Paypal loophole which allows people to scam you

springonion

Hi,

This is the first time I've tried posting on here so a big hello to everyone and apologies if this is in the wrong place.

Just thought I'd let everyone know of a scam which I have been caught out on to the tune of £160.

I've been using Ebay for about 5 years now and never really had any real bad experiences. I've learnt you don't send the goods till the money is definately in your account. The problem is I've seem to have fallen foul of a PAYPAL process which can be used to scam things off you.

I sold a plasma TV stand and Speakers on Ebay for £160. Due to the size I was sending them by next day courier. I used Parcel2Go which is an Ebay recognised provider. In turn they actual courier was Home Delivery Network Ltd.

The buyer paid for the goods on a Friday (about 3 days after end of auction). The paypal payment was received by me about 2 in the afternoon. Thats cool - I can send the goods out now. So I call the courier company and they can pick up Monday now because the weekend is now on us. They can't do earlier. Thats cool - I send the buyer an email. All ok.

Courier picks up goods on Monday and off they go. Buyer then issues a Paypal complaint to say he hasn't received them. Paypal immiediately take the money off me pending proof of delivery. I provide tracking numbers and everything but paypal say not good enough and give the money back to buyer. I ask the courier company for details of deilvery including POD which proves the buyer received them and the exact trip that the goods take. So I appeal to Paypal. They have turned it down again saying no proof of delivery.

The problem seems to be because paypal is automated and theres no way of talking to a human. Because of this you can't argue with the computer.

The long and short of it is I am in my 2nd appeal which will probabley result in the automated refund of money to the buyer.

To make it worse I received an email from the buyer saying "unlucky" about not receiving the money.

So basically - If you accpet payment through paypal. I'd transfer the money out of your paypal account right away as its no guarantee you've actually got the money or will indeed keep it.

I guess thats a training lesson which cost me £160 !!

Sugar_Coated_Owl

Even if you transfer the money to your bank account it makes no difference. It can still be reclaimed. Alternatively PayPal will make your PayPal balance negative meaning that you have add funds to bring it back into positive.

Parcel2Go isn't listed on PayPal as acceptable for online tracking.

doingwhatican

I would put in a claim with the small claims court against paypal, especially if I have proof of delivery of the items. I would fight back.

Moglex

springonion wrote: »

I guess thats a training lesson which cost me £160 !!

Only if you are prepared to allow it to.

You need to email the buyer telling him that you have positive proof of delivery and that you will be making a formal complaint of fraud to the police.

If he's got any sense he will pay up at this point.

If not you need to get in touch with the police and actually make the compliant.

There was an excellent and comprehensive post here a few days ago about how to do that in such a way that it is treated seriously.

Edit: I would love to see someone put in a small claims court case against paypants in a case like this as doingwhatican has suggested. It's certainly worth thinking about if other methods don't work.

I did suggest it to be made a sticky but unfortunately, it hasn't been. Perhaps if anyone can remember which thread it was on they would be kind enough to post a link.

springonion

doingwhatican wrote: »

I would put in a claim with the small claims court against paypal, especially if I have proof of delivery of the items. I would fight back.

Thanks for that - good idea - But who do I take to court - Paypal or the original buyer? I feel it should be paypal as they are the ones with holding the payment but I suspect due to the size of them they just say we provide a payment service thats it. But there again its Paypal which is taking the money off me.

springonion

Moglex wrote: »

Only if you are prepared to allow it to.

You need to email the buyer telling him that you have positive proof of delivery and that you will be making a formal complaint of fraud to the police.

If he's got any sense he will pay up at this point.

If not you need to get in touch with the police and actually make the compliant.

There was an excellent and comprehensive post here a few days ago about how to do that in such a way that it is treated seriously.

I did suggest it to be made a sticky but unfortunately, it hasn't been. Perhaps if anyone can remember which thread it was on they would be kind enough to post a link.

Cheers for that moglex :beer: - I'll do that - I'll take a look first and see if I can see it on these forums but if anyone finds it before me could they let me know. I don't feel that people should get away with this.

smashed

Do the sensible thing. PHONE paypal, it always makes it a lot easier for them to see your viewpoint.

Sugar_Coated_Owl

I find it quite rude when someone posts a question/asks for advice and only acknowledges those replies that they were hoping for. Why post for advice in the first place if you aren't willing to see different POVs *sigh*

*rant over*

smashed

Dont worry , its a noob

Moglex

razorbladekisses wrote: »

I find it quite rude when someone posts a question/asks for advice and only acknowledges those replies that they were hoping for. Why post for advice in the first place if you aren't willing to see different POVs *sigh*

Thanks are voluntary.

Moglex

smashed wrote: »

Dont worry , its a noob

New or not, thanks are voluntary.