Should I help my OH subsidise his nasty ex so the kids can see their Mum?

19lottie82

Bit of a complicated (and long) one here.

I have been with my partner for 2.5 years. He split up with his ex wife 3.5 years ago. He left her and took their 2 daughters (who are currently now 8 and 12), as she was a chronic alcoholic. She used to go on benders that would result in her being hospitalised / sectioned….. he tried to help her and stayed with her for 3 years but eventually had to leave.

When we got together her relationship with the kids was pretty inconsistent as she would go through phases of drinking, not drinking, drinking…… you get the picture. However, for the last 9 months she has managed to give up drinking and attends AA meetings twice a week, so my OH lets her take the kids 3 nights a week and he takes them 4.

Now although she has managed to give up drinking she is still a major PITA. Constantly badmouthing my OH to the girls, (Despite all of her wrong doings, my OH and I NEVER bad mouth her in front of the kids) trying to start fights with him in front of the kids, sending him nasty text messages and, even though she has only met me once in passing she totally hates my guts and isn’t afraid to vocalise this. I do understand why – it’s obvious that I have what she wants, even though it’s all her own fault she lost it in the first place. BUT we wish she could just have a bit of dignity, for the sake of her kids, if nothing else, be civil and move on.
She doesn’t work, after being made redundant about 4 years ago. I think she could, as she volunteers 12 hours a week. She tells my OH that she is constantly looking for jobs, but I think she is just being a bit picky as to what she is applying for. Before things got bad, she had a pretty decent job and I think she is expecting to go back in at that level again, but let’s face it, after being out of work for 4 years, I don’t think this is totally realistic, especially in this day and age.

My OH works, but doesn’t earn great wages. As he has been the RP since they split and pays for everything, he claims child tax credits and child benefit. He gives her a percentage of this every month which she says is to help her “look after the kids” but we all know that it is far more than she spends on the children. She never does anything with them, all they do is sit in her flat. She never buys them anything (all she has bought them in the last 3 years is a pair of Primark tights each!). At birthdays and Christmas he ends up buying them presents and giving them to her to give to them, as he knows they wouldn’t get anything otherwise because she would plead poverty.

So, the problem is this….. we are considering moving in together next year. At the moment he lives in a flat which is a bit far out from the girls school / friends. I also live in a small flat. If we pooled our resources we could afford a nicer, larger house in a better area, where the girls could have their own rooms etc BUT if we did and combined our incomes, his tax credits would stop. I have no problems with my money becoming his and his becoming mine and using this to support the kids as they are cracking girls and I want us all to have a future together. What I do have a problem with is, to put it bluntly, using our potential joint income to fund his nasty ex, because she can’t be bothered to work.

We have discussed it and he agrees with me but the 2 main outcomes would be one, she will totally kick off and I mean TOTALLY! And guess who’s fault it will be?
And secondly, yes, she prob won’t be able to afford to look after the girls 3 nights a week if the only income she has is housing benefit and JSA! Can I really sit back and watch this happen, or should we agree to give her £x a week, so the kids can stay there?

We aren’t flush ourselves but hope to maintain a reasonably OK lifestyle for the kids, ie keep paying for their dance classes three times a week and an annual holiday. I don’t want the kids not to be able to stay with their Mum 3 nights a week, but should we really subsidise her to take care of her own kids because she won’t get a job? I feel like we are stuck between a rock and a hard place here. If she was civil, did the best she could for her kids all of the time and was really making an effort to find work, then maybe I would feel slightly different, but she doesn’t so I don’t! But then again, it’s not fair the kids should suffer!

Also, before anyone asks, I have discussed this with my OH in principle, but I’m just looking for some other viewpoints on how to tackle this situation before it becomes a reality and we need to deal with it head on.

Thanks in advance.

NewKittenHelp

Is it really in the best interests of the children to spend such a large proportion of the week with this awful woman?

I honestly think your OH needs to grow a pair. He's being taken advantage of and it needs to stop. I've never heard of the resident parent paying maintenance to the non-resident parent! I'd be worrying about the damage that this woman is inflicting on the children.

19lottie82

NewKittenHelp wrote: »

Is it really in the best interests of the children to spend such a large proportion of the week with this awful woman?

I honestly think your OH needs to grow a pair. He's being taken advantage of and it needs to stop. I've never heard of the resident parent paying maintenance to the non-resident parent! I'd be worrying about the damage that this woman is inflicting on the children.

You're right about the maintenance payments, and as much as she is a PITA she's still the kids mum and at the moment we can't stop her seeing her kids, her wrong doings aren't that bad (at the moment).
If my OH did try to stop access the kids would be miserable and IMO there isn't a judge in the country that would deny her access, considering she has been off the drink for 9 months and is going to AA meetings.....

