Buyer wants to pay by Pay Pal at Collection

soolin

mobile48 wrote: »

I failed to find one statement.

Do PayPal actually say this?

I would guess well over 90% of their transactions would by your statement be NOT suitable.

Google finds 9 uses of the word suitable on paypal none preceded by not.

I suspect they use different word like you may lose some types of disputes without tracking.

This page covers the very basic seller protection, nothing complicated:

https://www.paypal.com/uk/ebay/cgi-bin/webscr?cmd=p/gen/fraud-tips-sellers-outside

Note that they only refer to being able to track an item.

This is th elink you get if you follow the link to staying safe that is shown on every paypal payment received:

https://www.paypal-marketing.co.uk/safetyadvice/SellerProtectYourself.htm

Then when you log in to check your payment it states quite clearly on every single transaction:

OK to post the item



Payment Status: CompletedWe recommend that you:

• Post to the buyer's address on this page
• Use a shipping service with signature confirmation
• Save all tracking information or other proof of postage

Tips to sell securely
Now anyone with an ounce ofcommon sense will see that all those pages have one thing in common...(for those that haven't spotted it) - it assumes items are posted as that is the ONLY way to get seller protection. No postage = no hope.

soolin

In fairness I should also post something that a user sent to me last time we had a discussion about paypal. In that case, a year or so ago I was quite adamant that only a scammer would want to use paypal and then collect. The PM i got told me, quite correctly I now realise, that I should stop being so middle class about it.

Just because I can go to a cashpoint and draw out whatever cash I want i should not assume everyone can. For people on a very limited budget they may need to stagger the cost of an item, so buying a second hand cooker, or even a laptop saves them paying for a new one that they cannot afford yet if they use paypal they can use a credit card or even a zero interest 'pay later'card.

I believe that point is very valid.

I do still sell some things for collection only but I understand and accept the risks and tend to avoid highly scammed areas like electrical or baby items. For those items I would either find a way of couriering them or i would sell elsewhere.

A lot of this, does in my opinion, show again that we are all looking for that mythical 'someone else' to blame for our own lack of understanding, if I did get scammed then yes I would be furious but I would accept that I had taken a risk and it had not paid off. The idea of blaming everyone else for our own inability to bother reading up terms and conditions is just a waste of time.

Likewise I do not use tracking on my outward items under £41, but again I accept the risk and will not be on here claiming every buyer that claims non delivery is a scammer.

mobile48

soolin wrote: »

No postage = no hope.

Thanks - your view is now your own.

However all hope may not be lost.

No Idea if this works

Elsewhere on MSE and outside are some cases where it is claimed a Police Incident Report can be used.

This may win a case or a refund.

If you get a Police Incident Report go to the PayPal site and ask Louise how do I change my name.

Louise will answer and there is a secure form option on screen.

Use it to upload report.

Call PayPal and ask to associate the report with the dispute.

No Idea if this works

soolin

mobile48 wrote: »

Thanks - your view is now put across as your own.

However all hope may not be lost.

No Idea if this works

Elsewhere on MSE and outside are some cases where it is claimed a Police Incident Report can be used.

This may win a case or a refund.

If get a Police Incident Report go to the PayPal site and ask Louise how do I change my name.

Louise will answer and there is a secure form option on screen.

Use it to upload report.

Call PayPal and ask to associate the report with the dispute.

No Idea if this works

Sorry but I don't know what you mean about changing your name. Also do you have links to cases that have been won via paypal after being reported to the police.

I am aware of two cases that paypal have refunded on, one was as a result of a watchdog complaint many years ago where paypal paid out to the seller as a goodwill gesture without admitting any liability. The second was similar and was in one of the daily Mail finance pages, where again paypal paid out but without admitting liability and NOT because there is a way round the rules.

You cannot win a case using paypal's own rules if you cannot prove delivery.

Obviously as with all things people still have a legal route, but that doesn't mean a way round the paypal rules it is entirely seperate. I think we need to be clear here exactly what we are saying. If you do not post an item using a trackable service youe will NOT win a paypal claim.

mobile48

soolin wrote: »

You cannot win a case using paypal's own rules if you cannot prove delivery.

Anyone who thinks they know how paypal rules work this may change their view:

https://www.paypal-community.com/t5/Buying-with-PayPal/Buyer-Protection/m-p/130410

Here someone who I assume is from PayPal explains that the rules do not mean what you may think.

It changed my own view and shows you need to read terms very carefully.

cyberbob

mobile48 wrote: »

Thanks - your view is now your own.

However all hope may not be lost.

No Idea if this works

Elsewhere on MSE and outside are some cases where it is claimed a Police Incident Report can be used.

This may win a case or a refund.

If you get a Police Incident Report go to the PayPal site and ask Louise how do I change my name.

Louise will answer and there is a secure form option on screen.

Use it to upload report.

Call PayPal and ask to associate the report with the dispute.

No Idea if this works

This just sounds like one of those random myths. Sounds like total tosh

cyberbob

mobile48 wrote: »

Anyone who thinks they know how paypal rules work this may change their view:

https://www.paypal-community.com/t5/Buying-with-PayPal/Buyer-Protection/m-p/130410

Here someone who I assume is from PayPal explains that the rules do not mean what you may think.

It changed my own view and shows you need to read terms very carefully.

All that link does is prove what we all know that a lot of Paypal staff do not know their own rules.

Crowqueen

cyberbob wrote: »

All that link does is prove what we all know that a lot of Paypal staff do not know their own rules.

In common with a lot of CS operatives in the internet marketplace business.

soolin

mobile48 wrote: »

Anyone who thinks they know how paypal rules work this may change their view:

https://www.paypal-community.com/t5/Buying-with-PayPal/Buyer-Protection/m-p/130410

Here someone who I assume is from PayPal explains that the rules do not mean what you may think.

It changed my own view and shows you need to read terms very carefully.

I thought that that we were discussing collection items in the UK, have i missed something in your link as it regards an item sent fully tracked from Australia?

If you like i could post all sorts of random links about paypal, however I would prefer to keep this thead on topic as I think this is a very useful discussion to be had . I do not propose for one moment that we tell every potential seller to stop offering collection, but i do think it important to at least ensure that sellers know the risks they undertake. We all have different levels of risks we are happy to take and that decision can only be made with a full understanding of exactly what those risks are.

Percy1983

Out of interest it could be worth asking for them to send it as a paypal gift, yes it won't protect against chargebacks but it will get round the INR dispute problem.