Roaming gang of Lithuanian squatters snatching our homes!

mostlycheerful

On that account, you should NOT be going up in arms when back office functions like IT services are outsourced?!

I’ve never commented about that. And, er, off the top of my head I don’t know much about the possible good or bad points of outsourcing IT. But I’ll have a think about that and if there’s anything worth saying about it then maybe I’ll comment.

With Polish folks being employed to do a job that they are willing to do for a lot less!

Er, again, I don’t know much about Polish workers except that they mostly have a reputation for being good reliable workers and cheaper than their British equivalents here in London, which, of course, some indigenous tradesmen don’t like when they find themselves being undercut, as my builder/carpenter friend was saying a while ago.

With redundancies made by say the post office because of automation!

My postie mate hasn’t mentioned that to me but he has certainly told me a bit about some of the wretched behaviour by the management.

You should also not have an issue with a pure capitalist view of the world,

Ah, right, now that is something that, from a layman’s point of view, I know a bit about. Right, in a perfected society poor people would be given enough to have a decent standard of living whereas in the current “meritocracy” the rich and clever exploit the weak and vulnerable and often crush them underfoot and that is wrong and disgusting. What could and should be done about this I have thought about quite a bit and I’ve written a bit about it and I’ve got some more written up which I may or may not publish at some point.

which means no benefits for you!

Er, if I need benefits then, luckily cos I live in UK, there is help for me when I need it. However, for your information, I was lucky enough to be able to sign off benefits some time ago. But I’m very grateful they were available to me when I needed them.

Right, any more mud you’d like to try to chuck at me while we’re at it? At least, although you appear to be ranting, you’re nevertheless attempting to make some sort of political points, which is better than just mere rudeness and nastiness - except that you appear to just be venting and going off target. Yeah, your comments are rather random and a bit loony. Not very articulate or thought through. Are you on one at the moment? I’m actually quite chilled myself at the mo’.

mostlycheerful

Here it is happening again and sadly the knowledge of how to legally stop this immediately has not been disseminated and publicised sufficiently so citizens are still getting ripped off :

Hotelier leaves home for a week so it can be decorated . . . then 15 jobless Italian squatters move in
“Police are powerless to intervene because squatting is a civil rather than criminal offence.”
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1322246/Man-leaves-home-week-decorated-15-squatters-in.html#ixzz12zl8yuXA

Except that if the police who failed to act in this instance knew the law that they are suppose to be upholding and if the solicitor that the victim has consulted knew the law that they are supposed to be helping to apply, they would inform the victim the following, here taken from a police information website :

(1) A displaced residential occupier, a protected intending occupier or a person acting on their behalf can use reasonable force to secure entry to the property.

“A squatter is a person who lives in a property without the permission of the owner. A squatter is not a person who has defaulted on rent payments and this answer does not apply to them, see Q46 and Q47 for information about tenants.

This is a summary of some of the provisions in the Criminal Law Act 1977. It is intended to be a guide and you would be wise to seek professional advice about the exact provisions, as you could be liable for a criminal offence or be sued if you get it wrong.

Categories of individuals that are able to take reasonably direct action

• A person who lives at domestic premises and is away, perhaps on holiday, when the squatters move in is called a 'displaced residential occupier'.
• A person who is intending to live at the premises as an owner, under a leasehold agreement (but only so long as there is two years left) or most rental agreements (but not all) is called 'protected intending occupiers'.

A displaced residential occupier, a protected intending occupier or a person acting on their behalf can use reasonable force to secure entry to the property. However . . . .
before this can be done a written declaration must be obtained from a commissioner of oaths (usually certain more senior solicitors). Once this has been obtained then entry can be gained. If the squatters refuse to leave then they commit an offence and the police should be called to deal with the matter.

Any person using excessive force could leave themselves open to criminal and civil proceedings.

