Child using debit card online without permission

WTFH

zolablue25 wrote: »

Surely WTFH the system should be secure and no-one should be able to purchase without authority? Where was the security in this transaction?

Without knowing the exact details of the transaction it is hard to say 100%.
But let's say this (this is not an assumption, just an example of a possible scenario):

The Sony Entertainment Network account is registered to an account holder. That account holder must give a card (credit or debit) as part of the account - in the same way that smartphone online "stores" require them.
When the account is set up there is an initial validation of the card. After that, the card is linked to the account. No further authorisation is required.
In fact, there isn't even a requirement to have the card to make the purchases. If you're logged in to the account, you can make the purchases.

I've got an iPhone (don't judge me for that), and my iTunes account has my credit card details. I can make purchases from the App Store or iTunes and I don't need to verify the transactions, because it's already authorised. In fact, the only time I need to do anything is when I change my credit card - then I have to update the details. Otherwise, the information is already there and no additional security is required.

zagfles

tyllwyd wrote: »

But the card was used to authorise transactions to a Sony account registered at that address, so from that point of view there wouldn't have been anything to alert the bank that it was being used fraudulently - it must be completely standard for a parent's card to be used to make purchases for a child's account. A cleaner isn't likely to make a PlayStation purchase linked to the card holder's address. So in principle it might be the same, but in reality it is going to be much more difficult to argue.

Yes it may be more difficult to argue, but the fact remains that in the circumstances described by the OP, the OP is not liable and the bank must refund.

Now of course the bank may argue that the OP is lying and did in fact authorise the child to use the card, in which case the OP could take it to the FOS and they'll weigh up the evidence.

chattychappy

zagfiles knows what (s)he's talking about.

Just as an aside, on the point of gross negligence, as zagfiles said, (and since this is a CC forum) if this had been a credit card and the OP had been grossly negligent then still the CC would be liable. In the case of a debit card, I believe this still applies if the card is used as a credit token - ie the account is overdrawn and the transaction increases the overdraft.

I mention this for completeness only as I don't think the OP was grossly negligent anyway.

(And for pedantic completeness, if someone is running a positive balance on a CC and is grossly negligent, then the CC might escape liability for the unauthorised transaction.)

thriftychap_2

I would question the respect the child has for his parents. Sell console, TV and other possessions to the value owed. Ground son for a few weeks, give him extra jobs.

A parents job is to ensure their children are ready to enter society as well balanced individuals able to contribute positively to society. The son needs to learn that there are consequences to his actions.

I couldn't care less if a bank is liable or not. The real issue here is the sons blatant disregard for his parents. If this is not an isolated incident I would march my son down to the nearest police station for a good old scare!

Typical, parents trying to blame others for a child's poor behaviour. Maybe some reflection is needed by OP!

JasG

I am currently waiting a reply for 'a supervisors call' from Sony which has to be booked. When that has happened I will feedback. The one snippet that I did gain from the gent on the support line was that 'It's not common for this to happen but it's not rare either'

As for the feedback on our parenting skills, well I'll just have to take that. Up to now we have not had anything like this happen to us by either of our kids and me and his Mum are extremely disappointed in him, believe me it has been a shock. I don't think I would ever claim to be the perfect parent.

The period he used the card was during the half term school holidays so yes he was unsupervised as we were both out working. Neither of us have (foolishly) got to know how Play Station works and we assumed that we bought the games or he did, loaded them up and played them, as in the two years he has had it that has been what has happened. The transactions that he pilfered from my wife's card are the first online transactions that have been made since he has had it, we simply did not realise that you could use it like an online shop.

As for the card details he just put what details are available on the card and hey presto the money was gone.....as simple as that.

I am not holding a great deal of hope of recovering anything from this as having now read Sony's T&Cs as pointed out once the transaction is made that is it. No returns. As unlike buying from the shop there is nothing physical to return when it is digital data.

So how does it feel, well not great, I am left with serious concerns about our Son though it is easy to assume he has been let run feral, that is not the case. Punishment that is on going and will be for quite sometime. I also don't believe I have been trying to blame others for our son's poor behaviour, merely trying to recover something from frankly a mess. (Financially alone it is well over a quarter of my wife's take home wage for the month).

If you have some constructive to say please do as I am making him read what has been said, or if you simply wish to dish some flak ..... well that's your right it's a free country.

Regards

earthstorm

punishment

1) take his Playstation away from him for a period.
2) take his mobile phone off him (i dare say this will hurt him)

JasG

earthstorm wrote: »

punishment

1) take his Playstation away from him for a period.
2) take his mobile phone off him (i dare say this will hurt him)

Already done.... but thanks anyways.

JasG

As for the Sony call that I said I would feedback on, it didn't happen so I will call them tomorrow.

Regards

JasG

*Scarlett wrote: »

Does your debit card have any sort of secure transaction thing set up? I know that if I use my card on line I usually have to enter a security password. If not this is not going to help you now but might be useful for the future.

Can any of the items be returned? Sony may be more inclined to a refund if you can return items (intact).
.

He took the card and used what info was available on the card and that was accepted.

Nothing to return as I suppose the best way to describe it is your paying for data

Regards

JasG

zolablue25 wrote: »

Surely WTFH the system should be secure and no-one should be able to purchase without authority? Where was the security in this transaction?

He took the card on the 18th Oct entered the details that are visible on the card ..... possibly saver if it was PAYPAL but I am not an expert, obviously.