes a lot of effort to get them out (necessitating big gasps of air whilst within the vehicle...)

car exhaust fumes aren't combustible...

Janepig

BigJockKnew wrote: »

car exhaust fumes aren't combustible...

I don't think the problem is that the fumes are combustible, it's that they are noxious and also possibly unknown (as in my earlier post). It's the act of breathing the fumes in that will cause the "rescuer" harm, not whether they'll explode or not - although again, in my earlier post it would appear that whatever gas the lady discharged in her car, whether she was inhaling it or not, was highly combustible, enough to blow open the doors of her car and boot, crack the windows and shred the clothes she was wearing.

Jx

topdaddy_2

BigJockKnew wrote: »

This is why the call handler insisted the man was pulled from the car, don't know about you but it seems obvious to me. The call handler did nothing wrong, I'm surprised the OP couldn't work it out on his own though.

Man poisons himself with co2 in confined space... he's discovered unresponsive in co2 filled confined space... best way to increase chances of survival is remove him from co2 filled confined space.

I can't believe the OP would leave out such a vital piece of information from the initial post.

Man in car dead cos gas. Rescuer leans into car to physically exert themselves pulling dead body out. Breathes fumes. Passes out. Now the number of casualties has doubled and there is now no one giving care or up dates. Simple enough.

Big_Tree

topdaddy wrote: »

Man in car dead cos gas. Rescuer leans into car to physically exert themselves pulling dead body out. Breathes fumes. Passes out. Now the number of casualties has doubled and there is now no one giving care or up dates. Simple enough.

Instantaneous death by carbon-monoxide poisoning? :rotfl::rotfl::rotfl:

at the very minimum it would take 5 minutes inside the car with all doors closed to pass out, with one of the doors open ventilating the car maybe 20 minutes.

you're good for a laugh topdaddy I'll say that.

If exhaust fumes were that deadly there would be people passing out every time they walked past a lorry or bus stuck in traffic.

:rotfl:

topdaddy_2

BigJockKnew wrote: »

Instantaneous death by carbon-monoxide poisoning? :rotfl::rotfl::rotfl:

at the very minimum it would take 5 minutes inside the car with all doors closed to pass out, with one of the doors open ventilating the car maybe 20 minutes.

you're good for a laugh topdaddy I'll say that.

If exhaust fumes were that deadly there would be people passing out every time they walked past a lorry or bus stuck in traffic.

:rotfl:

If you can prove that at a scene of an emergency you can have it. If not its an unnacceptabke risk. I have some gas alarms you can rent if you like. Bloke dies, would be rescuer does nothing, situation has not worsened. Or theres the alternative...

Yorkie1

BigJockKnew wrote: »

Instantaneous death by carbon-monoxide poisoning? :rotfl::rotfl::rotfl:

at the very minimum it would take 5 minutes inside the car with all doors closed to pass out, with one of the doors open ventilating the car maybe 20 minutes.

you're good for a laugh topdaddy I'll say that.

If exhaust fumes were that deadly there would be people passing out every time they walked past a lorry or bus stuck in traffic.

:rotfl:

I hardly feel that this thread is the right place to be pouring scorn on, and laughing at, someone else - do you?

topdaddy_2

Yorkie1 wrote: »

I hardly feel that this thread is the right place to be pouring scorn on, and laughing at, someone else - do you?

Miss placed scorn at that. No one said death-just passing out. Which is entirely posssible;)

savingmummy

Your poor parents I hope they have been offered support if they need it.


Regarding the call I have no idea why they would ask UNLESS they felt he may have been just unconscious.
This question could be answered by a support worker, they are trained to help people who have helped in these sensitive situations.