Outside the above provisions, a landlord/owner etc. cannot force entry into property where there are squatters whilst someone is inside. However, they can get a court order fairly easily [not according to all the victims who report that it takes months and that negligent incompetent ignorant solicitors rob them of lots of money unnecessarily into the bargain as well] and deal with the matter by that means.”

https://www.askthe.police.uk/content/Q718.htm

(2) Repossession without a note from a commissioner of oaths

However, due to police usually saying that it’s a civil matter and refusing to act, lawful owners and residents can legally repossess their properties by simply entering them and taking them over without need for a note from a commissioner of oaths, as demonstrated in these instances :

(2.1) Squatters demand £3,000 from family to leave home
A family today told how they were locked out by squatters after leaving their north London home for three days.

The owner “climbed through the window and confronted them. They became quite aggressive and ordered me to leave.” He added: “An Englishman's home is his castle and although I'm old, I wasn't going to be bullied. I threw their stuff out of my bedroom and set up base there. They carried on smoking and drinking and inviting friends over. They acted like hooligans.” The squatters left on Monday after a five-day stay. Mr Ahmed said: “I was so angry with police. It was obvious that the back and front doors had been forced and we had all the documents to prove the house was ours.”
http://www.thisislondon.co.uk/standa...-taken-over.do

(2.2) And some more supposed police advice apparently confirming the same :

How to stop the squatters moving in: Know the rules to protect your home from intrusion
“…the police…advised me to wait until he left the property, change the locks and then make the property secure. If he broke back in, he'd be committing an offence.”
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/property/article-1200216/How-stop-squatters-moving-Know-rules-protect-home-intrusion.html#ixzz10G911zUA

An appalling state of affairs. As many people have been saying for a long time, the current legislation is inadequate and coupled with this the police mostly don’t know the law and fail to inform the victims of their rights, solicitors mostly either don’t know the law or deliberately withhold the information, and so it continues, the gross antisocial insanity of foreigners taking over citizens’ property any time they’re out, and citizens, due to their ignorance of such strange events, not knowing their rights and how to deal promptly and efficiently with this kind of awful rip off.

More publicity is needed and police and solicitors all need to be trained in the law regarding squatting instead of the current utter shambles in which most of them don’t know the law! Incredible in the year 2010. But just another example of how far the rot has gone in crime-pays-UK. It’s just a dog eat dog free for all, the authorities routinely fail to apply or uphold the law and are mostly ignorant of what the law is and so citizens have to defend themselves as best they can in the absence of any rule of law or competent government. Almost complete failure of government, police and justice system in UK.

For more information re squatting (and adverse possession) see :
Squatters Rights thread by alona1
https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/2744342

mostlycheerful

Minister launches advice in new drive against evicting squatters
Mr Shapps published the guide weeks after a businessman was left homeless for a fortnight when 10 squatters claiming to be students invaded his £700,000 house. Connan Gupta, 40, returned from a holiday to find the squatters — believed to be Italians — at his five-bedroom home in Camberwell.
http://www.thisislondon.co.uk/standard/article-23895451-minister-launches-advice-in-new-drive-against-evicting-squatters.do

Guide to stop squatters published online
A guide for homeowners, aimed at stopping squatters "invading" their property, has been published online.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-11707517

Online guidance on squatters launched
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/online-guidance-on-squatters-launched-2128308.html

But sadly the new document :

http://www.communities.gov.uk/documents/housing/pdf/1762615.pdf

by Grant Shapps and the “Ministry of Justice” fails to explain that in fact current law is not applied in England and Wales.

Although the document states that :

“The police may decide to make an arrest on suspicion of an offence under Section 7 of the Criminal Law Act 1977, which says that it is an offence, subject to certain defences set out in the Act, for a person who is on residential premises as a trespasser to fail to leave having been required to so by or on behalf of a displaced residential occupier or a protected intending occupier.”

it fails to explain that actually the police universally routinely refuse to act and state that “it’s a civil matter” and that there is nothing that they can do.

The new document also states that :

“What should I do if a squatter has damaged or stolen my property?
If a squatter damages your property either whilst entering or once inside the property, they may be guilty of criminal damage. You can call the police to report this.
Similarly, if they steal items from the property, or use the utilities they may have committed a criminal offence, and you should report this to the police.”

