Primary school putting kids "in the naughty corner" if they need the toilet

milliebear00001

Sparklyfairy wrote: »

She cleaned it up with a disposable towel from the toilets. No chemical cleaners were used by her. She changed herself with the spare clothes she was given by the teacher - no TA involved. Who knows if the TA later cleaned the chair with chemicals? SHE WAS MADE TO CLEAN THE BULK OF IT HERSELF.

Millie - what is your point? Are you calling me a liar? Perhaps what you stated happens in YOUR class - but it isn't happening in my daughters!! And no, we are not the family with the child that had cancer, (Liberty I believe). Clearly a coincidence. This is happening on a much larger scale than you care to recognise. Therefore I'd appreciate it if your posts contained helpful information rather than the accusing tone you have supplied here...

I'm sure you would...

Perhaps your daughter was asked to place a paper towel over the mess as the TA wasn't available, so no other child would sit/stand in it. 'Cleaned up' is something very open to interpretation, which is why I asked for clarification. Something I am sure you have done with the class teacher yourself.

I am telling you, and everyone else who might be interested, what my experience (as an experienced teacher across many schools) has been. You have experience of a single perspective. I have experience of many, many similar scenarios.

What I am telling you, is that the experience you describe is unlikely in the extreme - although not impossible. If it is true, then it clearly merits a complaint, and I'm not sure why you even felt you needed to take 'advice' on that.

harrassedmum

This is an area that has annoyed me since my first child went to school 26
years ago. If a child needs the loo the child needs the loo absolutely no excuse in preventing or publicly penalizing a child for this.

Before I became to ill to work, I was a psychiatric nurse working in the High Dependency Unit at a High Security Hospital. We had many extremely violent and unpredictable patients that needed to be nursed in locked seclusion rooms that for reasons had no toilet facilities within the room. But when they requested to use the loo of course we allowed ou get on.them to. It is a basic human right which you will find in section 8 of the human rights act, this act covers everyone including our children. Nobody has the right to deny a child toilet facilities under any circumstances. And no child should be punished nor denied this right.

Look up the Human Rights Act and you will find the clause that covers this. I copied it and sent this to my childrens teacher, Head Teacher and the school Governors quoting this right and never after that had a problem. So good luck and let us know how y

mrcow

harrassedmum wrote: »

This is an area that has annoyed me since my first child went to school 26
years ago. If a child needs the loo the child needs the loo absolutely no excuse in preventing or publicly penalizing a child for this.

Not all children who ask to use the loo NEED the loo though. Some children use it as an avoidance tactic in order to miss lessons. Spend any time working in a normal classroom and you'll know this.

Working out which ones actually need to go and which ones use it as a regular excuse to get out of class isn't very hard though.

Otherwise, yes, if a kid needs to go to the toilet, then obviously, let them go, or it could be you cleaning up the consequences!

Sparklyfairy

milliesbear - your posts do not deserve my attention anymore & will be ignored from now on...

Sparklyfairy

harrassedmum wrote: »

This is an area that has annoyed me since my first child went to school 26
years ago. If a child needs the loo the child needs the loo absolutely no excuse in preventing or publicly penalizing a child for this.

Before I became to ill to work, I was a psychiatric nurse working in the High Dependency Unit at a High Security Hospital. We had many extremely violent and unpredictable patients that needed to be nursed in locked seclusion rooms that for reasons had no toilet facilities within the room. But when they requested to use the loo of course we allowed ou get on.them to. It is a basic human right which you will find in section 8 of the human rights act, this act covers everyone including our children. Nobody has the right to deny a child toilet facilities under any circumstances. And no child should be punished nor denied this right.

Look up the Human Rights Act and you will find the clause that covers this. I copied it and sent this to my childrens teacher, Head Teacher and the school Governors quoting this right and never after that had a problem. So good luck and let us know how y

Thank you very much! I truly hope that's the end of it, but as this debate has been ongoing within the school for years, I'm not so sure...However, as the head is due to reture soon, lets hope it's sooner rather than later!

Thanks so much as well for stating the Human Rights section that pertains to this...this will come in handy if I need to escallate the complaint.

Sparklyfairy

Hanging_by_a_thread wrote: »

The only bit of your post I disagree with is highlighted above. I endured a different circumstance in my early school days, to that which your daughter is coping with now. However it left me in fear of my teacher and her reactions, not just to the situation where she had responded so badly, but to day to day things. I spent most of that school year regressing because I felt unable to approach her.

