Primary school putting kids "in the naughty corner" if they need the toilet

milliebear00001

Sparklyfairy wrote: »

Honestly? YES it IS possible & it has happened...you're not sure why I felt I needed to take 'advice' on this? You have a huge chip on your shoulder & I think you need to reconsider yourself as a teacher if that's your attitude. If it's SO rare as you say, why have SEVERAL posters agreed with me with very similar experiences? Why has a family taken the action of going to the papers & news to tell their very similar story?

Frankly with your attitude, I feel for the mental & physical safety of the children you teach, milliesbear. Have you heard that it'll easier to sack teachers soon? Unless you have something useful to post, don't bother...

LOL! And here's me thinking you'd put me on ignore...

I just don't understand why people post if it's only to have their own point of view validated, rather than hear different points of view. Your complete overreaction to my simple question though, tells me a lot.

Nicki

I'm not sure why the thread has now descended into bashing milliebear just because she doubted that a 6 year old would be asked to clean up a puddle of urine rather than just perhaps being asked to drop some kitchen paper on top of it. It also sounds implausible to me that a 6 year old would be asked to do this. Milliebear's other comments on the issue were perfectly in line with OP's own

milliebear00001 wrote: »

I haven't read all the other comments because threads like this almost always descend into teacher bashing, and I am one!

For what it's worth, I think very young children need to be allowed to go to the toilet when they need to, but should be 'encouraged' to go to the toilet at break and lunch - it is perfectly feasible for all children to visit the loo at these times - schools generally have several toilets!

An older child (such as your year 4 child) can be expected to take responsibility for going to the loo at appropriate times, unless there is a genuine reason not to - such as illness. I teach Y5 and would certainly expect children to avoid going during my teaching time.

Having said that, teachers usually get to know the children with weak bladders/those who will 'try it on' and those who are genuine. We will usually make allowances. My favourite weapon is to ask the child to come back and ask in five minutes (they usually forget if they don't really need to go) or I will (if I am suspicious of their motives) ask them to 'make up' the time at play.

Yes, going to the loo during the lesson can be very disruptive - esp. if it's 'open season' for all to go whenever they want. We do generally need something in place to try to prevent this. I would suggest (and would always suggest) that if you are unhappy with something occurring in your child's class, that you have a quiet, calm word with the class teacher in the first instance, and then, and only then, escalate to the Head if you are still unsatisfied with the response you get. This will 'mark you out' as a concerned parent, rather than a confrontational 'knee-jerker who doesn't bother to find out the facts - we get many of those, and as you say, they do become rather 'notorious' through the school.

I'm just not sure to be honest that OP has dealt with this in the best way possible. She is rude to any teachers trying to give another perspective to the situation, disregards what the teachers and TAs have told her happens in reality to make a point (ie they say the children are discouraged from going out just after a break, which has been expanded to say they can't go out at all), and engaged in a shouting match with the head on the subject based on the information provided by a 6 year old, culminating with threats to go to the local authority and Ofsted before all the facts were in, and before she had spoken to the teachers and TAs about what was happening. I do wonder where her children were when this was all happening if it is a small village school and it happened after school...

Sparklyfairy wrote: »

Hanging by a thread - thanks, your post means a lot. I will say it did get somewhat heated as the head would ask a question, I'd start to answer, then she'd talk over me resulting in both of us getting louder. It was away from earshot of anyone (school was virtually empty) but I think she clearly wasn't expecting to be discussing this as she darted from point to point without any clear answer & surely didn't want to hear what I had to say.

Hanging_by_a_thread

milliebear00001 wrote: »

fingers in ears, la, la, la...

Is this what you do whenever you are disagreed with or somebody offers a point of view other than your own?

I dont think it was necessarilly just what you said in your post that caused the upset. It was also the tone of your post. It came across to me that you were talking down to the OP. You also inferred that there was no need for her to take advice, which whether you meant it to or not, undermines her. I dont want to get into any argument with you or anyone else on here. As you are finding though, going by the battle above, adults dont respond well to being addressed in the way you have chosen to reply to them.

I am sure everyone on here is very good at their job, and dedicated in their field. Please can we keep this thread on track and try to help someone who purely has the best interest of their child at heart. No one can criticise the OP for just wanting to be a good mum, surely.

milliebear00001

Hanging_by_a_thread wrote: »

I dont think it was necessarilly just what you said in your post that caused the upset. It was also the tone of your post. It came across to me that you were talking down to the OP. You also inferred that there was no need for her to take advice, which whether you meant it to or not, undermines her. I dont want to get into any argument with you or anyone else on here. As you are finding though, going by the battle above, adults dont respond well to being addressed in the way you have chosen to reply to them.

