Delivery rights discussion

sheramber

When my DIL got her Tesco order her 5 year old son signed for it. The driver said the signature didn't go anywhere so it didn't matter.

JaneBurns

I recently installed a Ring Video doorbell. Co-incidentally had a failed delivery and the courier claiming they had attempted delivery and left a card. The video log showed no activity. Two days later the courier claimed to have delivered.. again no video evidence. Argued and the supplier offered a replacement. That too didn't arrive when promised. This time the courier company got involved and to cut along story short the driver lost his job the same day. I was one of a number of compainants, but the only one with direct evidence. Will video doorbells finally help to put a stop to dishonest delivery drivers and courier companies.

martinmj

Hi.
Just had an issue with MyHermes( usually surprisingly reliable) who through their own admitted negligence caused a parcel to be lost/stolen. But they refuse compensation saying the item is on their non-compensation list. Yet the items in that list are there primarily because they are fragile, and MyHermes will not pay out for 'loss or damage' of these items. Understood-but this also leads to the conclusion that the reason they will NOT compensate for a parcel they have lost is because these non-compensation items are more likely to be 'lost', which is clearly nonsense.
However I have just received a reply from their complaints department following my seeking clarification on this point. It contains the amazing reply "To confirm, Hermes cannot guarantee the safe delivery of any parcel, whether the item is subject to loss or damage."
So to be clear, MyHermes/Hermes do not guarantee that they will carry out and complete the service you have paid them to do. So what is the point of using them? Has anyone else encountered that response from any other courier? It is a bit like an airline saying you can fly with them, but whether you get to where you wanted to go , or even fail to get back on the ground again , is in the lap of the gods.
Mike

custardy

martinmj wrote: »

Hi.
Just had an issue with MyHermes( usually surprisingly reliable) who through their own admitted negligence cause a parcel to be lost/stolen. But they refuse compensation saying the item is on their non-compensation list. Yet the items in that list are their primarily because they are fragile, and MyHermes will not pay out for 'loss or damage' of these items. Understood-but this also leads to the conclysion that the reason they will NOT compensate for a parcel they have lost is because these non-compensation items are more likely to be 'lost', which is clearly nonsense.
However I have just received a reply from their complaints department following my seeking clarification on this point. It contains the amazing reply "To confirm, Hermes cannot guarantee the safe delivery of any parcel, whether the item is subject to loss or damage."
So to be clear, MyHermes/Hermes do not guarantee that they will carry out and complete the service you have paid them to do. So what is the point of using them? Has anyone else encountered that response from any other couriers? It is a bit like an airline saying you can fly with them, but whether you get to where you wanted to go, or even if they fail to guarantee to land safely, that is what you can expect.
Mike

No carrier offers this guarantee.

martinmj

And this is in their Ts & Cs? I can understand no guarantee of time of delivery, but are you seriously saying NO courier will guarantee not to lose your parcel, and also refuse compensation if they do. So what are we paying them for?

custardy

martinmj wrote: »

And this is in their Ts & Cs? I can understand no guarantee of time of delivery, but are you seriously saying NO courier will guarantee not to lose your parcel, and also refuse compensation if they do. So what are we paying them for?

Well feel free to go looking and prove me wrong.
How would they back up that guarantee?
Even if you have no theft/loss what if you have a building burn down?
How to they mitigate to guarantee?

martinmj

Agreed if there was 'force majure' or something else beyond their control as you outlined, but then you would expect suitable compensation, would you not. And the question about the Ts & Cs was a question for yourself, not me. If you are stating it as a fact, then presumably you have determined this and is why you made that statement. I only asked if that actually appears in every company's Ts & Cs.
If I enter a contract with a company then I expect the contract to be honoured, or if there is a breach, then compensation should follow. Standard contract proceedure. If a contract can be broken through admitted negligence as in this instance, and there is no compensation, then I would suggest this falls under the Unfair Contracts Act if the company cites their contact as sanctioning this.

custardy

martinmj wrote: »

Agreed if there was 'force majure' or something else beyond their control as you outlined, but then you would expect suitable compensation, would you not. And the question about the Ts & Cs was a question for yourself, not me. If you are stating it as a fact, then presumably you have determined this and is why you made that statement. I only asked if that actually appears in every company's Ts & Cs.
If I enter a contract with a company then I expect the contract to be honoured, or if there is a breach, then compensation should follow. Standard contract proceedure. If a contract can be broken through admitted negligence as in this instance, and there is no compensation, then I would suggest this falls under the Unfair Contracts Act if the company cites their contact as sanctioning this.

