Noisy kids upstairs, should the previous owner disclose this when selling? Help pleas

jingledoghere

Hello all, I am new here and urgently need your advices or any help!

Make the long story short, I bought this flat about half a year ago. After moving in, I found the kids upstairs make all kinds of noise constantly during the day, running around,jumping, chasing each other, screaming or crying loudly etc:eek: Night time is a little better. Kids go to bed usually before 10pm, then I could have some quiet moment at home. Just sometimes I am waken up by kid's crying during night.

Because I work from home most of time, the daytime noise make my life very hard. I cannot concentrate on my work, cannot have a nap. I talked to the parents. They have 2 young kids. They said they've tried their best to control the kids but cannot keep them silent all day long:( which I agree. I am not anti-children but if I know this problem before, i won't buy the flat at all.

I tried to get contact with the landlord of upstairs. He said the previous owner also had complained the kids to him once. And they even banged the ceiling and have the argument with the upstairs. But they both talked and "solved" the problem finally (the landlord said so). So I guess this matter doesn't involve the council or any other third party in. Can this be a dispute between neighbours? The seller did not disclose this in the seller's form. I know nothing about the noise from upstairs. So now what should I do?

Southend1

jingledoghere wrote: »

Hello all, I am new here and urgently need your advices or any help!

Make the long story short, I bought this flat about half a year ago. After moving in, I found the kids upstairs make all kinds of noise constantly during the day, running around,jumping, chasing each other, screaming or crying loudly etc:eek: Night time is a little better. Kids go to bed usually before 10pm, then I could have some quiet moment at home. Just sometimes I am waken up by kid's crying during night.

Because I work from home most of time, the daytime noise make my life very hard. I cannot concentrate on my work, cannot have a nap. I talked to the parents. They have 2 young kids. They said they've tried their best to control the kids but cannot keep them silent all day long:( which I agree. I am not anti-children but if I know this problem before, i won't buy the flat at all.

I tried to get contact with the landlord of upstairs. He said the previous owner also had complained the kids to him once. And they even banged the ceiling and have the argument with the upstairs. But they both talked and "solved" the problem finally (the landlord said so). So I guess this matter doesn't involve the council or any other third party in. Can this be a dispute between neighbours? The seller did not disclose this in the seller's form. I know nothing about the noise from upstairs. So now what should I do?

Did you ask the vendor about noise from the upstairs flat?

Fire_Fox

Welcome.

1. Speak again to the parents again. They are not responsible for crying, walking or noises of calm activity but they are responsible for taking their children outside to burn off steam if they cannot stop them running, jumping and screaming
2. Approach Environmental Health at the local council, keep a noise diary, persevere with this it takes time and multiple complaints
3. Read your long lease for any covenants about noise and raise this with the freeholder/ management company, ask them to investigate the sound proofing
4. Purchase some wax or silicone ear plugs (not foam they are useless).

Sounds harsh but if you make upstairs life difficult enough they may just move. Don't harass them, but make calm complaints each time the noise is unreasonable/ controllable, but mainly use EH. The landlord has very limited liability for his tenants noise, he is not the right person to approach.

ILW

Sounds like the kids are just doing what any would. So unlikely to have anything to complain about.

dimbo61

You live in a flat and have neighbours on both sides and above plus maybe below.
Can you improve the sound insulation ?
Wear ear plugs in bed or play music you like in your flat ? with ear phones !

jingledoghere

Southend1 wrote: »

Did you ask the vendor about noise from the upstairs flat?

No sadly I did not ask this particular question. But should the vendor disclose this when selling?

jingledoghere

Fire_Fox wrote: »

Welcome.

1. Speak again to the parents again. They are not responsible for crying, walking or noises of calm activity but they are responsible for taking their children outside to burn off steam if they cannot stop them running, jumping and screaming
2. Approach Environmental Health at the local council, keep a noise diary, persevere with this it takes time and multiple complaints
3. Read your long lease for any covenants about noise and raise this with the freeholder/ management company, ask them to investigate the sound proofing
4. Purchase some wax or silicone ear plugs (not foam they are useless).

Sounds harsh but if you make upstairs life difficult enough they may just move. Don't harass them, but make calm complaints each time the noise is unreasonable/ controllable, but mainly use EH. The landlord has very limited liability for his tenants noise, he is not the right person to approach.

Thanks for your advice. I checked local council's website. It seems children' noise cannot be ‘nuisance’ . Will they take my complain?

anotherginger

Fire_Fox wrote: »

2. Approach Environmental Health at the local council, keep a noise diary, persevere with this it takes time and multiple complaints

Not sure if this would achieve anything - there is case law which says that normal reasonable everyday living noise cannot be a statutory nuisance, so the council are very unlikely to even open a case. What legislation do you think they could use to deal with this? I've never heard of an abatement noise being served on noisy children in their own home.

jingledoghere

I am already wearing the ear plug sometimes when I need concentrate on work. But fell so bad to wear the earplug at my own home:(

G_M

jingledoghere wrote: »

No sadly I did not ask this particular question. But should the vendor disclose this when selling?

Yes ---- if there is an unresolved and ongoing legal dispute over the noise between the vendors and the flat upstairs.

Otherwise, no. Of course not. At what point in the 'decebel scale' do you feel voluntary disclosure should happen? At what time?

When noise becomes intrusive is totally subjective.

Fire_Fox

jingledoghere wrote: »

Thanks for your advice. I checked local council's website. It seems children' noise cannot be ‘nuisance’ . Will they take my complain?

How do I know, I don't know how noisy they are being? As stated in my earlier post you can't complain about unavoidable/ normal noise like crying but it's perfectly reasonable to complain about behaviours that are excessive and can be reduced or controlled. You don't even have to say who is making the noise since you are not in the upstairs flat to see it, just that you can hear banging regularly.

anotherginger wrote: »

Not sure if this would achieve anything - there is case law which says that normal reasonable everyday living noise cannot be a statutory nuisance, so the council are very unlikely to even open a case. What legislation do you think they could use to deal with this? I've never heard of an abatement noise being served on noisy children in their own home.

Depends if this is normal reasonable everyday living noise, we aren't there so we don't know. Do you think uncontrolled screaming and jumping is acceptable in an upstairs flat? Who said anything about an abatement order at this stage, aren't you jumping the gun a tad? EH may opt to informally mediate which may be enough to make the parents realise their kids need to get out more or they need to move.

Or EH may tell the OP the noise is barely audible and they are being unreasonable. Or they might recommend to the landlord extra sound proofing/ carpeting is installed and he might comply. There are many possible outcomes.