Child Tax credit changed - Why?

melly1980

MissMoneypenny wrote: »

You're right, some people take a pride in keeping themselves and their families. He loves being able to fly all around the world; have money to buy what he wants; never having to fill forms in for state welfare; not have to worry about welfare cuts. He will pass his good work ethic onto his children too.

the point is that you were tlaking about his hours. He chooses to work excessive hours. There are laws regarding hours for a reason and they are set well below 50 per week because that is unhealthy. Not only is it unhealthy but the work / family balance is affected to. This is fine if he CHOOSES to do that but to use this information to engage in a c**k measuring contest and to beat other people over the head with is sad beyond belief.

melly1980

milliebear00001 wrote: »

None of those things actually apply to me - not that I'd expect a knee-jerker like you to have any concerns for the facts. .

No, they may not apply to you but you seem to have no issue in defending those who CBA working their claim out

milliebear00001 wrote: »

You obviously have a beef about the 'undeserving' in receipt of TC. To deny it is disingenuous of you.

I will point out the cast iron catagoric facts again that are posted in black and white on this thread.

My beef is not with people getting "free money". At no point have I expressed this belief.

My beef was with people who want this free money yet are not willing to put any effort in whatsoever to calculating it and seeing if they have the right amount.

Only an utter imbicile can not see the difference between the 2 points.

milliebear00001

Melly1980 you are ridiculously unable to understand that my issue is not with working out my entitlement - which I have done - repeatedly - and checked - several times. IT IS WITH THE FACT THAT I AM NOT BEING PAID THE AMOUNT I CALCULATE I AM ENTITLED TO.

I don't see how I can put this into words of single syllables unfortunately.

I would suggest the selection of quotes below suggests you have a somewhat, erm, negative view of tax credits and the right of certain people to receive them...

WHEN you get some money for sod all... I don't feel I get money for sod all. I get a proportion of the tax I pay back.

Many people have been relying on TC to the extent that a sizable reduction will put them up the creek without a paddle... Why would they not rely on something they have been told to include as part of their household budget? Is it fair to suddenly remove this without any explanation of how the new figures have been worked out?

Sodding hell here people are getting free money here and now not content with that want it down to the penny... Oh. there's that 'free money' description again. Well God forbid people should expect Government to let them know how much money they will have to live on next month - how very dare they even ask!

MissMoneypenny

melly1980 wrote: »

to use this information to engage in a c**k measuring contest and to beat other people over the head with is sad beyond belief.

Yet you don't think claiming welfare to support all your children is sad.

You have spent a lot of time on here moaning about your welfare cuts when you could have used that time to work and earn money.

melly1980

milliebear00001 wrote: »

WHEN you get some money for sod all... I don't feel I get money for sod all. I get a proportion of the tax I pay back.!

Your personalising it. I havent once said YOU as in you personally. Im talking about the generic need to moan about not getting the exact amount of money when at the end of the day people r getting some money. For most people this money is not a proportion of their tax back. It exceeds the tax that they pay.

milliebear00001 wrote: »

Many people have been relying on TC to the extent that a sizable reduction will put them up the creek without a paddle... Why would they not rely on something they have been told to include as part of their household budget? Is it fair to suddenly remove this without any explanation of how the new figures have been worked out?.!

How on gods green f***ing earth does that prove that I despise tax credits. Im making a statement of fact. It is a fact that people have become reliant on these credits. It is nothing more than a statement and offers no opinion on tax credits per sa. You quite clearly have no ability to read and understand simple text. Instead you attempt to read between the lines, infer, guess, assume and just fabricate claims for me that I simply have not made.

milliebear00001 wrote: »

Sodding hell here people are getting free money here and now not content with that want it down to the penny... Oh. there's that 'free money' description again. Well God forbid people should expect Government to let them know how much money they will have to live on next month - how very dare they even ask!

Yes, the free money comment again, because it is free money. Another statement of fact. It is money that people get yet now they are moaning that they dont get the exact amount down to the penny at a time where everythjing is changing around. Again, for the terminally stupid Ive no issue with the money being given out in the way it is. My issue is with those that dont seem to be able to see what they get choosing instead to nitpick at minor detail. Beggars cant be choosers and when the state is giving you help you get what you get.

melly1980

MissMoneypenny wrote: »

Yet you don't think claiming welfare to support all your children is sad. .

I am a net contributer. From the 1K per month I pay in stoppages I get about 100 quid back. Therefore I am supporting my children (to all but them most stupid of people). I'd suggest that Im also paying for a fair few other peoples kids on top of that.

MissMoneypenny wrote: »

You have spent a lot of time on here moaning about your welfare cuts when you could have used that time to work and earn money.

