Sisters debt. Bank of Mom and Dad.

notakid

gauly wrote: »

I just don't see your sister's problem at all here - and certainly don't think she is suffering!! She has £38k debt, £2k owed to parents and £77k on a mortgage for a total of £117k. That's more debt than I would be happy having, but certainly isn't unmanagable on a salary of £60k a year (with no childcare costs and presumably both working so not much going in top rate tax).

If they put their minds to it they could pay back £10k a year without even having to live a frugal lifestyle. I can't see why she would qualify for a debt managemant plan or IVA since she has more than enough income to cover her debt payments. Her net income even after paying her debts must be plenty to live on - if I were your parents I would just ignore her request.

This thread as been enlightening as as my one in DT. My normal home!

I've no debts, we have paid off our mortgage and drive an old knac.ker so to me the amounts seemed staggering but reading on here the debt should be manageable. I've just been round to see my parents to let them know this along with a print out of some of the comments from both threads.

I don't think my parents will listen however and I've said to them its the last time I'm going to mention it and I'll leave them to do what they think is best as its not my money and I'm not going to add to the stress. I think they are going to bail her out to the tune of 20,000 but I have said I feel they should ask her to do a payment plan and come on here for advice.

I met my sister for a sandwich today along with another friend. I waited for her outside her wkplace and I was going to give her a hug and say I'd heard about the loan but as we were walking to meet our friend she said she wanted to pop into Jessops as they were having a canvas print done of the baby!

She said it was a special offer of £15. 00 but she could she by my face that I wasn't happy. She asked what was wrong and I blurted out that I knew she was in trouble and asked our parents for a bail out and what was she doing ordering prints! :mad:

So she thinks I'm really angry at her now. To be honest I'm not happy but we will sort it out over the weekend but I will be telling her she needs a reality check!

Errata

I hope you are angry with her. Somebody should be so she can start to understand that actions have consequences. Your parents will do what they want to do, but I do so hope before they hand over a penny your sister has enough love for them, and guts, to tell them exactly what all they money has been spent on.

thistledome

belfastgirl23 wrote: »

Also I would say think about yourself a bit. Your dedication to your sister is admirable, but bear in mind that if your parents spend all their capital on your sister, this is also your inheritance.

I thought your post was very sensible, except for this which is a pet peeve of mine.

Your living Parent's money is not your inheritence. If they are still alive they can spend their money on whatever and whoever they like.

Your inheritence is what they leave to you when they die.

notakid

Errata wrote: »

I hope you are angry with her. Somebody should be so she can start to understand that actions have consequences. Your parents will do what they want to do, but I do so hope before they hand over a penny your sister has enough love for them, and guts, to tell them exactly what all they money has been spent on.

I will I'm simmering! I think she needs to take ownership for her own good. I want her to post on the debt board and I will nag until she does.

I've got to add I got the amount wrong for the car loan. (I was thinking of what I paid for mine!:o) It was around a grand and they have paid half I'm going to amend my OP. I know its not that important in the scheme of things but i've painted them blacker then I need too.

JoJoB

If your parents want to loan her the money then fair enough, it's their decision.
But if it is really a "loan" then encourage them to ask for a few pieces of basic information as any lender would do.

1. Proof of income
2. Copies of all balances and monthly payment demands from creditors
3. All monthly outgoings (EVERYTHING - gas, electric, water, mortgage, council tax, petrol, public transport, food, hairdressing, school clubs, clothes, birthdays, christmas, holidays, prescriptions, dentists, tv licence etc etc)

Then they can see what is left over. Also it will force your sister and partner to sit down and actually do the figures for themselves and see which areas can be improved. If they are not willing to do this then your parents should not be willing to lend the money - they have to prove they are good for the loan!

I do agree that while £60K sounds a lot, things like the 40% tax taken into account along with possible student loans having to be repaid, along with no tax credits etc etc can really reduce that income quite considerably! Even so, they should have enough surplus to make a dmp a very attractive option for them - it may be that they simply don't realise these options exist and just go in to panic mode when the debt builds up and go to their usual sources of respite.

