Official MSE Economy 7 Guide discussion

E.ON_Company_Representative

Hi paulm_1974,

We don’t need to change the meter, we just add the two readings together.

Once your supply is live, get in contact with us and we’ll keep you on the same tariff, but we’ll just change it to a single rate.

I hope this helps.

Amy:)

Gaspers

I read somewher that Economy 7 meters have an MPAN number beginning 02. I've just moved to an all electric flat (no storage heaters) and the MPAN for the meter begins with 13 but has two readings rate 1 and rate 4, plus a total. Current tariff is standard with first utility but they cannot say if the meter can be used for (and don't offer) an E7 tariff. Can anyone shed any light?

dibdib99

Hi,

Economy 7 clock running slow?

I just thought you may be interested in my economy 7 times, and I would be interested if anyone has had the same symptom.

The bottom line is that our off peak time is not 7 hours every 24 hours, but 7:15 every 25:44.

We still get the same ratio of off peak to normal rate, but it drifts between 44 and 51 minutes per day. Sample times below.

This means that sometimes our off peak is midnight to 7:20 am, but sometimes 7:00 am to 2:15 pm!

It would appear that the timer in the clock is running about 4% low.

Has anyone else experienced this?

Meter: SPA02 + certification certificate dated 03/88
Timer: Sangamo Q346

A typical week's times showing drift and variation
Columns are:
date / economy start time/ economy end time/ economy duration/ economy start time period

Nov 10 07:12 14:28 07:16 24:44
Nov 11 07:59 15:14 07:15 24:47
Nov 12 08:47 16:01 07:14 24:48
Nov 13 09:29 16:45 07:16 24:42
Nov 14 10:18 17:34 07:16 24:49
Nov 15 11:06 18:22 07:16 24:48
Nov 16 11:49 19:04 07:15 24:43
Nov 17 12:37 19:53 07:16 24:48
Nov 18 13:26 20:41 07:15 24:49
Nov 19 14:10 21:26 07:16 24:44
Nov 20 14:58 22:14 07:16 24:48
Nov 21 15:45 23:03 07:18 24:47
Nov 22 16:31 23:47 07:16 24:46

Scrounger

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WWI4nzmofFE

Your Q-346 backup-battery is worn out (and loading the supply to the reference oscillator causing it to shift frequency) causing the clock to lose time.

So you can either live with it (and benefit from cheap power at unusual times) or report it to your electric suppler and have it changed.

Scrounger

dibdib99

Thanks Scrounger, and for being "especially nice" to a newbie. It seems a naff design when it is running of a back up battery when it has power supplied to it. Anyway, I think we will leave it as it because our savings in the evenings at the right time of the month are probably worth it. Although the timing is a bit of a chore to keep track of I've written an app so a couple of taps on the mobile and the times are there.

Scrounger

Its not that the clock is 'running off the battery' but more that the battery is faulty and starts taking some of the power that usually runs the clock - hence the clock runs slow.

You may also find that the ambient temperature affects the amount of time drift.

As you say, so long as you can track the changing switching times you should be able to work it to your advantage.

Scrounger

afmfifgh

I am in the process of sorting my parents energy suppliers as they are heavy users and rarely change.

Luckily they tend not to chuck away paperwork so I have been able to get their usage going back to October 2011.

Back then they had an older style electric meter and were on an Economy 7 Meter. I have entered all the readings into my spreadsheet and they were using roughly 40% electric in the day and 60% at night. So an Economy 7 tariff seems about right.

In July 2013 they had a new Electric meter fitted as part of a renewal by the meter people, they just got contacted that it was time for a new one and it was fitted for free, this meter is still in place today.

This meter has a digital display that has a button to let you scroll through the readings, it gives seemingly a day; night and total reading (the other two added together).

Extremely oddly though, from this day forward their usage seems to have changed and remained constant ever since at 79% Day usage and 21% night time usage.

They say they didn't change their habits at all.

So why would a change of meter give such a dramatic change of use?