I work soft @rse. In fact Ive worked more aggresive hours that your beloved son that you feel the need to brag about works. However when I did those hours I didnt use it to try to make others feel lazy andf worthless because I chose to do those hours. The sad fact is that you banging on about all there is to life is work work work and while doing so you are missing the point in spectacular fashion that your son is missing out on family time. There is more to being a parent than working all hours god sends and earning money.

milliebear00001

melly1980 wrote: »

Your personalising it. I havent once said YOU as in you personally. Im talking about the generic need to moan about not getting the exact amount of money when at the end of the day people r getting some money. For most people this money is not a proportion of their tax back. It exceeds the tax that they pay.


How on gods green f***ing earth does that prove that I despise tax credits. Im making a statement of fact. It is a fact that people have become reliant on these credits. It is nothing more than a statement and offers no opinion on tax credits per sa. You quite clearly have no ability to read and understand simple text. Instead you attempt to read between the lines, infer, guess, assume and just fabricate claims for me that I simply have not made.



Yes, the free money comment again, because it is free money. Another statement of fact. It is money that people get yet now they are moaning that they dont get the exact amount down to the penny at a time where everythjing is changing around. Again, for the terminally stupid Ive no issue with the money being given out in the way it is. My issue is with those that dont seem to be able to see what they get choosing instead to nitpick at minor detail. Beggars cant be choosers and when the state is giving you help you get what you get.

It is you who are personalising things. Your tone is clear. You are the one using offensive language for example and feeling it necessary to call people names just beause they don't happen to agree with your POV - is that how you manage disagreements when you don't have the protection of a faceless computer screen?

I notice you didn't bother to comment on the fact that nobody 'in charge' has yet managed to give me an accurate explanation for my changes of TC and so I will assume you now, finally, after much explaining, get the point that I am several others are trying to make.

Just because you don't care about the extremely poor level of service displayed, does not mean others don't. We are absolutely entitled to be annoyed - just as we would be if British Gas got our bill wrong, or a shop debited us for more money than we'd agreed. Just because it concerns something that benefits us, does not mean the administrators of the scheme have the right to give us poor service or that we should just sit quietly by and accept that as justified.

richpoortyke

A couple of thoughts about excessive hours.
Firstly there was a report recently stating those who work excessive hours are more likely to suffer from heart disease.
Secondly if those people who do far too many hours did say only 30 hours a week for example then maybe this could create many more jobs and ease the dole queues and reduce benefits paid out.

Its ok having a good work ethic, but personally my health and a social conscience are much more important to me

GobbledyGook

MissMoneypenny wrote: »

You're right, some people take a pride in keeping themselves and their families. He loves being able to fly all around the world; have money to buy what he wants; never having to fill forms in for state welfare; not have to worry about welfare cuts. He will pass his good work ethic onto his children too.

You hope. My Grandfather worked every working day of his life and then worked into his retirement. My Grandmother had wee jobs here and there to top up the family income and they brought their only daughter up with a very strong work ethic. When my Grandfather took ill my Grandmother took extra jobs to tide them over rather than claiming anything as they didn't believe in it. They had the odd drink for a social occasion, but nothing more and believed in work and family very strongly.

Despite that their daughter (my mother) never worked a day in her life. Cost the taxpayer thousands, if not more. Drank like a fish. Took drugs and neglected her children.

There is little point in anyone being smug or adamant about what a person will pass to their child/ren. Children can be passed all sorts of advice and ethics from their parents, but it will be solely up to the child if they choose to take the pass and follow it.

zagfles

amcraig wrote: »

I'm in a similar situation to the OP. MY TCs have gone down. The amount being paid is different to proposed payments for 2011/12 outlined in an award notice I got in Dec 2010. It's also different (by about £60 too little) to the amount I'm supposed to get according to the HMRC calculator.

Being a software geek type person I also have my own spreadsheet that calculates my TCs. I have updated this with the new rules and according to my calculations I'm still being paid too little.

When I phoned the tax credits helpline the chap on the end of the phone couldn't really explain. He said the reduction was due to the 10% change in childcare payments. When I pointed out my award letter in Dec had stated a different amount he more or less said that the award letter had not taken into consideration the budget changes. I also pointed out the HMRC online calculator agreed with my award notice and he burbled about things being based on estimates and I'd not done a renewal etc etc.

Basically I think it's a money saving exercise. If you pay everyone less than they are due for 3 months (until renewals are done) and bank that money then it's probably making a fair old amount of interest. I'm annoyed because I did check and I did work it out myself and I have budgeted accordingly. Now, they seem to have changed the rules without telling anyone. I know once my renewal is done I'll probably get extra for a few months but that doesn't help pay this months nursery bill.

OK if we're going for silly conspiracy theories, how about this:

Those in charge of the TCO computer systems don't like the current govt and so want people to see their tax credits cut even if they were due an increase. So they've deliberately made the system underpay people people in the renewal window. This will encourage them to vote Labour in the May elections. Most renewals won't be done by early May so by the time people get their proper payments it will be too late.

I think that's about as likely as a trivial interest saving exercise