GobbledyGook

I think it depends on how much you are talking about. If it's enough to ensure the children get decent food there then perhaps, but if it's essentially funding her then I wouldn't.

Is there an amount that you'd both be happy with? Could your OH start cutting down what he is giving her between now and then so that by then it's at a level you are both happy with?

NewKittenHelp

19lottie82 wrote: »

You're right about the maintenance payments, and as much as she is a PITA she's still the kids mum and at the moment we can't stop her seeing her kids, her wrong doings aren't that bad (at the moment).
If my OH did try to stop access the kids would be miserable and IMO there isn't a judge in the country that would deny her access, considering she has been off the drink for 9 months and is going to AA meetings.....

If all the kids do is sit inside her flat and listen to her shout abuse about their dad and her, I can't see how they'd be miserable.

They're the children of an addict, they probably feel responsible for her. If I were your OH I'd stop giving her any money at all and if that means that she can only have the kids for one or two nights a week then that's all for the better.

tenke

Oh God, this is a tough one !!:eek:

You are really nice to care about the children so much, well done!!:j

Part of me thinks is unfair, the ex should put the burden on all of you to carry out her parental duties.

Let's say that both of you said, enough is enough, she should still try to get a grip to be able to be with the children as any parent would wish.

I dont know if tough love, could work here, but somehow, motherhood and its joys should earned and worked for, I think, then again there are feelings, people involved and it is tough

I wish you and OH can get to a solution which would bring you both some relief, you both seem to deserve it badly !!;):)

Fire_Fox

Is she declaring the additional income from the father? In no way am I defending her actions, but addiction is a mental health condition so it's right the mother should be able to limit what sort of jobs she applies for - she will always be at risk of a relapse. Given her history the Jobcentre should be aware of her limitations and have sanctioned them. Generally all jobseekers are expected to apply for minimum wage roles after a certain period of unemployed.

What does the mother say she needs money for, food? If so maybe send groceries or supermarket vouchers. Send them with all the clothing, toiletries and pocket money they need. Is the current financial and contact arrangement formal or informal? If the latter maybe formalise it? As part of that there should be a place to formally agree certain behaviours that are unacceptable. If that is written in court documents the mother would be in hot water if she bad mouth or abuse the father.

thehappybutterfly

Realistically, why does she need money to "look after" her own kids? So they sit in her flat. Not the end of the world is it? In my experience, that's what most kids do when they visit the absent parent - particularly if it's the father who is the absent parent. I agree that it's unlikely she's spending what money she gets from your partner on the girls so don't give her any. That's up to her to either manage her money better or get a job. Besides, there are loads of things she could do with the girls that cost little or no money - baking, going to the park, museums are free etc. You could help out by buying the girls cinema tickets and providing their snacks (don't pay cinema prices!) and possibly a ticket for mum so she can't use her skintness as an excuse for not going. Just don't give her cash whatever you do. I agree that your OH has to stand up to her - I think it's unlikely she'll get custody if she threatens to fight for it - the 12 YO is old enough to decide for herself who she lives with and most lawyers etc are reluctant to split siblings up. As long as you and your OH are in agreement, you can do this. Just watch that he's not going behind your back and slipping her the odd tenner here and there. Kick his archie if he is!

Erinnire

I would put a stop to giving her money above a percentage of the child benefit which I think is nice of your OH, She gets enough for herself to live on, the CB she gets from your OH should be enough to support the girls whilst they are there.

If her behaviour is a bad as you say then I would probably cut down contact aswell. The kids may well adore her but it surely is not a healthy enviroment for them to be in constantly having their father and his partner bad mouthed...

maman

If she takes them nowhere and buys them nothing then we're only talking about food.

If I were your DH I'd tell her that you two are planning to get a family sized house together close to the girls' school and so they can have a garden and that then he won't be able to afford to give her money. If he really wanted to he could say he's stopping now as he needs to save towards the house move, buy school uniforms, save for Christmas whatever.

She can say what she likes but if she stops/cuts down on seeing the girls and blames you both you'll know that's not true. If she wants to see them enough she'll sort herself out (which to be fair she has to an extent) so that she can take on some paid work or she'll make a few sacrifices in her own spending to put a few meals on the table.

ETA: I suppose that part of the CB would be a gesture and surely enough for a bit of food.

GobbledyGook

If he wants to save the peace then he could cut it to a percentage of the child benefit on the basis that he won't be getting tax credits because of all the changes and cut backs (obviously that only works if she doesn't know his exact wages) instead of the loss of tax credits being due to your joint income.