Illegal Behaviour

mikewebs

peter999 wrote:

Financial Economics dictates why migrants are taking these low pay jobs
& British people are not.

They don't have the same overheads. They tend to live in multiple occupancy dwellings, probably far more to a room/flat, and possibly even in caravans. Their "home" is in their home country and they are only here to earn money, so they won't incur the same overheads as those who are "living" in the UK.

Also, there is plenty of evidence that a lot of immigrants are working in the shadow economy, either as self employed (not registered for tax) or working for cash for unscrupulous employers, so the treasury don't receive their due tax and NIC from their earnings in the UK.

When the DWP accountant takes a low pay job & lives in a crammed house,
we'll see what he says then.

peter999

There is also a school of thought - growing ever greater I believe - that thinks that so-called immigrants are working in low paid jobs because non-immigrants (i.e. British Nationals) are not prepared to work for p*** poor wages doing the real dirty unwanted jobs of society. I would heartily agree with this school and suggest that the growing number of society that wants it all now - often the younger end of the job market - and aren't prepared to work hard to get there (i.e. start at the bottom and work up). I have started at the bottom twice in really awful jobs and worked my way up in different industries. Now I can't work full time and can't get anyone to employ me because of my health, so I am trying to better myself doing a part-time college course with a view to doing some voluntary work for local charities and my local church would rather do that than do nowt.

I have found that younger people see those with nice cars, houses, possessions etc. Often, they think that they have a god given right to their own possessions rather than working hard, saving hard to afford these things. This is a societal problem and this is when the low paid immigrants succeed, because they don't care what work they do, they are just grateful for a job. Let's be honest, who would apply for a job that reuiqed you to shovel tonnes of horse muck out of an aeroplane for 12 hours a day? Not many Brits. Who would put up with abuse these days on a day to day basis? Not many Brits - yes I know there are many (but it seems fewer and fewer are 'home-grown'.

Anyway that is my contribution to this debate - which I am sure could go on forever.

kev1n3

robindunne1 wrote:

I am an accountant who works for the DWP and I have seen some threads in this discussion area wondering if they should report someone for fraudulent behaviour.

Those who steal from the public purse to feed their own laziness and should be punished accordingly.

Think of the people approaching retirement who lose sleep at might wondering if their state pension will be enough to support them – even after paying NI for 40 years.

Think of the nurse who cannot afford to live because her pay is so bad.

The single mother who has been forced out on the street because of a violent husband.

People sat on NHS waiting lists for months needing an operation.

Lying about circumstances to have better benefits is stealing from the most vulnerable people in society. There should be no question over whether to report them or not

Anybody in receipt of benefits needs to seriously examine himself or herself to see if they can support themselves rather than dilute the pot for those people who may need it more. There are plenty of jobs in this country (enough to employ over since the EU was expanded.) Those who choose not work, while being capable have stunted economic growth in this country for decades.

Working the system to bleed a couple of more quid out of it is immoral. Corrupt and fraudulent individuals not only steal financially from the poor, they also tarnish those who need help with a terrible reputation.

I would exhort anyone who knows of somebody who cheats the system to report them as soon as possible.

`

I AGREE 100%.

In the street where I live there are 4 couples all on disability benefits, they make no secret of he fact when in discussion with them.
Two of the cpls have new disability cars and the other two cpls have fairly new ones. The husband of one cpl has been banned from driving for 5 years for DD and the wife doesn’t drive. The other day I noticed on the banned driver’s car (that has been standing in the communal car park for the last 5 months) displaying a DLA tax disk (cheek of it)

All four cpls stand car boot sales every Sunday and openly admit they can make up to £300-£400.in one day. My blood boils every morning when I have to walk by their houses at 5:45 on my way to work thinking about that £600 in tax I will be paying at the end of the month, also knowing they make far more money than I do, taking into account all of the sub benefits they can claim. I.e. free car, free tax, free insurance, free parking, dental care, eye care, housing, council tax etc, etc.

I talk with confidence because I reported the above mentioned some 5 months ago to the DWP. And nothing has changed so far.

In my opinion, The DWP and DLA fraud office are a complete joke and unfit for purpose. There is no doubt in my mind (and no doubt millions of other hard working people in this country) There needs to be a much more rigorous system put into place to stop theses clingons, scroungers etc.

