Flight delay and cancellation compensation, Tui/Thomson ONLY

eskbanker

It sounds like you could technically claim compensation under denied boarding provisions if you were bumped onto a slightly later flight, which would be unrelated to an insurance claim for earlier events so wouldn't have any dependencies on timing.

Anon

eskbanker said:

It sounds like you could technically claim compensation under denied boarding provisions if you were bumped onto a slightly later flight, which would be unrelated to an insurance claim for earlier events so wouldn't have any dependencies on timing.

Thank you - will give it a try as nothing lost trying.

Alan_Bowen

You need to read the terms of both policies and see which has the best cover for 'missed departure', we cannot read what you have, I suspect the Amex policy may have the best cover but that is an assumption, not a guarantee. 
It is not the time of departure that determines whether compensation is paid for flights but arriving more than 3 hours later than scheduled, and that does not appear to be the case. If one plane went tech and split the flight into two, and still got you there less than 3 hours late, I think TUI should be praised, many have suffered far worse!

Flounder

Quick question. Has anyone had any success with a bird strike claim where the delay was increased because the engineer had to be flown from Turkey to check the wing and engine?

We (family of 4) were delayed 22hrs 50mins from LeedsBradford to Antalya on 13th Aug with Freebird. We were queued to board but returned to the departures. Our flight was given to the Dalaman passengers and we waited for the engineer. No vouchers, no information on the departures board, the TUI rep had to be located by a group of stressed passengers who found them in a remote part of the airport no where near the gate.

In the end I don't think there was a repair required as Swissport said there was a small amount of blood on the wing and no damage appeared to be at the engine area. It was just a delay to fly an engineer from Turkey. I thought the airline had to take reasonable measures to provide engineering support.

TUI emailed initially to say we could claim with Freebird due to a technical fault but then emailed with info regarding the birstrike. Curiously though it stated "We previously advised you would be able to claim under EU Regulation (EC) 261/200 through Freebird, however we have had confirmation that the delay was caused by a bird strike on the flight this aircraft operated prior to your flight into Dalaman."

Surely the bird strike did not occur INTO Dalaman? It would have been checked there once seen not flown to Leeds as there would be no way of knowing when the bird was struck.

Grateful for any knowledge or advice before I see how to proceed. Thank you.

eskbanker

Flounder said:

In the end I don't think there was a repair required as Swissport said there was a small amount of blood on the wing and no damage appeared to be at the engine area. It was just a delay to fly an engineer from Turkey. I thought the airline had to take reasonable measures to provide engineering support.

It'll come down to the interpretation of 'reasonable' - it's certainly not expected that airlines have teams of engineers stationed at every destination they fly to, but whether it's acceptable to only have suitably qualified staff at your home base is perhaps questionable, rather than contracting in assistance from others.

Flounder said:

TUI emailed initially to say we could claim with Freebird due to a technical fault but then emailed with info regarding the birstrike. Curiously though it stated "We previously advised you would be able to claim under EU Regulation (EC) 261/200 through Freebird, however we have had confirmation that the delay was caused by a bird strike on the flight this aircraft operated prior to your flight into Dalaman."

Surely the bird strike did not occur INTO Dalaman? It would have been checked there once seen not flown to Leeds as there would be no way of knowing when the bird was struck.

I think that what they're saying is that there was "a bird strike on the flight this aircraft operated prior to your flight [that would have flown] into Dalaman", i.e. the strike occurred on the immediately previous flight, en route from Turkey to the UK.

Bird strikes are considered extraordinary circumstances, so the airline probably isn't obliged to pay compensation, but should fund overnight accommodation and meals while you waited.

Flounder

Freebird provided transfers and overnight accommodation so no need to claim reimbursement. I understand they can't have engineering support at every destination but is nearly 24 hours reasonable to have the aircraft assessed?

The fact that TUI initially emailed to say it was a technical fault and then said it was a bird strike makes me a little suspicious and the fact our aircraft was swapped for the Dalaman flight with no reason given means I may try a claim and see what they say.

