Advice needed about cars, insurance, the lot!

Joe_Horner

Chickabiddybex wrote: »

Sorry for my ignorance but I don't know what you mean when you say classic car! It makes me think of a 1950s number and I'm almost certain you're not talking about that!

For the record I got a quote for just over £600 a year for insurance based on a Citroen C1. That's with my mum as a second driver (shaved off £100 by doing that! Plus it will be very useful in case I need her to drive it for some reason)

"Classic" now can describe anything up to about the mid-80s (some would probably push that early 90s!).

As an indication of how cheap they can be as first cars, we got my stepdaughter a 1971 Daf 33 (probably a bit too quirky for you that one :P ) for £350 with 10 months MOT. Road tax was free (pre-'73) and, the day she passed her test as a 19 year old, her insurance was £350 for the year.

She used it every day for work (about 40 mile round trip) and was off in it most weekends travelling between North Wales and Nottingham / Midlands / Lancashire. Fuel consumption averaged about 35mpg, with between 45 and 50 on longer runs.

It did suffer a bit but, to be fair, that was because she never washed it, used to cart hay around on the back seat, and never let it stand still long enough to do any maintenance on it :mad:

More realistic cars of the age for the "average" driver would be things like the Triumph Dolomite range, Moggie marinas (unloved at the time but the survivors are mostly good enough cars), the Austin Maxi (again, fairly unloved but amazingly practical with 5 spd bpx and a good size hatchback)

Going a bit newer, Mk 3 Escorts (but prices are going up), Mk 2 or 3 Cavaliers, Austin Montego if you can find a rust-free one, and the early Rover 200s / 400s.

Incidentally, that Daf she had has been saved, after she abandoned it outside for 2 years, and is now the prize in a charity auction down in Norfolk. It finally got that wash and polish (and quite a lot of paintwork by now) that it so badly needed :rotfl:

Chickabiddybex

Strongwork - Yeah that's what I was thinking! I can't cope without power steering and I don't want to spend an arm and a leg on petrol.

My main questions are:
Finance with car company or loan from the bank?
Used or new?
If used how old is too old?
Is a "just add fuel" deal worth it?
Where are the best places to buy from?
If I get a 2k car will my insurance/repair costs outweigh the savings from a 5k?
If I speak to someone rather than going online can I get a better quote?
for example online I can tell them the car is in a drive way but if I speak to someone I can tell them you have to go round the back of the houses so it can't be seen from the street.

Joe_Horner

StrongWork wrote: »

Notsureifseriousjoker.jpeg

24 year old woman with no interest/knowledge in cars and you are recommending something:
- old
- unreliable versus modern equivalents
- will need constant maintenance
- rust rust rust
- not comfortable
- lacks modern features (good heater!?)
- crash in it and you will die

Obviously been reading prejudiceRus.com for your buying advice!

The Op may have no knowledge, but nowhere does it say she has no interest. She's also said that she has someone available who is mechanically competent and will find any of these cars a doddle to work on (spanners and screwdrivers are all that's needed)

As for your list:

"Old" - that's pure ageism. Old does NOT automatically mean "bad"

"Unreliable" - so inherently wrong that one comment shows how little you understand. Reliability is almost entirely a function of maintenance on old cars. On new ones it's also a function of how likely all those unrepairable (and generally expensive) electronic bits are to fail. We're not talking 1940 Austin 7s here, we're talking cars that were designed for modern roads, including motorways that were clear enough to keep sustained speeds instead of sitting in jams.

"Will need constant maintenance" - No, will need oil changes every 6k miles or so and plugs checked at the same time. Depending on the model and any upgrades may also need the points cleaned and timing adjusted at the same time but a cheap & simple electronic ignition upgrade will stop that. bear in mind that more and more people are realising that the stretched service intervals on modern cars are unrealistic - many are recommending 6k oil changes even on moderns.

"Rust rust rust" - and you're "thinking" a list including a Ford Ka??????. Most of the classics still on the road have had any rust issues sorted long ago and been well maintained and well rust-proofed. Otherwise they wouldn't still be here.

"Not comfortable" - we've run classics as dailies for the past 5 years now, including long distance (300+ mile trips) on a regular basis. The longest we've done is about 700 miles 9Anglesey to Essex and back) in a day and conmfort really wasn't a problem!

"lacks modern features / good heater" - Modern features are obviously missing on old cars, but their heaters were perfectly capable of dealing with the much harder winters we had back when they were made. They still are.

"crash in it you will die". Apart from being untrue, sounds like a very good reason for a young , inexperienced, driver to have one because it really encourages the attitude of "not crashing" in the first place. In case you hadn't noticed, the vast majority of drivers who grew up with these things didn't die on the roads. Not even once!

Gloomendoom

Chickabiddybex wrote: »

Sorry for my ignorance but I don't know what you mean when you say classic car! It makes me think of a 1950s number and I'm almost certain you're not talking about that!

For the record I got a quote for just over £600 a year for insurance based on a Citroen C1. That's with my mum as a second driver (shaved off £100 by doing that! Plus it will be very useful in case I need her to drive it for some reason)

Don't get your hopes up on classic car insurance. The policies quite often come with strings attached. The most common one that I am aware of is that you own, or have use of, another car. With most, you don't build up a no claims bonus either.

If you can satisfy the conditions it can be very cheap. I was quoted £85 fully comp for mine last month but ended up paying slightly more for policy that does take into account (and preserve) a no claims discount. Still under £100 though.

To be honest £600 doesn't sound that bad by today's standards, and a Citröen C1 will be a much nicer drive than most 'classics'. It probably also be safer in the event of an accident too, if that bothers you.

