Fine on hospital property, given to staff

Scigal_2

Hi all,

Sorry I havent responded this afternoon, been working away from a comp.

Is that email I drafted for the Rk to send to HMRC ok? Should we go ahead and send that?

Thanks, I really do appreciate all your help!

I have tried looking at the parking signs around the grounds, cor they are super tiny to read. And I still cannot establish a name of the company, I think it must be the Trust who runs it all. I tried to take a pic of one sign its was really quite aggressive in its threats.

And where the car was parked on the event day, I cannot see any No Parking signs, I will look more closely on my way home tonight.


And I cant provide emails to the parking office, but I dont have anything. So couldnt get a 'sorry for the over sight' from them.

From the Trust policy

Enforcement of the Policy and associated procedures
61. On weekdays there are not enough spaces to allow all who wish to drive to work, to park
safely and lawfully. Good control of parking is therefore essential to maximise availability
of spaces and prevent unauthorised use.
62. Enforcement is accorded a high priority and is required also to meet the requirements of the
Planning Authority (Z City Council) and the emergency services. Physical controls
and signs – permanent or temporary - are in place to prevent unauthorised parking, keep
roadways clear and eliminate obstructive parking.
63. Unauthorised parking includes:
63.1. Parking on yellow lines; hatched areas and areas signed “no waiting”.
63.2. Failure to park in a marked space or parking in a designated area without the appropriate
permit or ticket.
63.3. Failure to display a valid permit (i.e. that is in date and covers the vehicle concerned) or a
valid pay and display ticket or other authorisation
63.4. Parking in a manner which causes obstruction to fire roads, fire exits, roadways, footways,
cycleways, car park accesses, or block in other vehicles
63.5. Parking during periods such as weekends or holidays which are not the holders working
hours (in exceptional circumstances such parking may be allowed at the discretion of the Car
Parking Manager).
64. Signs identify clearly the restrictions of each car parking area and the penalties for failure
to comply with restrictions. Details of the sanctions, which may vary during the currency
of this Policy are available from the Car Parking Office and on the Intranet.
65. Breach of Contract Notices (BCNs) will be placed on vehicles parked in contravention of
the Policy and procedures. The charge is £50, or £25 is paid within 14 days of issue. See
procedure notes set out in Appendix 4.

The Trust’s parking policies set out above must be adhered to.
The Penalty Charge or Breach of Contract (BCN) system. This arrangement replaces wheel claming as
the method of deterring parking behaviour that contravenes the Trust’s Car Parking Policies. In
accordance with the Trust’s Car Parking Policies, cars that are not parked in an authorised area, or not
displaying a valid permit / ticket will receive a penalty charge notice, known legally as a “Breach of
Contract” (PCN or BCN). It will be implemented first at the X in October 2005, then be rolled out to
the other two retained sites by the end of 2006.
The charge for Breach of Contract is £50, which is reduced to £25 if paid within 14 days. Should the
charge remain unpaid it may lead to action that would result in County Court proceedings and if
judgement is obtained as a result it will affect the driver’s credit rating will be affected.

I cant see anything about appeals etc

Stroma

Trebor16 wrote: »

Ask your manager to provide you with details of the trust policy on parking and how it would be a discipline matter if you refuse to pay for a speculative invoice from the parking company. Given that you are paying for your permit I don't see how you could be breaching any trust policy, and they certainly have no legal powers to insist you pay a "fine" to a private company.

And on that, if the car is registered as they suggest as a permit is waiting to be collected, what the hell are they ticketing a car they know that the staff member has been paying for? Well we know its all about the unlawful penalty, but how can the trust explain that?

Scigal_2

How do I appeal against a Breach of Contract Notice issued to me?

Appeals must be made via Trethowans Solicitors, whose address can be found at the foot of the notice issued to you. Alternatively your appeal can be submitted on-line: trethowans. Please note that Trust staff cannot discuss your Breach of Contract Notice with you.

Trebor16

Scigal wrote: »

How do I appeal against a Breach of Contract Notice issued to me?

Appeals must be made via Trethowans Solicitors, whose address can be found at the foot of the notice issued to you. Alternatively your appeal can be submitted on-line: trethowans. Please note that Trust staff cannot discuss your Breach of Contract Notice with you.

