New house anti social behaviour

delmar39

pjcox2005 wrote: »

Just to caveat my point here, I obviously think an issue with drugs does exist and could be handled better. I just think more could be done for children and respect shown that when they grow up this doesn't become an issue and that they use public places in a more productive manner - whether to socialise, play an activity etc.

Agreed. However, do you think a library car park or behind a library should be a place to hang out? Do you think it's acceptable for under 18s to drink in a library car park and take drugs and sniff plant food off walls? There's an alcohol ban on this site, but they don't care. When they've finished their vodka the bottle is thrown up in the air and it smashes all over the place. Previously I used to walk my little un around the site and we'd sit on the bench and talk. Not anymore. These yobs are spoiling our quality of life. If they're there tonight I'll have to wait up for the missus to watch her from her car to our front door. When under the influence they are irrational and very disruptive.

poppysarah

delmar39 wrote: »

You have to accept that some kids cause trouble. A problem that the authorities cannot seem to do anything about.

Parenting orders can be used.
ASBOs to restrict areas they can go in.

Kids can cause as much trouble in their own homes as they want, but in public we need them to learn (and learn quickly) that being an idiot isn't allowed.

One troublesome lad near us has parents the police only visit in pairs.

Parents need to take control of their kids.

pjcox2005

poppysarah wrote: »

Parenting orders can be used.
ASBOs to restrict areas they can go in.

Kids can cause as much trouble in their own homes as they want, but in public we need them to learn (and learn quickly) that being an idiot isn't allowed.

One troublesome lad near us has parents the police only visit in pairs.

Parents need to take control of their kids.

I agree, if particular measures are taken by police etc against a child who has regualrly caused trouble then fine, and no doubt the police are very much aware of the situation if they have.

I also agree that some teenagers are trouble, but then I also believe many adults are trouble. Does it mean that their friends/acquaintances should be dealt with in the same way just on the offchance that it may lead to something, then no.

They should be able to carry on as they please unless they get into trouble themselves. If they are noisey at unsociable hours then a quite word should be said, but punished (e.g. mosquitio, constantly told to move on) for just sitting around, then no.

Finally, I just want to say I'm not trying to be awkward and appreciate dealing with these things can be difficult. I just thought many of the comments seemed over the top on this thread (whether made in jest (i hope) re baseball bat, the generic all skate parks are bad etc) and just add to the bad press children/teenagers now get.

delmar39

poppysarah wrote: »

Parenting orders can be used.
ASBOs to restrict areas they can go in.

Kids can cause as much trouble in their own homes as they want, but in public we need them to learn (and learn quickly) that being an idiot isn't allowed.

One troublesome lad near us has parents the police only visit in pairs.

Parents need to take control of their kids.

Agreed. Some of the parents have been sent ASBO warning letters according to the police / ASB Officer. Other things that can be used (from Home Office website):

• interviews, contracts and agreements
• fixed penalty notices and penalty notices for disorder
• parenting orders, individual support orders, noise abatement notices, injunctions, dispersal powers and anti-social behaviour orders (ASBOs)
• eviction from council house

Problem is I don't see any of these being used. If they put a dispersal order on the library then this gives them more powers. However, they then need the resources to follow it through.

There are plenty of powers, but for us the problem is the same as it was 2-3 months ago.

lindos90

delmar39 wrote: »

If they put a dispersal order on the library then this gives them more powers. However, they then need the resources to follow it through.

There are plenty of powers, but for us the problem is the same as it was 2-3 months ago.

Ah, resources, so there could be a reluctance to commit to persue due to priorities and finances, (insert 'roll eyes' here)

Also the 'power' to do something is not the same as 'duty' to do something! Lets them off the hook.

delmar39

pjcox2005 wrote: »

Finally, I just want to say I'm not trying to be awkward and appreciate dealing with these things can be difficult.

I don't think you're being awkward. Perhaps if I were reading this thread from an outsiders point of view I'd be thinking the same i.e what's the problem here. The major issue for us is that they don't just sit outside our house they're generally drunk when they turn up or they gather there to drink and from what we can see take drugs. It's the affect of these substances that turns a harmless group of youths into a rowdy bunch who start to jump around like jack in a boxes. When this is at 10, 11, 12am and beyond, it's not nice.

delmar39

lindos90 wrote: »

Ah, resources, so there could be a reluctance to commit to persue due to priorities and finances, (insert 'roll eyes' here)

Exactly. Through looking into this I naturally looked into what could be done. However, the main thrust seems to be ring, record and respond. This helps the police to build up a picture AND "ask for more resoures." The ASB Officer is looking at setting up dummy CCTV, but I'm not too helpful that this will make a difference. The only way to solve this is to gate it. This would save plenty of money long term. Alas this doesn't even make the radar even though I've offered to part fund it. I don't know why they haven't used a dispersal order other than for the reasons mentioned above. Perhaps the police are happy because they currently know where they're hanging out. Disperse them and they simply move the problem elsewhere. Soooo frustrating this.

poppysarah

pjcox2005 wrote: »

the generic all skate parks are bad etc) and just add to the bad press children/teenagers now get.

I suspect most surveys of how crime has improved in an area when a skatepark has opened probably neglects to say that a lot of the ASB will have moved to the location of the park.

As the OP has found it's about location - youths have places they like to do their thing. If they were all quiet and well behaved you'd not notice them.

Not all teens are bad - I am aware of that.

poppysarah

lindos90 wrote: »

Ah, resources, so there could be a reluctance to commit to persue due to priorities and finances, (insert 'roll eyes' here)

Also the 'power' to do something is not the same as 'duty' to do something! Lets them off the hook.

Parents have the power to ensure their kids behave.
Parents have the resources (homes, gardens and cash) to ensure their kids do not cause a nuisance to anyone else.

For the most part, being moved on, or took home is the only action open to the police. Removal of alcohol is done frequently in our area. Open bottles are tipped and unopened get took away.

We have had dispersal orders in our area which solved the gangs of youths congregating but only cos the police re-organised their shifts to make more officers available at peak crime times (Why on earth it doesn't run like that all the time?)

delmar39

poppysarah wrote: »

We have had dispersal orders in our area which solved the gangs of youths congregating but only cos the police re-organised their shifts to make more officers available at peak crime times (Why on earth it doesn't run like that all the time?)[/QUOTE]

I know, it makes you wonder why it's so difficult. I worked for a police force once as a support member of staff (service reviewer) and then went onto to work for a private firm and did quite a bit of police consultancy. I sat in a few Tasking and Coordinating meetings where they used to review crime patterns and allocate resources accordingly. So they do do it and in the main I think this approach works. At the end of the day we are logging incidents so it'll be being highlighted that there is still a problem.

Just spoken with another of our PCSOs who called with an update. They are awaiting a senior officer to sanction the use of the library out of hours so things looking good on that front. She also said that it is on their regular patrol route now, but that we should still keep reporting incidents. If it's something more minor, like 3 of them just sat there, she said to call the station direct just to report it so it goes towards building up the bigger picture without being recorded as an incident. Makes sense.

So, whilst the problem hasn't gone away yet, they are at least making some progress.