I am sure everyone on here is very good at their job, and dedicated in their field. Please can we keep this thread on track and try to help someone who purely has the best interest of their child at heart. No one can criticise the OP for just wanting to be a good mum, surely.

Hmm, while the OP's responses have been entirely proportional I suppose? The OP hasn't liked any of the responses that disagreed with her fundamental premise that the school was entirely at fault and that she had full grasp of the facts. Several others have suggested this might not be the case, but she is not prepared to accept any of those points at all - only those of the 'hang 'em' brigade.

Given the story she has told here, there was no need for advice. Any reasonable parent would have immediately complained - if those were the full facts.

Sparklyfairy

Nicki - several other parents have also had this problem within the school, especially within this past week - not just me. The Head started shouting at me. How was I rude? I stated 1 teacher was more than fine with everything, ALL TEACHERS & TA's CONFIRMED CHILDREN ARE PUT IN THE NAUGHTY CORNER FOR ASKING TO USE THE LOO - re-read this thread if you missed that bit. Trust me, enough facts are in for Ofsted to be involved. Next time, read a bit more, then post..

Sparklyfairy

milliebear00001 wrote: »

Given the story she has told here, there was no need for advice. Any reasonable parent would have immediately complained - if those were the full facts.

You're so simplistic..things don't work that way, I stated I have never had this issue or any other with a school before. You, on the other hand, WORK as a teacher & your attitude suggests you know the complaints system rather well..

Thank you all so so much for the wonderful advice which I've gained here which has been very useful..I'm not going to post on this thread anymore & I've asked the mods to lock this thread because of how it's descending..such a shame..but I hope it helps anyone else out there who may be concerned for their children. xxxxxx

Nicki

I have read the whole thread, but with the distance of not having a child involved.

The timeline you laid out was

Child comes out of class tells you her version of events
You go to head and a shouting match ensues. You say head was cutting across you, I suspect she would say you wouldn't let her answer the questions you were firing at her. You said you both started shouting, not that the head shouted at you, or shouted first
Whilst with the head, you suddenly decided to speak to the teacher, so hadn't done this before you went steaming round.
The teachers and TAs said they are out in the corner for asking to use the loo WITHIN 10 OR 20 MINUTES of coming back from the break (as we are all apparently shouting now), is what you admitted in an earlier post. You are now making it appear that they are punished for asking for the loo at any point in the school day.

Like a few others I have read everything, and have a slightly different opinion to you is all. You may find the Chair of Governors, Local Authority and Ofsted agree with you that all children of whatever age should be able to go to the loo at any time in the school day, or you may find they agree with some of us that it is not unreasonable for the school to ask them to wait for a very short period after break times to encourage them to go to the loo during breaks if possible. Knowing that 2 possible views of the situation exist might help when framing your letter of complaint?

thatgirlsam

milliebear00001 wrote: »

Not at all, but I'm guessing I know a hell of a lot more teachers than you do and that, therefore, my impression of them might be a little more, um, 'rounded' than yours appears to be. I would never, for example, claim to know what a 'typical' teacher (or nurse) is like.

To be able to draw any conclusions from personal experiences, you need to have had more than one or two of them - just saying .

:rotfl::rotfl:

Your impression of teachers will be a little biased? No?

You think I have only had 1 or 2 teachers as patients?

Wow! You assume a lot Millie

You can 'just say' all you like, it doesn't make your posts any more intelligent to me

mumps

After reading some of the posts on here I am so glad I home schooled till mine were in year 4.

milliebear00001

thatgirlsam wrote: »

:rotfl::rotfl:

Your impression of teachers will be a little biased? No?

You think I have only had 1 or 2 teachers as patients?

Wow! You assume a lot Millie

You can 'just say' all you like, it doesn't make your posts any more intelligent to me

Not at all. I know a lot of teachers - some bad, some good, some indifferent. Some have great people skills, some have few. Rather like the entire population of the country I imagine.

It is you who are trying to say 'teachers' have something in common with each other, other than their job. I would never say this, least of all that all teachers are perfect.

I expect though, that you think having had more than 'one or two' teachers as patients makes you an expert on their 'type', as clearly you will have really got to know them in their normal capacity, rather than at their most vulnerable, under those circumstances won't you?

I wonder if you form judgements about the majority of Police officers, engineers, solicitors, builders, accountants etc etc in the same way?

I actually cannot believe you are still trying to defend this viewpoint.