Likely outcome of refusal to supply cv to working links

john539

FOX_HOUND wrote: »

"Why not" isn't the issue!

I don't think "attitude" has any legal basis for sanctioning a claimant.

Working Links, more like the particular advisor he has, may threaten what they want to get their own way.

They should know the rules anyway, certainly manager should, so may never refer to Jobcentre as it could backfire on them.

What happens at the Jobcentre when they check the rules is a different matter.

atrixblue.-MFR-.

look at the bigger picture, if someone is in witness protection for their own safety, supplying current uptodate information that can be easily accessed by unknown thirdparty's or the public could potentially compromise this.

as for an employer requesting a e-mail CV, you can simply say i'll post it to you with a covering letter is this ok.

FOX_HOUND

withabix wrote: »

Sounds like he isn't actually looking for a job.

He complies with the job seeking agreement when signing on.

True intention is neither here nor there.

rogerblack

FOX_HOUND wrote: »

Are you suggesting that the law should be ignored with regards to benefit claimants?

If my understanding of the data protection act is correct then information cannot be passed to third parties without express consent.

Therefore in sanctioning a claimant the DWP would be at the very least going against the essence of that law. And I'm not aware of any conditionality within the laws of job seekers allowance which suggests otherwise.

You are required to follow a direction given to you by the jobcentre.
Going to working links, and participating in the program is such a direction.

If you do not participate fully, they do not have to give you benefit.

The data protection act here is a red herring.

There are many acts that it would be illegal for someone to do to you, without your consent, that you may in some circumstances be required to consent to, either legally, or financially.

For example, fingerprints being taken by the police.
Or allowing someone in to inspect your electricity meter, or ...

In general, courts apply the spirit of the law, only when it is not overruled by the letter of the law.

Lady_strange

I am sure that he wouldn't mind giving his details over if there was a free prize draw to win a car, or loads of money?

If he is not prepared to let a company help him find work, by giving them a copy of his cv, then to any reasonable person he is not prepared to help himself. And will probably be sanctioned by the job center. These forums are full of people failing ESA claims, and they genuinly can not work, where as we see people who can work, don't play the game, and won't jump through half the hoops you have to, to get ESA, why should they be allowed to get away with it?

FOX_HOUND

bullbar wrote: »

Rubbish!!! Intention is the driving force behind all laws and decisions.

Are you a mind reader? Plenty of them on MSE it would appear. The claimant fulfills his job seekers agreement by applying for 3 jobs in proper manner, attends working links punctually, looks at the internet for job search and so on. The job centre has never sanctioned him so must be happy with his conduct.

But you seem to know otherwise!

FOX_HOUND

rogerblack wrote: »

You are required to follow a direction given to you by the jobcentre.
Going to working links, and participating in the program is such a direction.

If you do not participate fully, they do not have to give you benefit.

The data protection act here is a red herring.

There are many acts that it would be illegal for someone to do to you, without your consent, that you may in some circumstances be required to consent to, either legally, or financially.

For example, fingerprints being taken by the police.
Or allowing someone in to inspect your electricity meter, or ...

In general, courts apply the spirit of the law, only when it is not overruled by the letter of the law.

Customer Consent to Sharing/Disclosure of Personal Information Providers are reminded that they are required to obtain customer consent prior to their collecting of customer's personal information and sharing/disclosure of such information with the Department and/or other providers.

In addition, the customer must give clear written consent for the provider to use customer personal information when contacting employers to obtain evidence of employment.
These consents must be given by the customer before any information disclosure takes place.

The following notice was published in the 'Notices to Providers' section of the 'Supplying DWP' page on the DWP Website on 6 May 2008:

Compliance with Data Protection Act and Information Disclosure
All contracted employment providers must, as a matter of urgency, review the arrangements they have in place for collecting, processing and sharing customer information.
It is important to remind a customer of the DWP confidentiality statement which they signed when they first made a claim to benefit. However, a customer's signature which only acknowledges awareness of the DWP Confidentiality Statement does not constitute "consent" at all and does not enable any sort of data sharing or disclosure. It simply provides a degree of assurance that DWP will handle personal data fairly and lawfully.
There is no specific legislative "enabler" which gives a provider the ability to gather or share customer's information with a third party, for example an employer or another training provider, for the purpose of placing the customer into training/work and obtaining outcome-related payments from DWP. The informed consent of the individual must be obtained beforehand, in line with the requirements of the Data Protection Act.
The information disclosure consent form must, as a minimum, contain the following information:

1. 1. What customer's information your organisation will collect
   2. why the organisation needs the information, for example for the purpose recording the numbers of customers placed into training and/or employment , monitoring the effectiveness of the service and reporting outcomes to DWP and claiming associated payments
   3. how the information will be stored
   4. when and why the information will be shared with a third party, for example an employer will be contacted when the customer starts work within so many weeks of leaving provision for the purpose of obtaining evidence of employment so that a job outcome payment can be claimed from DWP

Your organisation needs to make it clear to customers that giving consent is voluntary and that refusal to give consent or withdrawal of an existing consent will not affect any benefit they may be entitle

http://www.dwp.gov.uk/supplying-dwp/what-we-buy/welfare-to-work-services/notices-to-providers/generic-prov-guide-ch-5.shtml

This document from the DWP seems to contradict your argument about compulsion.

The DWP don't seem to think that the data protection act is a "red herring."

FOX_HOUND

Lady_strange wrote: »

I am sure that he wouldn't mind giving his details over if there was a free prize draw to win a car, or loads of money?

If he is not prepared to let a company help him find work, by giving them a copy of his cv, then to any reasonable person he is not prepared to help himself. And will probably be sanctioned by the job center. These forums are full of people failing ESA claims, and they genuinly can not work, where as we see people who can work, don't play the game, and won't jump through half the hoops you have to, to get ESA, why should they be allowed to get away with it?

I do not believe that he will be sanctioned by the job centre as the document I provided appears to suggest otherwise. Whether the job centre bend the rules is another matter. And this is not about ESA, this is about JSA conditionality.

FOX_HOUND

bullbar wrote: »

What a load of bunkum!

You can quote what you like, but your friend, if he/she refuses to carry out any direction legally required of him and in accordance with his JS contract, will find that the benefit is witheld legally or whatever. It would then be up to your friend to challenge that decision in the courts at his/her cost!

And if he/she like you has the ability to carry out that challenge, then it shows that he/she has a modicum of intelligence that could be better put to finding work instead of relying on the minimum requirements needed.

Give up while you are ahead. Political arguments and opinions driven by what seems to be a distaste of all things JSAwise will get you nowhere except to be a 'target' for the DWP to administer all manner of future decisions that others would probably get away with. Your firend is on a hiding to nowhere!

No one likes a smart !!!! especially a government department. If this had happened to me years ago, I would have done everything and anything possible to make your friend's life as miserable as possible - all legal of course!

Just a simple question - why doesn't he/she want to do everything possible that might lead to employment?

Legality is the entire crux of this discussion. The document quoted is the DWP'S own guidelines. It would appear that these guidelines are as they are because of the data protection act. To bend them by sanctioning on other spurious grounds in an act of revenge which you suggest is both unethical and immoral.

Lets get back to the original question. Will witholding storage of a cv from working links lead to legitimate sanctioning?

Morlock

FOX_HOUND wrote: »

Lets get back to the original question. Will witholding storage of a cv from working links lead to legitimate sanctioning?

I doubt it, they have no right to store or disseminate information to third-parties without his consent. He should be able to show then a CV, but is not required to give them a copy.