I'm not sure showing this thread is a great idea. People out of control with finances feel a great deal of guilt (usually) and end up on the defensive at the slightest criticism. Best thing to do is get a few options clearly presented and explained to them (DMP and IVA being good starting points - go to the citizens advice bureau website (goodle adviceguide) and print off their info as as a starting point.

Good luck anyway and hope they see the light.

belfastgirl23

thistledome wrote: »

I thought your post was very sensible, except for this which is a pet peeve of mine.

Your living Parent's money is not your inheritence. If they are still alive they can spend their money on whatever and whoever they like.

Your inheritence is what they leave to you when they die.

Totally agree and if they were globetrotting on it then I would never ever say anything like this. What I was trying to do was give the OP ammunition to help her parents realise that what they're doing is not going to help anyone. And sometimes realising that they're being unfair to the other child might be what helps them realise it. But you're totally right in the end it's their money and they have to do what they think best with it.

And OP you were absolutely right to raise your eyebrows at your sister. One of the biggest things that leads to debt problems is the 'it's only £15' culture. If you spend 'only £15' ten times that's the entire shopping budget for someone on a DMP. Maybe you gave her something to think about....

paddy's_mum

I can't work out why you are not disgusted, and your parents embarrassed and repelled, by your sister and brother-in-law's greed, irresponsibility and vestigial sense of fair play.

WhiteHorse

No more money. Ever. Don't get into any arguments about it, just bring the axe down.

paddy's_mum

To clarify my post number 38 which, without further explanation, may have come across as unjustifiably harsh.

What I'm trying to get at is this - could it be that the astonishing tolerance and lack of anger so far shown is actually a big part of the continuing so-what attitude your sister shows towards debt, her own selfishness in the running up of it, and the comfortable belief she appears to have that someone else will get her out of it?

That amount of debt would scare the pants off most people - what has she been 'taught' that she is so (relatively) unconcerned? Perhaps it's time your sister had a rather rude awakening and if so, better at the hands of people who love her than the unfeeling machinations of debt recovery firms, impartial judges and neanderthal-style bailiffs!

notakid

paddy's_mum wrote: »

To clarify my post number 38 which, without further explanation, may have come across as unjustifiably harsh.

What I'm trying to get at is this - could it be that the astonishing tolerance and lack of anger so far shown is actually a big part of the continuing so-what attitude your sister shows towards debt, her own selfishness in the running up of it, and the comfortable belief she appears to have that someone else will get her out of it?

That amount of debt would scare the pants off most people - what has she been 'taught' that she is so (relatively) unconcerned? Perhaps it's time your sister had a rather rude awakening and if so, better at the hands of people who love her than the unfeeling machinations of debt recovery firms, impartial judges and neanderthal-style bailiffs!

I think its 'cos I know my sister has her heart in the right place its just that she has let matters get out of hand.

And you have prob hit the nail on the head, we are a close family and my parents are very kind and family is what they live for. Both of us know that we can approach them with our problems, however what we forget (and I include myself in this) is they are now in their mid 70's and really shouldn't be burdened with our problems, infact chating to my Dad yesterday, he said that they looked after their parents and it seems its always the other way round with us!:o

Now, I twigged this when my Mom was diagnosed with Cancer and I no wonder unthinkingly moan about my problems to her, I try and just keep cheerful and positive but my sister in her panic has overstepped the mark. She really isn't unconcerned, I know she is out of her mind with worry.

So, the lack of anger in my OP is one, I don't want to be a hypocrite, when something goes wrong in my house, ie the dryer belt needs replacing I call my Dad and he helps me, I don't want to show faux outrage when I sometimes rely on my family too.

Also the money, if it benefits my sister I want her to have it. Too many families fall out over money, I'm trying not to think of it as lost as I know my sister will mean to pay it back I know that, however what I'm not sure of if she is capable of doing it.

I know they are trying to sell things as well she has just sold a stressless chair I coverted! Also their trailer tent is up for sale. Its not like they aren't trying to face up to their problems.

However I know its hard sometimes esp on line when people don't get the full picture from posts, I might say "she is a decent person" but people just think I'm deluded because I don't go into detail and don't know us personally.