How can anyone do this :(

*In*need*of*advice*

I have read this thread with interest and have to say I can see where justjohn and rinabean are coming from. I believe they have both said that this guy is sick and cruel. I don't think anyone on this thread is arguing that point??

It would seem that Justjohn and Rinabean are looking at this from the point of view that the cat is simply food to the snake. In the same way that Pigs/Lambs/Cows are food for humans. The snake has no morals or values it is hungry and it sees a kitten so it kills it and eats it (a constrictor will only kill when it is hungry so it does it for survival). From this point of view that is a far more natural thing than a human popping into McDonalds for a beefburger that it probably doesn't need for survival. I would imagine (again from a food chain point of view and forgetting the idiot behind the act & camera) the kitten suffered far less than the cow that ultimately ends up in your burger. I live in a rural area and see lambs rounded up in fields to go off for slaughter. They look scared when they are rounded up (usually by quad bikes here). They are then herded onto lorries where again I would imagine they are scared as this isn't natural for them, and then they are transported 40+ miles to the slaughterhouse where I would imagine that they are still scared whilst being herded into the slaughter house and then ultimately slaughtered (and this is supposed to be humane).

As for the guy that said snakes that won't eat dead food should be PTS - get a grip! Live food is natural for a snake in the same way that meat is a natural food for a dog. Why should a snake get PTS just because it has the audacity to want/need to eat something that is entirely natural to eat. If your logic stands any chance of holding up then all vegetarians that have dogs should only feed them a veggie diet and if they won't eat it they should be PTS??

Also - just for the record not all snakes will eat dead food.

vicx

*In*need*of*advice* wrote: »

Also - just for the record not all snakes will eat dead food.

All snakes are predators irrespective of their environment so if they find and catch their own prey then that is acceptable as that is what snakes do but I don't agree with given snakes live food no matter what animal it is - snakes can be trained to eat dead food.

vicx

justjohn wrote: »

Are you reading the same posts as me ???

Forget for a moment he is a sicko(just for a second)....I think we all agree on that.

The snake killed the kitten. The guy gave the snake food.

The slaughterman kills the cow. The slaughterman gives you food.(ok tesco)

Do you get it ???

Calm down and take a deep breath. When did I say you did not agree the man was a sicko?

I am aware the snake killed the kitten and the SICKO gave the snake food. Did he do it just to feed the snake? I think not and his other video's prove that. We could all see this from the beginning that this was sadistic and not done just to feed a snake but you said it was normal.



Also why do you feel the need to use multiple question marks? It is considered rude and childish and it doesn't get your point across any clearer.

scheming_gypsy

vicx wrote: »

snakes can be trained to eat dead food.

which shows how little you know about them.

You can try and coax them onto defrosted but it doesn't always work.
There are numorous ways to get them on to defrosted such as; sticking it in there, wiggling about, braining it, rubbing scent of a live animal on it, wrapping fresh lizard shed on it, heating it and even feeding freshly killed. If they don't work you can try mice, rats, multis, gerbils, hamsters, guinea pigs, rabbits, piglets, chicks etc.. You can put them in a smaller box so there's no escape, and you can change the temperature, you can force feed, you can assist feed and you can pray to the big pink pixie in the sky... but if a snake won't eat defrosted it won't eat it and you either have to feed live or let it die and they will starve themselves!
I had a baby boa a couple of years ago that refused to eat, i managed to force feed it a pinkie but that was it in about 5 months. In the end the shop took it back to see if they could get it to eat.

*In*need*of*advice*

vicx wrote: »

Al snakes can be trained to eat dead food.

I would love to know where you get this knowledge from.

I have kept snakes - the boa constrictor we were told would not eat dead but it did after some encouragement. It would not eat frozen and then defrosted mice/chicks but would eat 'freshly killed' mice. The frozen food was warmed to body temperature (and then on advice of another snake keeper we tried warming it slightly hotter than body temperature) we tried bleeding it, jiggling it...all the usual tricks but it would not eat defrosted, only freshly killed. Now if you had to freshly kill the prey I would have more confidence in the snake doing it quickly and efficiently than a human.