Joe_Horner

Chickabiddybex wrote: »

Strongwork - Yeah that's what I was thinking! I can't cope without power steering and I don't want to spend an arm and a leg on petrol.

Don't forget that most cars of that age didn't need power steering because they were lighhter and had proper tyres instead of 2 foot wide rubber bands glued to the wheel The steering tends to be a lot lighter than you'd expect if you've never tried one!

Fuel isn't a big deal either. ON 10k a year mileage, our old Colt Diesel that we had from new cost about £1350 a year in fuel at today's prices. Our current oldies cost about £1612. But insurance is £150 a year fully comp for the pair, compared to £450 on the Colt, and road ta is zero compared to £120 a year.

So the extra fuel is MORE than offset by the cheaper costs even without considering depreciation (zero on ours, several K over 3 years on the Colt) or finance charges (again, zero compared to lots).

A classic may well not be the right choice for you, but please don't reject the idea on the grounds of inaccurate prejudice put out by people who obviously have no experience of what owning one as a daily driver can mean!

StrongWork

Joe_Horner wrote: »

Obviously been reading prejudiceRus.com for your buying advice!

The Op may have no knowledge, but nowhere does it say she has no interest. She's also said that she has someone available who is mechanically competent and will find any of these cars a doddle to work on (spanners and screwdrivers are all that's needed)

As for your list:

"Old" - that's pure ageism. Old does NOT automatically mean "bad"

"Unreliable" - so inherently wrong that one comment shows how little you understand. Reliability is almost entirely a function of maintenance on old cars. On new ones it's also a function of how likely all those unrepairable (and generally expensive) electronic bits are to fail. We're not talking 1940 Austin 7s here, we're talking cars that were designed for modern roads, including motorways that were clear enough to keep sustained speeds instead of sitting in jams.

"Will need constant maintenance" - No, will need oil changes every 6k miles or so and plugs checked at the same time. Depending on the model and any upgrades may also need the points cleaned and timing adjusted at the same time but a cheap & simple electronic ignition upgrade will stop that. bear in mind that more and more people are realising that the stretched service intervals on modern cars are unrealistic - many are recommending 6k oil changes even on moderns.

"Rust rust rust" - and you're "thinking" a list including a Ford Ka??????. Most of the classics still on the road have had any rust issues sorted long ago and been well maintained and well rust-proofed. Otherwise they wouldn't still be here.

"Not comfortable" - we've run classics as dailies for the past 5 years now, including long distance (300+ mile trips) on a regular basis. The longest we've done is about 700 miles 9Anglesey to Essex and back) in a day and conmfort really wasn't a problem!

"lacks modern features / good heater" - Modern features are obviously missing on old cars, but their heaters were perfectly capable of dealing with the much harder winters we had back when they were made. They still are.

"crash in it you will die". Apart from being untrue, sounds like a very good reason for a young , inexperienced, driver to have one because it really encourages the attitude of "not crashing" in the first place. In case you hadn't noticed, the vast majority of drivers who grew up with these things didn't die on the roads. Not even once!

Really? Seriously? Genuine struggle here.

More than likely I've been reading sensibleandpractical.com for my advice.

How many 24 year old women with little car knowledge (OP admits this in opening post) want to be messing about with old cars and their associated problems.

I'm not going to address each retaliatory point as your overall argument is so off base compared to what the OP actually wants/needs.

I know old cars. I like old cars. However given the brief the OP has written and the lack of car knowledge she has displayed (sorry OP, no offence meant!) a classic is unsuitable here.

FWIW, I drive a 'classic' (1980s BMW E30) on a daily basis so I'm quite familiar with classics and their associated foibles. Oh and last year I drove it to Monaco, the Alps and Italian Lakes but thanks for your concern regarding my knowledge.



Edit to add: And here it is in Scotland (a drive I did from London 5 times in this car last year).

StrongWork

Joe_Horner wrote: »

A classic may well not be the right choice for you, but please don't reject the idea on the grounds of inaccurate prejudice put out by people who obviously have no experience of what owning one as a daily driver can mean!

:rotfl::rotfl::rotfl::rotfl::rotfl:

:T:T:T:T:T

Chickabiddybex

Oh God this forum is so ridiculous sometimes! Don't make arguments personal guys, you're all doing the same thing; trying to help!

I do have some interest/knowledge of cars but no idea of the financial side of things. I also have fair experience, I've driven abroad on the "wrong side of the road" and done 12 plus hours of driving in one day on occasions. I just want to save money which is why I asked here. I can't have the car I really want (Chevvy impala lol!) I just want something cost effective.

I appreciate that a classic car might save me quite a lot of money at first. But I dont think its something I would go for. I'm leaning towards something with a CD player at least!

I found this: http://www.carcraft.co.uk/used-cars/detail/1019236/fiat-grande-punto-1.2-active-3dr?searchId=36441529&provideBackButton=true

I can get insured for £725 which is more than the other I looked at but a grand cheaper for the car. But the finance is 8.8% do you know if car loans from banks would offer better than that?
Is Carcraft a good or bad place to get a car?

steve-L

I'd take a different tack completely....
1st car main use should just be to build up NCB....

Get something cheap, don't worry about roadtax or MPG (well with that's cheap to insure that cuts out silly options)

Cheap being something your mechanic friend can just keep running .....

Next year you have other options but the more you have left the more options you have next year.

Chickabiddybex

Now this one gives insurance for £600 but the car overall is £4895
http://www.carcraft.co.uk/used-cars/detail/1019919/citroen-c1-1.0i-vibe-3dr?searchId=36442059&provideBackButton=true

It seems the cheaper the car the more expensive the insurance. Is it worth getting a cheap crap car and putting up with more expensive insurance (even though its only slightly more compared with the car price) to save money or will servicing, MOTs, repairs, etc bring up the price more?