But, as everyone knows, this is not true as “squatters” are universally allowed to break and enter in order to take possession of properties and despite breaking and entering supposedly being a criminal offence it is universal routine police policy not to prosecute this crime in the context of “squatting”. Police routinely allow criminals to engage in burglary and home invasion under the guise of “squatting” as numerous recent examples reported in media abundantly illustrate, some of which are listed with links further back on this thread and other threads here at MSE.

No, you cannot “call the police to report [that the criminals] may be guilty of criminal damage” or that they have stolen items or illegally used utilities as the police universally routinely fail to act and always state that “it’s a civil matter” and not criminal.

This untrue, misleading document will now have to be corrected with the true facts about how the laws are universally routinely not applied by the police who routinely fail to and refuse to apply them in the context of squatting :

http://www.communities.gov.uk/documents/housing/pdf/1762615.pdf

Advice on dealing with squatters in your home
What can I do if my home has been taken over by squatters?
If you return from holiday or walking the dog to find squatters in your home and they refuse to leave, you can call the police and report a criminal offence.
If you intend to move into a property, but are currently not living there (for example because you are carrying out repairs), you may also be protected by the criminal law.
The police may decide to make an arrest on suspicion of an offence under Section 7 of the Criminal Law Act 1977, which says that it is an offence, subject to certain defences set out in the Act, for a person who is on residential premises as a trespasser to fail to leave having been required to so by or on behalf of a displaced residential occupier or a protected intending occupier.
Always remember that you will have to be able to prove that you are either a displaced residential occupier or protected intending occupier of the property.

What should I do if a squatter has damaged or stolen my property?
If a squatter damages your property either whilst entering or once inside the property, they may be guilty of criminal damage. You can call the police to report this.
Similarly, if they steal items from the property, or use the utilities they may have committed a criminal offence, and you should report this to the police.

Do ‘squatters’ rights’ really exist?
The popular notion of ‘squatters rights’ arises from section 6 of the Criminal Law Act 1977, which makes it an offence to use violence or threats of violence to gain access to premises when there is someone on the premises who is opposed to such entry.

See also :

Knife-wielding Lithuanian squatters who move in when residents go out
https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/2748670

Squatters Rights
https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/2744342

mostlycheerful

It’s still going on, here’s another gross outrage occurring at the moment in London. More foreigners illegally breaking and entering a house that a family are about to live in.

Usual failure by government, police and courts to evict the home invaders.

Police fail to arrest them despite the crime of breaking and entering.

Owner evidently doesn’t know that as a protected intended occupier he can legally go straight in and evict them by use of reasonable force, examples of which are cited on this thread.

Added twist, because the foreign home invaders are on the dole getting benefits they are also getting legal aid to fight the case, all paid for, of course, by taxpayers, whereas the owner resident-to-be works so gets no help and is having to rent a flat to house his family cos the foreigners are keeping him out of his own house!

Amazing, incredible, happening right now, yet again, in lawless London in crime-pays-UK, despite Grant Schapps, the Tory Housing Minister’s supposed new policy, but which actually he and his useless staff and his useless government fail to apply!

Foreign squatters given legal aid to fight eviction from £1million house... as its British owner has to represent himself in court
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1359285/Foreign-squatters-given-legal-aid-fight-1m-house-eviction.html#ixzz1Eet2Tc5v

Jebrelli

My sister in law exchanged contracts on her old flat 3 weeks ago and completion is this Friday (it's taken them 9 months to sell, so it'll be a happy day!). Unfortunately squatters broke in last week (the property is empty) and trashed the place - including spray painting over the walls and (for some absurd reason) putting cat food in the cold water tank.

When the police were called the two squatters tried to say they'd rented the place off someone - but they eventually left, and only then was it clear that they'd damaged the flat so badly. I just can't understand why people would claim they wanted to live there and then ruin the place?

This was in east London by the way.

Blobby8_2

mostlycheerful wrote: »

It’s still going on, here’s another gross outrage occurring at the moment in London. More foreigners illegally breaking and entering a house that a family are about to live in.

Usual failure by government, police and courts to evict the home invaders.