The 79% day time usage would seem to fit in with their lifestyle as they don't have storage heaters etc and don't like to use appliances at night eg washing machines. So most usage I would expect is daytime usage.

But why the sudden change when a meter was fitted? Could the old one have been faulty?

Also they seem to still be on a Economy 7 Tariff though it isn't called that, the tariff they are on is:

Scottish Power - Online Fixed Priced Energy December 2015

But in their bills it still says Economy 7: Day Charge Economy 7: Night Charge.

I have just done a quick check on MSE Energy Club looking at non Economy 7 tariffs and it says they could save £298 by switching provider to a standard tariff with the Coop and £223 with their current provider.

But would they need to get a new meter fitted/would they be allowed off this Economy 7 tariff?

Any help with these matters would be most welcome by me and my parents as that is a lot of money!

John_Pierpoint

Does the meter look a bit like this ?

I have had a new meter and clock combined fitted and it looks like the above.
It supplies my 60:40 night and day electricity and the night rate last exactly 7 hours (the old meter used to give me 7:20 at the cheap rate.

I have had the meter readings transposed by the reader.

The old clock was a bit erratic, but it never got as far as supplying the cheap rate between 16:39 & 23:59.

Some suppliers are prepared to accept the combined reading.

How do they heat their hot water ?

afmfifgh

Hi John - yes the meter looks just like that but a different colour, white.

If you press the blue button it will cycle through the 3 readings:

1. Day
2. Night
3. Total

I assume there is a clock built in.

Would this kind of meter be okay to use on non economy 7 tariff's just by using the total figure as opposed to seperate day & night readings?

I am not sure what you mean by: 'it supplies my 60:40 night and day electricy'?

Also not sure what you mean by 'I have had the meter readings transposed by the reader.'?

They currently heat their hot water as far as I understand by using the boiler but also have an immersion heater with a big tank in the airing cupboard.

The savings available is less than I said earlier, the reason being that when I unticked 'Do you have an economy 7 meter' in the MSE Energy Club comparison I didn't realise it automatically defaults to 'Standard Tariff' rather than staying on their actual tariff.

The savings are still over £100 though.

John_Pierpoint

afmfifgh wrote: »

Hi John - yes the meter looks just like that but a different colour, white.

If you press the blue button it will cycle through the 3 readings:

1. Day
2. Night
3. Total

I assume there is a clock built in.

Would this kind of meter be okay to use on non economy 7 tariff's just by using the total figure as opposed to seperate day & night readings?

I am not sure what you mean by: 'it supplies my 60:40 night and day electricy'?

Also not sure what you mean by 'I have had the meter readings transposed by the reader.'?

They currently heat their hot water as far as I understand by using the boiler but also have an immersion heater with a big tank in the airing cupboard.

The savings available is less than I said earlier, the reason being that when I unticked 'Do you have an economy 7 meter' in the MSE Energy Club comparison I didn't realise it automatically defaults to 'Standard Tariff' rather than staying on their actual tariff.

The savings are still over £100 though.

My consumption pattern is 60% night and 40% day (cos I've got no gas) Your old people would almost certainly be better off on a normal but discounted tariff deal.

By transposing the readings I mean that the meter reader made a right pigs ear of my account by reporting my night reading as my day reading and vice versa - that was when I had a small white meter with a red flashing light.
I now have a combined clock and meter very like the picture above but mine is also white. It has several lights but the important one is the red flashing one that flashes 1000 times in an hour if one is using one kWh of juice. Time the flashes for a minute and the rate of consumption is roughly:-
flashes : watts
8 : 500
17 : 1000
33 : 2000
50 : 3000

The display probably incorporated a flashing 1 or 2 to show which internal counter is clocking up at the time.

I would recommend keeping a record of the meter readings at least once a month; as over the years I have had "run ins" with so called help line staff that have degenerated into "We are only statutorily required to read your meter once in two years" - Translation "I think you are lying but I am not authorised to send in a meter reader to check - just pay this (wrong) bill".

Most suppliers should agree to accept the combined total as the quarterly on-line reading, but you might want to phone and check before changing supplier and tariff

Good luck

John