Tmobile price increase

daveuk1

@RandomCurve

Suggest you edit your template instructions above to clarify that the breach of contract is not the price rise but the failure to accept notice of termination under 7.2.3.3.

@All,

I presume this is going to come down to CISAS ruling which I now unfortunately believe will be unfavourable to consumers as T-Mobile have been incredibly lucky with the RPI rate. In any event, it is worth pointing out that you are taking a significant risk by using any PAC issued by T-Mobile relating to this issue unless and until they have confirmed in writing that you are released from your contract without penalty or you have a CISAS ruling in your favour. In the absence of either of these, you run the risk of being pursued by T-Mobile for the cancellation charge and/or having your credit rating negatively impacted.

And no, I'm not a T-Mobile stooge - far from it - just wouldn't want people to get carried away with what's been written here and think a penalty-free termination is a foregone conclusion.

RandomCurve

ryan92 wrote: »

Thank you! Just to confirm, the grounds are due to breaking their clause relating to the index price and with them rising it to 3.3% rather than the actual 3.2% value?

Effectively yes, but don't say that I you letter!

If your contract was taken out from 1st November 2012 onwards - then this is definitely the case. For the earlier contract there are so many things wrong I'm still not sure which will be the best reason to use, hence I have taken a leaf out of T-Mobiles "how to avoid being clear" book and have deliberately drafted the template letters to be as vague as possible, whilst confirming your application to cancel. As this progresses the reasons why T-Mobile are in breach of the pre Oct 2012 contract will become clearer so the important thing is to get your cancellation letter in NOW.

RandomCurve

daveuk1 wrote: »

@RandomCurve

Suggest you edit your template instructions above to clarify that the breach of contract is not the price rise but the failure to accept notice of termination under 7.2.3.3.

.

I thought I had made it vague enough - no mention of RPI just that they are in Breach. If I make it any vaguer will it still hold water?

Re failure to accept notice of termination - I though that was an ADDITONAL breach, if the first breach does not exist how can the termination clause be breached?

Any advice much appreciated.

RandomCurve

[QUOTE=daveuk1;61009045

@All,

I presume this is going to come down to CISAS ruling which I now unfortunately believe will be unfavourable to consumers as T-Mobile have been incredibly lucky with the RPI rate. In any event, it is worth pointing out that you are taking a significant risk by using any PAC issued by T-Mobile relating to this issue unless and until they have confirmed in writing that you are released from your contract without penalty or you have a CISAS ruling in your favour. In the absence of either of these, you run the risk of being pursued by T-Mobile for the cancellation charge and/or having your credit rating negatively impacted.
.[/QUOTE]


Spot on - They sent me a letter with a PAC code - see (one of) my post of yesterday #419.

DO NOT use any PAC code until the letter that comes with it states that you can use it penalty free.

daveuk1

RandomCurve wrote: »

I thought I had made it vague enough - no mention of RPI just that they are in Breach. If I make it any vaguer will it still hold water?

Re failure to accept notice of termination - I though that was an ADDITONAL breach, if the first breach does not exist how can the termination clause be breached?

Any advice much appreciated.

I think there's a bit of confusion. The failure to accept notice of cancellation is the only breach. Increasing the price(be it by RPI or even more) is not a breach of contract. If they increase the price by more than RPI it simply triggers the customer's contractual right to terminate. That's not a breach of anything, it's just the contractual agreement. Only when they fail to honour that agreement, by refusing to accept termination, does the breach occur.

HTH

ryan92

RandomCurve wrote: »

Effectively yes, but don't say that I you letter!

If your contract was taken out from 1st November 2012 onwards - then this is definitely the case. For the earlier contract there are so many things wrong I'm still not sure which will be the best reason to use, hence I have taken a leaf out of T-Mobiles "how to avoid being clear" book and have deliberately drafted the template letters to be as vague as possible, whilst confirming your application to cancel. As this progresses the reasons why T-Mobile are in breach of the pre Oct 2012 contract will become clearer so the important thing is to get your cancellation letter in NOW.

Thanks again for your reply ; one contract was taken out in October 2011, and the 2nd December 2012 - so looks like my mum will have to take 2 different approaches here?

RandomCurve

ryan92 wrote: »

Thanks again for your reply ; one contract was taken out in October 2011, and the 2nd December 2012 - so looks like my mum will have to take 2 different approaches here?

At the moment just use the one approach. The difference in approach will come after you receive your letter from T-Mobile telling you why you can't cancel.

Post here when the letter/email arrives.

Chimper

RandomCurve wrote: »

I thought I had made it vague enough - no mention of RPI just that they are in Breach. If I make it any vaguer will it still hold water?

Re failure to accept notice of termination - I though that was an ADDITONAL breach, if the first breach does not exist how can the termination clause be breached?

Any advice much appreciated.

I've always made my complaint vaguely. Just mentioning the breach due to the announced rise being in excess of RPI, which gives us the right to cancel. They've come back with a variety of excuses but rather than argue each point I've just gone back to the fact that they've breached of contract.

I don't think we need to argue over the details with them. We know they're wrong, they know they're wrong. Let them continue to slip up by changing their mind as to which month they base the rise on.

As long as we're explicit when we take the complaints to CISAS.

ryan92

RandomCurve wrote: »

At the moment just use the one approach. The difference in approach will come after you receive your letter from T-Mobile telling you why you can't cancel.

Post here when the letter/email arrives.

I will get my Mum to give them a phone first thing in the morning and keep you updated!

daveuk1

Chimper wrote: »

I've always made my complaint vaguely. Just mentioning the breach due to the announced rise being in excess of RPI, which gives us the right to cancel. They've come back with a variety of excuses but rather than argue each point I've just gone back to the fact that they've breached of contract.

I don't think we need to argue over the details with them. We know they're wrong, they know they're wrong. Let them continue to slip up by changing their mind as to which month they base the rise on.

As long as we're explicit when we take the complaints to CISAS.

I don't want to labour this point but that premise is wrong. The price rise is not, in itself, a breach of contract. I also don't think that vague is the right approach. It is abundantly clear to me that T-Mobile have now got their lawyers involved - it explains the approach they're now taking (pretty much the only one open to them). If you want to be successful (and, as you can see from my previous posts, I'm not sure even this will help much) you ought to be both specific and accurate as to why you believe you are entitled to cancel without penalty. You are more likely to have your vagueness used against you than for it to benefit you.