New power of attorney guide

BusyBee365

Back in 2007 my parents solicitor prepared an enduring power of attorney for each parent appointing me as attorney.
I have never had to use either EPA. 

My father died 7 years ago and my mother now finds dealing with money problematic as she has no mobile or laptop and doesn’t want either.
 She has full capacity to deal with her affairs and decided to add me to her bank account so I could pay for things online rather than me buying with my money and then her repaying me by cheque which can mean a purpose trip for me into the bank to pay any cheque over £500.
She made the appointment at her bank and we both went with all the necessary ID documents. 

At the bank she was asked if she had a will and power of attorney. She said she had at which point the bank flatly refused to add me to her account or to allow us to open a new joint account! 

I tried to explain that the EPA was not relevant as it was my mothers application not an application by me as attorney  but they wouldn’t budge - suggesting the only way round it was to revoke the EPA add me to the account and then do a new LPA! They couldn’t tell me why this was the only way or why they had this rule so we just left.
As Martin advocates everyone having a power of attorney (sensibly I think) how does this stack up with not being able to have a joint account with the attorney even if they are a spouse or adult child! V frustrating.

Primrose

I feel your frustration.  I think half the time bank staff don,t understand what a P of A is or how it should work.

Whatever  you do I suggest not revoking the old EPA until a new one is in place. That in my view is extremely unprofessional and negligent advice for a bank to give.   If your mother were hospitalised with a stroke tomorrow which left her incapable of managing her affairs doing what they suggest would leave her interests entirely unprotected and you without the power to act for her  ( which proves how ignorant they are in this field in my view, and a letter of complaint to the bank's chief executive or Legal Officer I feel is in order here.

Who did you see at the bank?  The manager or simply an obviously junior assistant?

It is probably sensible for your mother to make new p of A,s. But do both versions as the Health & Welfare one is equally important if you have to deal with bolshie medical  staff who cloak everything in confidentiality clauses.  (And I suggest lodging a Health & Welfare one with your mum,s surgery which includes a clause giving you the right of access to her medical records if your mother  is happy to do this )

If the only way you can deal with your mum,s finances legally is to open a joint account I would first seek a solicitor,s advice, especially as this effectively makes you a shared legal owner of half her financial assets.  When she dies, if you have other siblings this could create problems regarding any distribution of assets, especially if any other savings accounts are also put in joint names. 

Is it worth trying to contact admin at the MSE website to see if they can raise this as an issue?  

Alternatively some of the serious weekend papers like The Telegraph  have money experts to whom you can send your  problem and if you,re fortunate they will intervene and liase with the offending provider on your behalf to negate a solution. .  Companies don,t like adverse publicity, especially in these difficult times,  so worth a try.

i,d be interested to know which bank this was.  Many years ago I had P of A for my father with Barclays and if I recall correctly my name was simply added to his chequebook and account designation with P of A written after it.  I know cheque books are rarely used these days but I fail to see why accounts can,t be similarly designated.

Please do-come back on here and report back how things proceed.as I,m sure others are probably facing similar hurdles.

sprocket1

There is an issue for those who do not have close friends or family.  I would have to appoint a solicitor or accountant as attorney.  I asked a couple what controls they had in place and just go "you can trust us we are registered/ we are insured".  While the dishonest professionals are a minority they do exist.  People can succumb to temptation if they are in trouble.  I decided not to take out a power of attorney as the court of protection route offers more safeguards.

Moss5

It has taken me 13-months to complete the LPA process for myself and my wife. We now have registered two Health and two Finance LPA's.

A complication was introduced when an attorney changed her name after marriage.

This necessitated resubmission of sections 11 and 15, causing us to have to reassemble the donors/attorneys/witness (This could involve international travel).

The OPG could have saved effort for themselves and us if they had simply changed the name of our 3rd attorney digitally. They asked for a copy of the Marriage Certificate, but the name on that was out of date. A photo of a Passport or driving license would be better proof of a new name.  

Primrose

I feel for you.   These  necessary procedures are a pain in the backside to complete but I hope you both now sleep more soundly now the process is completed

i was today talking to an unwell elderly person with omplicqted  family set up who was fretting about not yet having  made a Will .however much hassle these procedure feel like to enact, it,s a darned sight less hassle to enact them when in good health d everything in yiur life is going smoothly. When you,re already unwell there,s a risk it doesn't get done at all or mistakes are made which can invalidate the whole process.

i was unaware OPG were able to efffect changes digitally.  How does this work?  Do they then issue you with an updated copy of the document.?  Do you then have to make fresh certified copies?

Moss5

I found a discrepency on my registered LPA and hope they can fix it digitally. I shall report back, when I know the outcome. They have got the attorney's names correct on 3 of the 4 LPA's.
The information was sent 'signed for' and I have a copy of the so-called signature of the recipient.
This is the how I got this far: -

First you (the Donor) will receive a letter from the OPG saying that your LPA has been registered.

They give you a ‘Key’ to access your own LPA on line and send a ‘Key’ to each of your attorneys.

You then create an account at

https://use-lasting-power-of-attorney.service.gov.uk/login

See screen capture attached: -

https://photos.app.goo.gl/QNFk53basnF2LRhX8

Use “Add another LPA” to insert the reference number an ‘Key’

You may then “View LPA summary”

https://photos.app.goo.gl/PQUkX1tj4GfVwP7c8

If you see something incorrect, you can contact customer services and explain.

When you get in touch, you’ll need to tell us:

• the LPA reference number:
• your name
• your role (ie, whether you are the donor or an attorney)
• the donor’s name (if you are not the donor)
• the donor’s date of birth

·        the donor’s address and postcode

·       Reason for contacting: -

 

Email customerservices@publicguardian.gov.uk

Primrose

This seems a nightmare for elderly non digitally competent individuals to navigate and seems to me to be another example of how the "working from home" mentality now prevailing in the civil service may be adversely affecting customer service.
what happens if the attorneys are also not very computer competent.

Moss5

Don't worry, they send a paper copy and many organisations prefer them to digital access. 

peteduk

In time, organisations will come to expect the digital version. Then, those who have legacy paper versions may find they have difficulties. Unfortunately there is no plan to digitise older paper LPAs

Primrose

Considering that most people only go to the trouble of preparing these documents once in a lifetime I  find it pretty inexplicable that these organisations don't go to the trouble of keeping them fit for purpose.