Do they have to prove a bird strike as it's an easy way to avoid compensation? I know the aircraft technical log (I fly helicopters commercially though not with passengers) must have the aircraft captain's entry for the defect and an engineers sign off clearing the fault.

eskbanker

Flounder said:

the fact our aircraft was swapped for the Dalaman flight with no reason given means I may try a claim and see what they say.

Yes, I think this is a good angle - if your flight was substantially delayed because the airline chose to redeploy your (undamaged) aircraft onto a different flight then that's a conscious decision they took, and I don't think that entitles them to claim that extraordinary circumstances were the cause of your delay.  The fact that a bird strike damaged a different aircraft is essentially irrelevant....

Probi

Hi all,

Just wondering if I can get an opinion on the chances of our claim, we have entered an initial claim which I am expecting to be declined, but want to be prepared for when this happens.

We were recently on a TUI flight from Melbourne Florida, to Bristol, we were delayed initially around an hour due to electrical storms in the vicinity of the airport, which is fair.
The main fun began when we were on approach to Bristol. There was low cloud and fog in the area and due to this we called off our approach and diverted to Gatwick. Originally the plan was to refuel at Gatwick and then fly the aircraft back to Bristol.

Once we landed in Gatwick we were then informed the TUI ops had decided the quickest and easiest way to get us back to Bristol was via coach instead. The reasoning for this was that our current crew were out of hours and it will take a long time to source a new crew to operate the aircraft.

Once we were in the terminal we were given £10pp vouchers to spend on food and drink.

We were in Gatwick were almost 4 hours before even getting on a coach and then it was a nearly 4 hour trip back to Bristol.

We should have originally landed in Bristol at 7am, we eventually got to Bristol at 5pm.

My main thinking around why this could be a valid case is the below:

All other aircraft landed successfully in Bristol, including a Ryanair that landed less than 5 minutes after our failed approach, other than the original attempt, no holding to wait for the weather to clear or further attempts to land were made.

The option to put us on coaches rather than fly us on the aircraft back to Bristol significantly increased our delay (the operating aircraft positioned empty back to Bristol and was well on it's way to Cancun by the time our coaches made it to Bristol)

The delay of almost 4 hours before even getting on a coach in Gatwick seems extreme.

Does anybody think that if this is declined in the first instance that it is worth providing any of the above as valid circumstances for a claim?

Thanks

eskbanker

Not sure that the arrival of other flights in BRS at the time would necessarily be relevant, unless they were comparable aircraft/routes, e.g. a Ryanair 737 on a short haul flight will probably need less runway length than a long-haul 787 flight, for example.

Having diverted, it really then comes down to what could/should they have done better?  Crew arriving from an overnight transatlantic flight are unlikely to have enough hours left to return to Bristol after refuelling, so it would be a debate about how long it should take for the airline to arrange a full standby crew (which would be more onerous than that needed to fly an empty positioning leg).  There also won't be a fleet of coaches sitting there ready to go - that's not to say that four hours is reasonable though....

As with so many claims, it's not necessarily cut and dried one way or the other, so see what they come back with and take it from there!

Probi

eskbanker said:

Not sure that the arrival of other flights in BRS at the time would necessarily be relevant, unless they were comparable aircraft/routes, e.g. a Ryanair 737 on a short haul flight will probably need less runway length than a long-haul 787 flight, for example.

Having diverted, it really then comes down to what could/should they have done better?  Crew arriving from an overnight transatlantic flight are unlikely to have enough hours left to return to Bristol after refuelling, so it would be a debate about how long it should take for the airline to arrange a full standby crew (which would be more onerous than that needed to fly an empty positioning leg).  There also won't be a fleet of coaches sitting there ready to go - that's not to say that four hours is reasonable though....

As with so many claims, it's not necessarily cut and dried one way or the other, so see what they come back with and take it from there!

Thanks very much, I'll wait and see what they say to begin with and then come back if I have any other questions!