You did enter a contract and agreed to no compensation on excluded items.
What did you think you agreed to when you were arranging the delivery method?
If you want to push back then by all means.
Im pointing out your line of thought regarding 100% guarantees, wont hold water.

Martinmeet

Hi,
I have a friend who needs urgent help in this matter (by 27th Feb he needs to act) and I hope the knowledge and expertise this group has will surely provide guidance and support. My friend got an upgrade deal on his new mobile phone and he was agreed that the new phone will be delivered next day. The delivery company will let him know the one hour window when the delivery will be made.
Following day he waited all day but delivery didn't come. He rang the network and was told that the system didn't process the order so it did not go out. They are sending it out and he will get it next day. Again, there was a promise that the delivery company will give him one hour window for delivery. Next day, he did not get any notification from the delivery company but got the mobile delivered.
He called the network to complain about this issue and also about his loss of extra day as they did not deliver the phone on agreed day (previous day). Network declined the responsibility but when he wrote them officially, they came back with £20 goodwill thing. He lost one whole day due to their system not processing the order, the delivery company did not inform about the specific time so he had to stay home for whole day and £20 did not really compensate his efforts and time.
He discussed this with me and I am a regular reader of this forum, so I advised him to read few pages and use the template provided on this page: https://www.moneysavingexpert.com/shopping/delivery-rights/
He sent the template and next thing happened was that he got their deadlock letter.
He then took it to Ombudsman for this complaint and followed their procedure but last week Friday he got a message that Ombudsman is upholding his network decision and declined his request for compensation. I was shocked to read the text from ombudsman but I am not an expert so advised him that I will ask my dear friends on this forum.

Here is the summary of what happened and the ombudsman response to him:
1. He bought an iPhone which was to be delivered on an agreed date but was delivered one day late.
2. He complained and asked for compensation for his time, trouble and inconvenience.
3. He was offered £20 which he declined and went to Ombudsman after getting the deadlock letter.
4. He provided the details and followed the guidance from the above page, explaining his losses of time, enjoyment, etc.
5. Ombudsman replied with below points:
5.1 Network has provided the agreed contract, device and deal as corrective action after you complained.
5.2 Network did not charge him for upfront cost of £30 which is higher than what they offered in goodwill
5.3 Due to system error the order did not process and Ombudsman agent think it's not the network's fault thus network did not break any contract
5.4 Network is not responsible for the failure of delivery company not telling him the specific time. They are third party and network is not responsible for what third party did or not.
5.5 Ombudsman suggested that he is not a business customer so the network is not obligated to cover his loss of earnings, salary or a monetary value of his time.

At personal level, I think Ombudsman either not fully aware of the facts that any third party used by a company becomes part of their liability and their actions or non-actions are their responsibility so shrugging off it saying it wasn't network's fault, they are telling the wrong thing to him.

Second, taking actions on the following day doesn't compensate for the loss of a day and enjoyment. He is a self employed person and was planned to go to see new client but had to change it as an expensive phone was coming, his losses must be considered even if he is not a business customer, right?

Please advise what are his options? Should he appeal it? OR reject and go to court? or accept his fate and not bother?
He is single parent and a good friend. I don't want him to loose out like this.

He has got 27th Feb till he can respond so any early advises will help me guide him taking actions in time.

Many Thanks in advance and appreciate for reading a long post.

unholyangel

Which ombudsman did he use? How did he enter the contract? Sounds like it might have been done over the phone but just checking it wasn't online (as then the "acceptance" can be at a particular time like dispatch confirmation).