The Royal Python I had would not eat dead (they are notorious for being fussy eaters anyway)...it starved itself to such an extent that it ended up having to be force fed. It was that weak that it wouldn't have had the strength to kill it's prey anyway. It was taken to a specialist University vet that trained vets for exotic animals and there it was treated as it was underweight and very weak. It ended up having to be force feed with pureed mixture... Once its strength was up we gave it another go with dead food and it was not interested. However within 30 secs of a live mouse being put in the vivarium it had suffocated it and was eating!....

Of course we were just taking advice from a vet that had 35 years experience and has probably trained over half of the exotic vets in this country, not to mention the members of a reptile owners/breeder society who probably had 100's of years experience between them...but of course you probably know better

justjohn

vicx wrote: »

Calm down and take a deep breath. When did I say you did not agree the man was a sicko?

I am aware the snake killed the kitten and the SICKO gave the snake food. Did he do it just to feed the snake? I think not and his other video's prove that. We could all see this from the beginning that this was sadistic and not done just to feed a snake but you said it was normal.



Also why do you feel the need to use multiple question marks? It is considered rude and childish and it doesn't get your point across any clearer.

You said in earlier posts i assumed the guy was "normal"

feeding of snake with live food does happen and is necessary sometime, thats normal.

i said the manner and the way and reasons for feeding the snake was another matter in this instance.(cause he's a sicko)

As for me use of multiple question marks, it probably the same reason you choose not too read an entire post. -to get a point across.

vicx

justjohn wrote: »

You said in earlier posts i assumed the guy was "normal"

feeding of snake with live food does happen and is necessary sometime, thats normal.

Where did I state you said this guy was normal?

Yes feeding snakes with live food does happen, I never said it didn't. I said how it was done was not normal and was done in a sadistic manner. You did not agree with it being sadistic and asked why kittens have more rights. No one had said kittens have more rights, we were discussing how it was done.

As for me use of multiple question marks, it probably the same reason you choose not too read an entire post. -to get a point across.

Multiple question marks does not get your point across any clearer. I read the whole post - I quote what I am replying to.

justjohn

OK.

My opinion has always been he was a sicko.
I have said all along his actions and reasons for putting the film on are questionable for the first vid.

However i have also discussed the actions of the snake and the fact the kitten was food just cause he is a sicko and the food was fed for possible sadistic purpose's. Does not mean you should not debate the use of the kitten as a food source or the ethics of live food.

You will find that some animals are more important than others. Please read all the posts on here.(and even the law)

The cats more important than the mouse it hunts and tortures.
The snake should be pts cause it needs live food.
The cow,sheep etc is ok to be slaughtered and stressed out cause its bred for food.

vicx

We all have different views and opinions and just because a poster above thinks snakes should be PTS if they won't eat dead food does not mean he needs to 'get a grip' - he is entitled to his own opinion as we all are.

I eat meat but that does not mean I am happy that animals are slaughtered. If becomming a vegetarian stopped those poor animals being slaughtered then I would happily give up meat. I can live without meat, we all can but it's choice whether we eat it or not and as I said if we choose to eat it that does not necessarily mean we are 'happy' what happened before it ended up on our plate.

The only meat I seem to have a problem eating is chicken unless it's already picked off the bone. A few weeks back was the first time in my life that I had washed an uncooked chicken and put it in the oven, I felt ill. I think it's because it's still a chicken if you know what I mean.

Kittens aren't bred to be fed as food whereas rats and mice are, I think that is why there is a heated discussion about the kitten being fed as food. I am not a cat lover and I am terrified of rats and mice but no matter what animal was being fed (live) I would still find it cruel and upsetting.

justjohn

vicx wrote: »

Kittens aren't bred to be fed as food whereas rats and mice are, I think that is why there is a heated discussion about the kitten being fed as food. I am not a cat lover and I am terrified of rats and mice but no matter what animal was being fed (live) I would still find it cruel and upsetting.

Yes same for me. However is it actual anyworse than the abuse we inflict on our own food. Just cause its bred for food does not make it fair.

if i had too watch the lamb being slaughtered before it was on my plate, i am sure i would also find that upsetting.

Btw the japanese have a dish were the fish is alive.

Halal meat, i don't even want too think about.