Police fail to arrest them despite the crime of breaking and entering.

Owner evidently doesn’t know that as a protected intended occupier he can legally go straight in and evict them by use of reasonable force, examples of which are cited on this thread.

Added twist, because the foreign home invaders are on the dole getting benefits they are also getting legal aid to fight the case, all paid for, of course, by taxpayers, whereas the owner resident-to-be works so gets no help and is having to rent a flat to house his family cos the foreigners are keeping him out of his own house!

Amazing, incredible, happening right now, yet again, in lawless London in crime-pays-UK, despite Grant Schapps, the Tory Housing Minister’s supposed new policy, but which actually he and his useless staff and his useless government fail to apply!

Foreign squatters given legal aid to fight eviction from £1million house... as its British owner has to represent himself in court
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1359285/Foreign-squatters-given-legal-aid-fight-1m-house-eviction.html#ixzz1Eet2Tc5v

"Southern softies bend over for scum" would be a more accurate headline. Baseball bats, shotguns & muscle.

martindow

I worry when all of the articles quoted are from the Daily Mail. Are there more reliable accounts in papers that we could trust?

mostlycheerful

martindow wrote: »

I worry when all of the articles quoted are from the Daily Mail. Are there more reliable accounts in papers that we could trust?

No, you can't trust any of it, it's all just hogwash. Bunkum. Flim flam. It's obviously fake. It's not happening at all. It's clearly just made up by racists to be horrible and offensive.

Have you googled it to find out and satisfy yourself whether it's true or not? Perhaps that's what you should do next and then maybe you can lay your fears to rest. Or, shock horror, you may be able to confirm that what you suspect is the case and that it's just completely made up, you may find out that actually it's not true at all. It could just be completely fabricated and made up, that particular UK national newspaper is notorious for inventing bogus stories that are completely untrue. Yes, you can never believe anything in that one, they just lie all the time, it's mostly written by short story writers and teenagers on the dole.

In fact some of the other ones do the same so, really, you can't believe anything you ever read in a newspaper, it's all just fantasy and lies. In fact a lot of tv and radio news is the same, it's just actors and fiction writers, none of it's true. People just say any old silly stuff just to be entertaining but it's all false, none of the supposed reported news is true. All that guff about an earthquake at the moment, none of that's true, that's all just actors on a film set.

N79

Well in this case the daily fail says that the application for an interim order failed on a technicality. Without knowing what that technicality was it is difficult to comment further. (The most common failure is a refusal to accept an open costs order against the claimant if the subsequent possession hearing fails on appeal but that seems unlikely here if the daily fail's reporting that a possession order was granted is accurate).

mostlycheerful

It’s no surprise that it’s still going on, here’s more foreign home invaders ripping off people’s homes while they’re out or having repairs done. This time it’s Romanian gypsies.

Squatters said I was dead as they drank my wine
http://www.thisislondon.co.uk/standard/article-23978575-squatters-said-i-was-dead-as-they-drank-my-wine.do

Immigration officer comes home to find family of Romanian gypsies squatting in her house, wearing her clothes and drinking her wine
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2026723/Immigration-officer-comes-home-family-Romanian-gypsies-squatting-house-wearing-clothes.html#ixzz1VGSrt6N2

Gipsies move into immigration officer's home while she spent night away at Proms
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/immigration/8704896/Gipsies-move-into-immigration-officers-home-while-she-spent-night-away-at-Proms.html

Still the Housing Minister Grant Shapps and the UK government fail to act.

He’s said he’s going to ban squatting but that’s a mistake as squatting houses homeless people and brings unused properties into use.

No, what he and the government should do is :

(1) publicise to and educate the mostly ignorant police, lawyers, courts, media and public the current law :

https://www.askthe.police.uk/content/Q718.htm

and the cases cited above in this thread that owners and occupiers can legally evict home invaders and squatters on the spot without need of court action, see posts above on this thread for details.

(2) arrest and deport foreign criminals and close the porous borders to foreign criminals

It's a shame that Shapps has failed to act and may instead be about to make a major blunder.