Compensation for delayed flights Discussion Area

luci1838

Ian41
Following your suggestion the same number of flights left Barbados for London for the w/c 6/11/11 as for 13/11/11. Looking at it a different way: the Virgin website shows that one flight per day is scheduled to leave Barbados for London for the month of November. On 16/11/11 no flight left but on 17/11/11 two flights left instead of the usual one. I think all this points more to a delay of 24hrs rather than cancellation.

This was a Virgin flight only booking with payment taken by a travel agent. I have emailed a modified version of the letter you directed me to, to Virgin and I'll keep the forum updated on their response on here. It seems court is a better route for resolution rather than credit card.

Thanks again.

trolleyrun

Eng1sh Gent,

The reason your early Gatwick flight was cancelled was because there was not an aircraft in Edinburgh. The aircraft usually arrives in the late evening the night before, to do the early morning departure. Due to the storms, the evening flight was cancelled, as they couldn't fly safely. I don't know why other airlines flew their flights, maybe they like taking risks in such extreme weather?

I'm a bit confused as to your "upgrade" point, as BA only operate a single cabin on domestic flights. Why did they offer to "upgrade" you? Did they offer to "upgrade" you or did they offer something else?

Good luck with your claim. I hope it goes well for you.

richardw

trolleyrun wrote: »

The reason your early Gatwick flight was cancelled was because there was not an aircraft in Edinburgh. The aircraft usually arrives in the late evening the night before, to do the early morning departure. Due to the storms, the evening flight was cancelled, as they couldn't fly safely.

Do you think that is 'Extraordinary circumstances despite all reasonable measures'?

Eng1ish_Gent

trolleyrun wrote: »

Eng1sh Gent,

The reason your early Gatwick flight was cancelled was because there was not an aircraft in Edinburgh. The aircraft usually arrives in the late evening the night before, to do the early morning departure. Due to the storms, the evening flight was cancelled, as they couldn't fly safely. I don't know why other airlines flew their flights, maybe they like taking risks in such extreme weather?

I'm a bit confused as to your "upgrade" point, as BA only operate a single cabin on domestic flights. Why did they offer to "upgrade" you? Did they offer to "upgrade" you or did they offer something else?

Good luck with your claim. I hope it goes well for you.

Yes - the plane normally stays overnight in Edinburgh, but they knew that and could have booked me (and several hundred other people) on a different flight where the plane was going to be there. That early Gatwick flight was not my choice at all.

The upgrade really puzzled me too and I was simply told I needed to upgrade the ticket to change flights. I am sure this was wrong, but the BA staff were facing queues of hundreds of people and conflicting information coming from the BA Operations, so I chose not to press this further and let someone else try to resolve their predicament.

Thank you for your input. It is greatly appreciated.

Eng1ish_Gent

richardw wrote: »

Do you think that is 'Extraordinary circumstances despite all reasonable measures'?

Possibly, but checking people on to a flight which you know will not depart simply to manage the queues is not a good way of dealing with customers.

Eng1ish_Gent

ian41 wrote: »

The first flight was cancelled – forget a claim for compensation. However, Arts 8 and 9 of EC Reg 261/2004 still apply.

You should claim for the hotel, taxi to and from the hotel, reasonable food plus two phone calls. Receipts will be expected by the airline (These are your Art 9 expenses).

Following the cancellation, Art 8 requires BA to offer you a choice as follows

Article 8
Right to reimbursement or re-routing

1. Where reference is made to this Article, passengers shall be offered the choice between:

(a) - reimbursement within seven days, by the means provided for in Article 7(3), of the full cost of the ticket at the price at which it was bought, for the part or parts of the journey not made, and for the part or parts already made if the flight is no longer serving any purpose in relation to the passenger's original travel plan, together with, when relevant,
- a return flight to the first point of departure, at the earliest opportunity;

(b) re-routing, under comparable transport conditions, to their final destination at the earliest opportunity; or

(c) re-routing, under comparable transport conditions, to their final destination at a later date at the passenger's convenience, subject to availability of seats.

2. Paragraph 1(a) shall also apply to passengers whose flights form part of a package, except for the right to reimbursement where such right arises under Directive 90/314/EEC.

3. When, in the case where a town, city or region is served by several airports, an operating air carrier offers a passenger a flight to an airport alternative to that for which the booking was made, the operating air carrier shall bear the cost of transferring the passenger from that alternative airport either to that for which the booking was made, or to another close-by destination agreed with the passenger.

You accepted (by default) option 8.1(b) a re-routing at the earliest opportunity rather than a refund of your BA air ticket for the sector EDI/LHR.

BA booked you on the flight the next morning which was cancelled. I believe that you should claim Euro 250 for this on the grounds that BA decided as a commercial decision which flights would operate that morning. (Expect a battle but you should win if you are prepared to fight).