If Trust staff cannot discuss the alleged breach of contract then how can it be a discipline matter? The figure of £50 for the breach of contract - I wonder if that is a genuine pre estimate of loss? You are paying for a permit so what exactly have they lost?

Coupon-mad

Is that email I drafted for the Rk to send to HMRC ok? Should we go ahead and send that?

Do you mean the DVLA one? Yep, send it.

Stroma

And they are admitting they are issuing penalties , really they cannot win a case where they say they issue a penalty as that is a claim of authority that they do not possess. And that parking policy, is it a public document or one from your staff handbook or similar?

zzzLazyDaisy

DCodd wrote: »

zzzLazyDaisy picking your brains here but, if the employer has the contractual right to impose such a "fine" then would it not be usual for them to also have the contractual right to deduct such amounts owed from the employees wages?

Seeing as they do not seem to be going down this route suggests that the HR / Wages dept don't believe that the OP (or any employee) would be liable enough to risk an unlawful deduction from wages claim?

I am not suggesting that they have a contractual right to impose such a 'fine' in fact I doubt very much that is the case.

But it may well be that the trust has not needed to go to dvla for the name and address of the RK because they already have it on file

It also will certainly be that OP has signed up to *certain* terms and conditions as part of the permit/parking scheme.

What I am saying is simply this - OP needs to ascertain what exactly the trusts policy says, and what exactly he signed up to. If for no other reason than that it may well be the case that there is something in the policy that may help - normally employers are after repeat offenders - people who persistently abuse the car park without joining the permit scheme or paying the P&D.

But we can't guess - it is up to OP to ascertain - and it is an additional separate (but related) layer to the normal private paring charge issue.

Daisy

Stroma

zzzLazyDaisy wrote: »

I am not suggesting that they have a contractual right to impose such a 'fine' in fact I doubt very much that is the case.

But it may well be that the trust has not needed to go to dvla for the name and address of the RK because they already have it on file

It also will certainly be that OP has signed up to *certain* terms and conditions as part of the permit/parking scheme.

What I am saying is simply this - OP needs to ascertain what exactly the trusts policy says, and what exactly he signed up to. If for no other reason than that it may well be the case that there is something in the policy that may help - normally employers are after repeat offenders - people who persistently abuse the car park without joining the permit scheme or paying the P&D.

But we can't guess - it is up to OP to ascertain - and it is an additional separate (but related) layer to the normal private paring charge issue.

Daisy

Not yet because the OP has not picked up the permit despite paying for it

zzzLazyDaisy

Normally, the employee signs all relevant documentation and confirms acceptance of the policies when applying to join the scheme. The fact that he is already paying for the permit suggests that all the relevant paper work has been completed and he is already signed up to the scheme.

There may even be something in the paperwork about the Trusts own obligations - ie to supply the relevant permit. There may also be a procedure to follow if/when things go wrong.

We can only guess - OP needs to look at the documents.

Scigal_2

Thank you for your email regarding this matter. However your email does not provide me with enough information to allow a response regarding an organisations actions.

However, I can explain that DVLA takes very seriously its duty under the Data Protection Act to protect the privacy of the motorists whose details it holds on its record.

Regulation 27 of the Road Vehicles (Registration and Licensing) Regulations 2002 requires DVLA to release information from the vehicle register to the police, to local authorities for purposes associated with the investigation of an offence or decriminalised parking contravention, and to anyone who can demonstrate ‘reasonable cause’ to have it.

The need to contact individuals who may have failed to comply with the contractual conditions for parking on private land is considered, in most circumstances, to be a reasonable cause. Unauthorised parking on private land is a problem many landowners experience and providing them with information is necessary to allow them to enforce their rights to their property.

If you believe that your data has been released inappropriately by the DVLA, please clearly explain the circumstances and the company involved, including clarification whether or not your vehicle breached any parking restrictions at the site in question. The DVLA can then investigate this matter.

If you require any information from your vehicle record, this would involve the processing of your personal data, and as such the information is available to you under Section 7 of the Data Protection Act. This states that any individual is entitled to have communicated to them personal data we hold about them. The Agency is entitled to charge a fee for the provision of this data. If you wish to proceed with this, please send a cheque for £5 to DVLA Swansea and submit your request in writing (including your vehicle registration number) to...

Driver and Vehicle Record Enquiries
DVLA
Swansea
SA99 1AJ

Kind regards

David Dunford