Safe in our Hands

Wookster

Conrad wrote: »

This is the reason Brits for decades have had to endure dreadful service and care. No one complains. It drives me potty. Above all if you ever have an eldrely relative in care, it's up to you to make damned sure those carers and nurses know your'e on the case.

That's part of it, but really people NEED to get sacked. That they are negligent and not only get away with it, but are promoted is quite fantastic.

Cornucopia

Generali wrote: »

During the 1987 election campaign, Mrs (now Lady) Thatcher claimed that the NHS is in our hands.

That was much derided by Labour and their apologists in future years.

I'm not sure that either flavour of government has ever truly cherished the NHS (or other public services) the way that the public want them to. Certainly not in the past 40 years or so.

ILW

Conrad wrote: »

PS - for 25 years I've heard comittee after comittee reporting on everything from kids failed by social services to abuse of mentally vulnerable in-patients and the words they use never change;

"this time lessons must be learend to ensure this never happens again"

"agencies must talk to one another"


Listen out for these phrases in the comming years folks. They were used way back in a Brighton child abuse failure in the early 1970's.

Until senior management take responsibility in line with their salaries. Things will never change.

ruggedtoast

One of my family members recently qualified as a junior doctor and started her tenure in a London hospital.

I wont go into specific details but she has had a horrible time there, and is absolutely appalled at the neglect of patients and incompetence she has witnessed there.

She even offered to help them sort out the admin chaos on her ward and was knocked back as it 'wasnt her job'. And therein is the problem. Half the people its not their job and the other half won't do their job.

She's moving on to another hospital soon but she is now feeling very disillusioned about working in the NHS.

Conrad

Cornucopia wrote: »

Not sure I understand the significance of the thread title. These issues happened and are acknowledged to have been largely caused by the Targets and Trusts policies of the previous Government.

However, these issues are indicative of ongoing failures, and failures of the public trust across all of public services. Organisations seem to have adopted the worst aspects of corporate-style self-belief, and have too little focus on their actual priorities, the essential one being service users.

A lot of truth in what you say but it's also about employees becomming to employee - centric with the 'my rights' culture perpetuated.

As an example a nurse was applying a cast to my sons arm, all the while very leisurely gossiping about her life. Outside a chap who'd stuck a fork through his foot was hopping around loosing blood. This nurse was called for - rightly imo but she kept saying she was busy. She carried on boring us with chit chat as if she had all the time in the world.

Twice I've experienced this. This is a very entrenched attitudinal issue.

Next time your in a hospital take a look at the under parts of the beds and trollies. Notice the filth and yet also notice the nurses gossiping at thier station.

We have to make staff far more accountable. Fear is the best motivator (for example I fear being sued every day so I go to massive legnths to take great care of cleints).

Cornucopia

Fear is the best motivator

Fear - not sure about that.

For me, what is happening is a corruption of professional attitudes. What used to be pride in the job, pride in good care and pride in a well-run hospital has been undermined, and needs to be reasserted.

I suspect that if we looked closer, we'd find that part of the issue is that management (who in the past led that culture) are now focused on other things.

Norfolk_Jim

At times I think a major reason for these failures is the desire to have the minimum number of staff doing the maximum amount of work - address that issue and staff will be able to care more for individual patients and will be soundly lambasted for not having enough work to do and occasionally having enough time to stop for a cup of tea instead of slaving away 60 minutes out of every hour.
They're damned if they do and they are damned if the don't.
Fortunately me and most of my family are still living and solvent thanks to NHS warts and all. I think in a lot of other countries it might have been a different outcome.

ruggedtoast

The main problem with the NHS is that it is so hit and miss.

There is a 'good' hospital round the corner from my work and recently two ladies here gave birth in it at about the same time.

They both spent days in there and they both had to be induced.

Lady # 1 had a horrific time. She was in there for a full week surrounded by screaming women giving birth naturally. They induced her three times and only after 7 days did the baby finally come. The birth was by all accounts horrific and she thought she was going to die.

Throughout this she was completely neglected by the midwifes, no one had a kind word for her and one woman shouted at her when she asked what would happen if the third inducement didnt work.

Lady # 2 was induced unsuccessfully, given a C section and was out a few days later. She was happy with the care and thought it was all fine.

They were both in the same ward a week apart.

GeneHunt_2

Me and my kids have always had excellent care. We have 2 kids. One of them was in an SCU. She always had her nappy changed.

Been to A & E a fair few times as you do with kids..excellent outcomes..particulary with a very bad clevicle fracture

Maybe we were just lucky....

[Deleted User]

Conrad wrote: »

A lot of truth in what you say but it's also about employees becomming to employee - centric with the 'my rights' culture perpetuated.

As an example a nurse was applying a cast to my sons arm, all the while very leisurely gossiping about her life. Outside a chap who'd stuck a fork through his foot was hopping around loosing blood. This nurse was called for - rightly imo but she kept saying she was busy. She carried on boring us with chit chat as if she had all the time in the world.

Twice I've experienced this. This is a very entrenched attitudinal issue.

Next time your in a hospital take a look at the under parts of the beds and trollies. Notice the filth and yet also notice the nurses gossiping at thier station.

We have to make staff far more accountable. Fear is the best motivator (for example I fear being sued every day so I go to massive legnths to take great care of cleints).

Want a worse story? A man was slowly gagging as his airways were collapsing; whilst a junior doctor and nurse chatted away next to him.

My wife (the A&E sister-in-charge at the time) walks in and immediately had to call for a team to resuscitate him. Thankfully he made a recovery, but had my wife not decided to check who was in the room (she was looking for staff to move around) then that man would probably not made it. Nothing happened to the nurse or doctor who stood by and did nothing.

So, what's wrong with the NHS? They've outsourced everything and removed 'the soul' from hospitals. Why aren't the beds cleaned? Well, because the staff who were outsourced - they've not turned up. They've turned everything into 'just a job'. I'm really glad I don't work for the NHS - the moral is appalling . They even stopped their A&E's 'gift token' xmas gift this year.. So - if you create a workforce that are not 'engaged' they will badly perform.

How can the NHS be saved? By reducing it's remit. Pull it back to where it use to be. Make additional services privately available. Re-engage the NHS workforce and make their working conditions better.

My son had physio yesterday. I think we'd have been quite happy to have pay for it really (it was some of the best medical attention he's ever had; even better than pediatric consultant care)