3rd degree, what do I do now? [Considering Appeal]

studentphil

In a way what clothes a person wears are of least importance to if they are good at their job, so why should nice clothes get you promoted?

[Deleted User]

brazilianwax wrote: »

Fast stream is a completely different kettle of fish, and people already in the service but without a degree can absolutely apply (and do).

Yep good point you dont actually need a degree you just need to be at degree level this can be gained from experience.

I didnt really mean that a grad does 95% of the work of a non-grad it just felt that way in my last post as the whole department was held up by three people and the main person was indeed a non grad, but a trained eng tech that was actually fairly new to the org but had the drive to get the job done. Just trying to get a point across that you can get promoted on merit (or in the case of the muppets because no body else applied for that job on that particular day). External recruitment is a last resort for the org and very difficult to initiate and thus 98% of jobs are for inhouse people only, I guess thats were the main fault lies. Plus probably not as competitive in terms of starting salary, you need to be in a while to work up the pay boundarys.

brazilianwax

studentphil wrote: »

In a way what clothes a person wears are of least importance to if they are good at their job, so why should nice clothes get you promoted?

They don't. The nature of our place means that when Parliament is sitting, everyone must be smart. During recess, civvies is fine.

I would want people to make an effort for interview- if they turn up in scruffs I won't be impressed. I just want clean and smart, not designer frills though.

brazilianwax

Yant1 wrote: »

Yep good point you dont actually need a degree you just need to be at degree level this can be gained from experience.

I didnt really mean that a grad does 95% of the work of a non-grad it just felt that way in my last post as the whole department was held up by three people and the main person was indeed a non grad, but a trained eng tech that was actually fairly new to the org but had the drive to get the job done. Just trying to get a point across that you can get promoted on merit (or in the case of the muppets because no body else applied for that job on that particular day). External recruitment is a last resort for the org and very difficult to initiate and thus 98% of jobs are for inhouse people only, I guess thats were the main fault lies. Plus probably not as competitive in terms of starting salary, you need to be in a while to work up the pay boundarys.

Managers here can't recruit or promote if candidates don't meet the grade. We run the process again if the candidates are muppets!!! More work for me up front, but less in the long run when they inevitably break things :rolleyes:

(and you meant 'boundaries', didn't you?! )

[Deleted User]

studentphil wrote: »

Yant1, if you hate the civil service so much why do you still work there? I accept that everywhere will have people you do not get on with,but you just seem to detest it. If you thought the civil service was bad and you worked there to help improve it and make it better then I could undestand why stay, but at the moment you might be happier if you left.

LOL would i be recommending it if I hate it? Just hate the attitude of some of the people that work in it. I spent a bit of time looking around at the different sectors and moved into a more appropriate sector (another good thing completely diverse array of jobs all over the country). This place is a lot more proffesional and the work is split equally amongst a very small team who are all equally capable rather then a load of people sitting around playing cards while all the responsibility was on you, you couldnt delegate anything as "it wasnt there job" or "they couldnt do it" and there LMs came under different sectors who equally couldnt be ar**d. It is more important for me to be in a stressfree job with my heart condition and asthma. Working in a city for a bank or insurance company with a load of back stabbers might get me 100K a year but id be dead by 45 LOL.

Im good at maths brazillian not english, give me some linear algebra or second differentials

studentphil

Yant, so what are your top tips for getting a civil service job where you can have a promotion fairly often and life is dead easy?

[Deleted User]

Just get in at the bottom and spend time working through the place you soon find out whats good and whats bad. It generally comes down to what your personal preferance is. As for promotion the easiest way is to simply keep applying, they dont hold it against you and they cant keep you in post if you get promoted. I have always got the jobs i want, I find out what i want to do then i get the knowledge to do the interview then when im in i learn to do the job. There is one guy I know that simply carpet bomb applyed and got through several grades quickly and is one grade above me with a 2.2 history degree and younger then me. But im not too bothered as I like the current job want want to stay in it a while, my salary is good enough for me. I effectively earn more money then him anyway, not because i earn more money but because im wiser with it.

melancholly

studentphil wrote: »

Yant, so what are your top tips for getting a civil service job where you can have a promotion fairly often and life is dead easy?

if you think a 'good job' is all about something being easy with promotion for doing nothing, you'll be in a tough reality check!

how about picking something you want to do, rather than picking something to (try to) impress people.....

dellfanatic

WOW hasn't this thread blossomed :rotfl: :T 3 pages, thanks for all your replies, our power went out last night so wasn't able to get here sooner! :beer: I've gone though and replied to points made, if I quote all the messages the page will be far too long Each time I click a thanks button, I'm thrown to the top of a page, I will thank you all eventually! :wall:

Firstly, the viva: as there are so few of us in the year group, all of us were interviewed by the external examiner, well all of us who had the courtesy to turn up. And as I've just found out, it isn't a viva, in that the examiner can't alter individual marks or the overall result. So what was the point I hear you ask! :rotfl:

Phil I see your point with the academics, the head of dept got a staright 1st at uni, lived at home for his BSc, PhD and subsequent career at his home uni, so has no idea what it's like to be away from family, having to cook clean and do everything yourself, he can not relate to students. Also regarding your 2:1 point, some people were able to spot trends in exam papers or pick up hints from lecturers as to what may come up, I wasn't like that, I just had problems when at uni but that's over and I'm going to look forward now.

If I have any regrets, it's not researching into how each university allocates marks. For example, birmingham weights 40% of each module mark to coursework and the remaining 60% to exams, whereas here it's 25:75. That would have served me well, considering my coursework marks in hindsight.

It's a good point stated many times that employers (obviously) are looking for people able to do the job, so getting the right experience is going to be a priority for me now. Also rightly said is that science jobs are not as in demand by applicants as other fields. My dilemna is that I'm torn between going to do a Masters or just getting a job soon. On the plus for applying for MRes, I've been promised what I can only describe as a very positive reference. On the negative, it requires fees of £3000 (though as it's research I'm not sure about this). To sandwich that with another positive, an MRes is a valuable qualification to have and demonstrates a higher ability to think and investigate in a research capacity.

For a PhD (research, obviously) the students are paid a stipend of around 12k, so for MRes I would think as I'm doing research work for the university as opposed to being taught (which obviously warrants payment of fees) the fees wouldn't be so high. I'm not trying to divert attention from this thread but as it's now 3 pages long, I may start a new one about funding for an MRes but by no means have I decided against going into the job market straight away.

On that subject, I actually picked up a tesco application form... ouch! They have a strange questionairre on it, some kind of psychometric testing I think! Though for now my priority is looking into Masters courses and also testing out the job market as advised by many here... time to update my CV I think!

BigBouncyBall

lol i've been doing my CV yesterday. Not easy!

https://www.findamasters.com

might help you find something suitable. good luck!