Art 8 applies again. Now it is a question of whether a refund of the EDI/LHR sector is likely to put more money in your pocket than the cost of the train to London, taxi from the airport to Waverley. As BA were not able to offer you a flight that day, I would argue the case either way – depending on which is most beneficial to you. BA could not argue against repaying your train and taxi cost but if you claim this, you cannot claim a refund on your unused flight ticket – it’s an either/or situation.

I always recommend that irrelevant and emotional stuff should be omitted from letters to an airline. However, you should repeat that final para in your letter. It is absolutely disgraceful and may in itself, persuade BA to pay up without further fuss.

If everything is clear, you could prepare a draft letter and post here for comments if you wish. If you have queries, just post back.

THANK YOU VERY MUCH!

I had sort of got to the same conclusion, but with no degree of certainty. I'll write the letter and post it here for comments - then send it to BA at the end of the week....recorded delivery!

ian41

luci1838 wrote: »

Ian41
Following your suggestion the same number of flights left Barbados for London for the w/c 6/11/11 as for 13/11/11. Looking at it a different way: the Virgin website shows that one flight per day is scheduled to leave Barbados for London for the month of November. On 16/11/11 no flight left but on 17/11/11 two flights left instead of the usual one. I think all this points more to a delay of 24hrs rather than cancellation.

This was a Virgin flight only booking with payment taken by a travel agent. I have emailed a modified version of the letter you directed me to, to Virgin and I'll keep the forum updated on their response on here. It seems court is a better route for resolution rather than credit card.

Thanks again.

Re para 1 - yes it is a delayed flight.

Re para 2 - pleased my letter helped you

Re your final sentence. Yes it is but please remember, only once a positive ECJ ruling has been handed down and assuming that Virgin's defence does not persuade you otherwise.

ian41

richardw wrote: »

Do you think that is 'Extraordinary circumstances despite all reasonable measures'?

Eng1ish_Gent wrote: »

Possibly, but checking people on to a flight which you know will not depart simply to manage the queues is not a good way of dealing with customers.

I didn't take trolleyrun's post to be a comment on "e.c" but an explanation of where the aircraft would be parked overnight in a normal situation.

I would suggest that once there is a problem of storms, fog or bad weather and flights are cancelled, there is the consequential problem of aircraft and crews being in the wrong place when the weather improves. When this happens,(and it may be a coincidence or not) with BA UK short haul flights tend to be worse affected with cancellations than European flights, as the latter get priority. This is the crunch when flights to be operated/cancelled are decided i.e. we have x aircraft and y crew and commercial decisions are taken on which routes/flights to fly/cancel. This cannot be interpreted as an "e.c" defence.

On the other hand, if BA can prove that weather conditions in EDI were so poor that incoming aircraft could not land safely, then there is a possibility of an "e.c." defence. If it can be shown that other aircraft arrived safely at EDI and the airport remained open for landings, then that would weaken BA's possible defence.

In my view, Eng1ish_Gent should research this further on www.flightstats.co.uk

roverjim

roverjim wrote: »

Hi all! Got a bit of a dilemma with claiming back compensation for a cancelled flight at the end of August. I'm after two things really- if I've got a claim and, if so, what do I need to tell the airline to manage to claim!

I was due to fly from Brussels to Douala on 24th August with Brussels Airlines on flight SN365. I received a text at 6am on the morning of the flight (due to leave the house to go to Manchester at 7:30am) that my flight had been cancelled with no further instructions. I had to leave the house at the expected time anyway as their customer service line didn't open until 8am and as far as I knew I might need to stay in Brussels until I could travel on, but both of my flights were moved to the same times the following day (25th Aug) so it wasn't too bad.

The flight for the next day turned out to be a different flight number however; it changed from SN365 to SN1365. I have sent two e-mails and received two generic responses telling me that the flight was 'delayed' 24 hours due to unforseen circumstances. I have quoted the EU legislation with no joy.

Could anybody give me any advice? I've tried to say everything without writing an essay! I was in Cameroon to volunteer in an orphanage so it would be a great boost for them to receive the 600 Euro compensation (it was my host who was inconvenienced more than myself anyway).

Cheers,

Luke.

Hi all. I posted this a few weeks ago, can anybody help me get any further with my claim?

Cheers!

ian41

roverjim wrote: »

Hi all. I posted this a few weeks ago, can anybody help me get any further with my claim?

Cheers!

Don't wish to be unkind but you posted and then did not bother to logon again to check for any reply for weeks. Now you have not bothered to look through the posts for a reply.

I posted a very detailed reply to your post on 21 November (post # 1226) - some 23 days ago and one day after your original post.

I am happy to help but please be a little more aware when you do post asking for help, it is expected that you will do your bit and return to the forum and then read the posts.