For children to do well academically they need to feel comfortable physically and emotionally. The world has gone mad with political correctness, what can be said or done between adults. I think this thread has highlighted some very worrying evidence, that children are being badly treated, in a place where they should be as well looked after as if in their own homes.

I agree with you. I suppose what I meant was that, academically, at the school my children are learning (& seem to be comprehending) much more than their friends at other local schools. Also their Ofsted & SATS results are very good as well.

I have seen such a relief in my children's faces in that they now know that SHOULD it happen again, they will not be punished by me (as they feared) & that fear you mention was/is there. I don't know why this seems to be lacking in so many schools - it's such a small school & close environment common sense seems to go out the window. I can also imagine at least 1 teacher unable to speak up about this against the Head, probably for fear of losing their job & I suspect this is commonplace in the other schools doing this around the country. But, having said all that, we have been stressing to our kids that yes, break times need to also be LOO VISIT times - why the school doesn't ask the parents to remind the kids this is beyond me. I wish they would remind the kids as well, something very simple but seems to be lacking there lately.

bylromarha

Apologies - not read the whole thread, but year 1 teacher here.

Has anyone mentioned the effect this has on learning?

I have toilets in my classroom and 1 child going means 4 more follow that child as they suddenly need to go as they see someone else going. The noise from the toilet and the sinks, and children taking forever washing their hands, means that my 15 minute carpet teaching time is disrupted for everybody as my thought process can't work well, meaning the class can't work well, when I see a child playing around on the taps.

I then have to go back and plug the gaps in those childrens' learning who've been in the loo.

I stop my lessons 5 minutes before lunch time and dinner time in order for everyone to have a try in the toilet, and get their full break, but still get those who come in after break and tell me they need a wee. They are told to wait and reminded that before break was the time they should have tried. If I see the wee wiggle, I send them off, but most 6 year olds do not have a problem conforming to the school rules. If there is a medical issue, then that's a different kettle.

I also wouldn't have a problem with my 5 year old daughter being punished by her school if she was constantly being reminded to go to the loo, being given opportunities to go to the loo on several occasions, then asking to go to the loo at a time the school have deemed inapropriate. I know she can go just fine 90 minutes without needing a wee and had she followed the instructions given to use the loo at the appropriate time, then she knew she could have avoided the punishment.

As a teacher, I can't just abandon my class for a comfort stop, I have to go at the appropriate times. I learnt the appropriate times and bladder control in my infant school - todays kids are not so different. Majority of my class don't need to ask to go during lesson time as they have been trained that Mrs Bylro is pleased with them when they go before lunch and playtime as they are the right times to have a try.

balletshoes

punished by being sent to the naughty corner? really? for going to the toilet?

Thats the part of this whole scenario I still disagree with - by all means try to bring in a policy where children are encouraged and given time before breaks etc to try to go to the toilet, I completely understand that a lot of children asking to go to the toilet in classtime is disruptive to everyone.

But being punished for asking to go to the toilet, and that punishment being stood in the naughty corner - my gast is still flabbered. Surely that punishment is fairly disruptive to a class too?

thatgirlsam

I wonder what the effect on learning is for a child who is scared to ask for the toilet if they need to go

Learning at school should be fun and enjoyable at age 6 - being worried about the timing of your bodily functions can not be conducive to a good learning environment.

I agree with encouragement of appropriate timing but not punishments if your body doesn't comply!

Sparklyfairy

thatgirlsam wrote: »

I wonder what the effect on learning is for a child who is scared to ask for the toilet if they need to go

Learning at school should be fun and enjoyable at age 6 - being worried about the timing of your bodily functions can not be conducive to a good learning environment.

I agree with encouragement of appropriate timing but not punishments if your body doesn't comply!

I agree, too! If my lo school reminded them to go, that would help. Being punished for it, no way. Not in primary school. Yes class disruption is a nuisance. Yes kids WILL want to go when they see their friends go BUT if the teachers perhaps TOOK the kids to use the loo at set times throughout the day (before breaks? Inbetween breaks? What ever suits...) Kids with overactive bladders, etc obviously should get to go regardless. It's the PUNISHMENT for a 6 year old that I don't understand...