Petrol Threat To Cons Chances

Moby

Fella wrote: »

The thing that's so tedious about class warriors is not the rancour & jealousy (although that's bad enough). It's the utter hypocrisy: Poor people are just as greedy as rich people. You ever met a poor person who hopes to one day move house to a worse area? Or who rejects a pay rise? Or who scratches a scratchcard & hopes they lose?

We're all greedy, for the very good reason that nature built us that way to help us survive. It's against human nature to want your situation to be worse.

Many people are too lazy to put in the work necessary to improve their situation though, so they just moan about it & accuse everyone richer than them of being posh/privileged/greedy or whatever. They usually make some absurd claim about how they could be better off if they wanted to but they're not prepared to {insert some made up nonsense like "be a spiv banker" here}

There would be no need for class warriors if there was equality of opportunity. Agreed people are good, bad, lazy etc in all classes. That's not the point though. Some of us believe the class system is unfair, just as the caste system is unfair in India. I believe in breaking through the prejudice of ignorance and denial about this! Its a journey.......historically slavery, racism etc was accepted....now we've moved on, then we had feminism, gay rights etc....there is a conservative tendency to resist this progression. That's why plebgate hit the tory so hard. The actual truth didn't actually matter.....the point was it hinted at the privilege that lies behind their values and how they see themselves compared to others. When I was in Oxford....there was a clear demarcation of class between students....that was based on background etc. Someone encapsulated it like this:- ...if your parents had to buy their own furniture...you were lower class.I'm not making this up.......class division, privilege and the distribution of power based on that is alive and well. Some of us choose not to ignore it and call it for what it is!

DecentLivingWage

Its the families in the middle that are truly at breaking point - especially those for whom travel to work is a big cut out of their budget. Theres nothing left to cut while Osborne and Cameron laugh it all off with champagne and £20 per head pizza in luxury ski resoerts. What is happening with the fuel regulator? A fuel dutywhich sees fuel duty cut as prices - VAT receipts- rise – is best way of stabilising prices in an upredictable market. The spring budget will be a headache for Osborne as the Cons search for inspiration - this will slam Con voters in green welly land !

Fella

Eat pizza too do they, the filthy rotters? No wonder you hate them.

Generali

Moby wrote: »

That's why plebgate hit the tory so hard. The actual truth didn't actually matter.....the point was it hinted at the privilege that lies behind their values and how they see themselves compared to others.

Plebgate hit the Tories because it pandered to a stereotype.

It would be the same if it portrayed an Irish politician as stupid or a black politician as lazy or a Muslim as a misogynistic terrorist. The stereotype speaks loudly.

I have lots of friends who are 'posh' just as I have friends that are 'gay' or 'women' or 'not white' or 'a bit chavy' or 'rich' or 'poor'. It might astound you to realise that these groups aren't mutually exclusive. I know a bloke that is posh (went to the same school as Prince Charles: proper posh that) and is poor. I know a few blokes that are basically 'chavs' and are rich. I know a rich brown gay man who is not especially posh. When I was a student I used to know a woman (FWB I think is the modern term) who is a Baroness (originally German so the Baronetcy passes through the female line too) who was not from a wealthy background.

People rarely conform to type apart from when they do.

Moby

Generali wrote: »

Plebgate hit the Tories because it pandered to a stereotype.

It would be the same if it portrayed an Irish politician as stupid or a black politician as lazy or a Muslim as a misogynistic terrorist. The stereotype speaks loudly.

I have lots of friends who are 'posh' just as I have friends that are 'gay' or 'women' or 'not white' or 'a bit chavy' or 'rich' or 'poor'. It might astound you to realise that these groups aren't mutually exclusive. I know a bloke that is posh (went to the same school as Prince Charles: proper posh that) and is poor. I know a few blokes that are basically 'chavs' and are rich. I know a rich brown gay man who is not especially posh. When I was a student I used to know a woman (FWB I think is the modern term) who is a Baroness (originally German so the Baronetcy passes through the female line too) who was not from a wealthy background.

People rarely conform to type apart from when they do.

Good for you and totally agree but not what I was talking about of course. Now back to the tennis.

Wookster

It takes a special sort of ignoramus to think folks are prisoners to their background.

Nothing on this planet is as complicated or unpredictable as the human being. This is what makes such a viewpoint utterly wrong.

A._Badger

Moby wrote: »

Your view of my education would perhaps be a tad more valid if you had actually addressed the point I made.
I didn't describe posh boy as 'useless' or a 'fool'. What I said was very different....'his background is important because it defines him as a person. It defines his thinking, attitudes and values.'.......that's what I actually said. I went on to describe who he chooses to associate with etc....it really isn't difficult is it!

Ah, but I did address the point you made. And your inability to understand that rather proves my point about your education, too.

Thrugelmir

grizzly1911 wrote: »

I don't understand why the conservatives didn't just say we are withdrawing all previously planned increases, by the previous government, shortly after they took office.

Because the taxation income generated has already been spent.

The budget is not merely for the forthcoming 12 months. But for years ahead.

Mr Brown cleverly left all the nasties buried in the small print. So that they never received media attention.

GeorgeHowell

Wookster wrote: »

It takes a special sort of ignoramus to think folks are prisoners to their background.

Nothing on this planet is as complicated or unpredictable as the human being. This is what makes such a viewpoint utterly wrong.

The class warrior that you are addressing is almost beyond belief isn't he/she. It's textbook tired, discredited, failed, anachronistic old Marxist claptrap. And yet some people have too little intelligence and self-respect to leave this mumbo-jumbo behind, and join the 21st century and the real world which has moved on.

A._Badger

Moby wrote: »

There would be no need for class warriors if there was equality of opportunity. Agreed people are good, bad, lazy etc in all classes. That's not the point though. Some of us believe the class system is unfair, just as the caste system is unfair in India. I believe in breaking through the prejudice of ignorance and denial about this! Its a journey.......historically slavery, racism etc was accepted....now we've moved on, then we had feminism, gay rights etc....there is a conservative tendency to resist this progression. That's why plebgate hit the tory so hard. The actual truth didn't actually matter.....the point was it hinted at the privilege that lies behind their values and how they see themselves compared to others. When I was in Oxford....there was a clear demarcation of class between students....that was based on background etc. Someone encapsulated it like this:- ...if your parents had to buy their own furniture...you were lower class.I'm not making this up.......class division, privilege and the distribution of power based on that is alive and well. Some of us choose not to ignore it and call it for what it is!

The Whig version of history, with a dash of SWP Marxism. Yoiu walked into a conceptual prison and slammed the door on yourself.