I’m sure there are lots of genuine people out there that need DWP and DLA support. My opinions are not aimed at those people; it’s solely aimed at the professional scroungers out there understand and know every trick in the book to obtain a free ticket in life.

As you quite rightly pointed out , over half a million immigrants have found employment here.. why have we still got youths dossing on the streets at 10am in the morning supping from a tinni? Shouldnt they be at work?

Why are unemployed people not assigned Communal duties?

Fran

kev1n3 wrote:

`
In the street where I live there are 4 couples all on disability benefits, they make no secret of he fact when in discussion with them.

All four cpls stand car boot sales every Sunday and openly admit they can make up to £300-£400.in one day........

......taking into account all of the sub benefits they can claim. I.e. free car, free tax, free insurance, free parking, dental care, eye care, housing, council tax etc, etc.

I talk with confidence because I reported the above mentioned some 5 months ago to the DWP. And nothing has changed so far.

Perhaps nothing has done because you are wrong about any fraud (which is presumably your thought)?

You CAN earn money when on DLA, it is not an income related benefit.

Also I believe another person can drive a disabled person's car to take them around?

It is this reporting attitude without knowing the facts that gives genuine people the stigma attached to all benefit claimants.

Gorgeous_George

The fact i sthaththere are people who make fraudulent claims. We all know that.

Equally, there are many people who do claim there entitlement. Possibly something to do with pride.

I hope anybody making money at car boot sales are declaring the income for tax purposes.

We all know people who choose not to work because they are happy to claim benefits.

My daughter claims significant benefits legally. She is given more than my son earns by working 56 hours per week. But I can say that I am proud of my son.



GG

liney

Unfortunately, unless the goverment cap benefits then there will always be families quids in choosing not to work. They aren't doing anything wrong by claiming those benefits if they are doing so above board. Whether that level of benefit should be available to anyone at all is questionable.

pboae

robindunne1 wrote:

Think of the people approaching retirement who lose sleep at might wondering if their state pension will be enough to support them – even after paying NI for 40 years.

Think of the nurse who cannot afford to live because her pay is so bad.

The single mother who has been forced out on the street because of a violent husband.

So do I report the pensioner who does odd jobs for cash in hand, because he can't afford to heat his house on his state pension?

Do I report the single mother for earning a little extra cash on the side to put a roof over her and her kids' heads (after being forced onto the streets by the violent husband)?

What about the nurse who fiddles her tax to try and make ends meet?

Yes I agree that benefit fraud is a huge problem, and harms those who need it most, but it just isn't always that clear cut. Add to which, I don't trust the benefits agencies to treat people decently and to be fair, honest in their investigations, regardless of whether the claimant had done something wrong or not. So personally, I would be very wary of reporting anyone unless I was absolutely sure that they were doing something that was both legally and morally wrong.

saintjanet

I have just read the post by kev1n3,iwill not quote it or we will be here all night,in reply you seem to know an awful lot about these people, are you a private detective?if you have reported them they will be investigated and if what you say is true action will be taken against them,it all takes time.

these professional scroungers/clingons[charming turn of phrase]that you describe know "Every trick in the book"to get benefits for life,or so you think well have a look on some of the disability forums and see just how difficult it is for genuinely disabled people to receive dla and other things they are entitled to ,people are turned down time after time,if it was so easy they would not be,dont take my word have a look at youreable.com.

I am not defending the people you describe,i pay my taxes too,all i am saying is you dont just fill in a form,tell a few lies and get given a car and disability benefits unlimited!

System

saintjanet wrote:

Toots wrote:

No one would disagree with you but if you read my last post,you may realise that the point is ,who decides if someone is on the fiddle,many people are not yet are still reported by people who think they are.

also read some of the other posts from people who have been accused unjustly.

There is a huge difference between being reported and being convicted of it.

If you are innocent there's nowt to worry about?

Gorgeous_George

saintjanet wrote:

...well have a look on some of the disability forums and see just how difficult it is for genuinely disabled people to receive dla and other things they are entitled to ,people are turned down time after time,if it was so easy they would not be,dont take my word have a look at youreable.com.

I am not defending the people you describe,i pay my taxes too,all i am saying is you dont just fill in a form,tell a few lies and get given a car and disability benefits unlimited!

If your application fails, surely you cannot have been entitled to what it was you were applying for.

I'm sure that there are many disabled people failing to secure certain benefits. For every one of them, there'll be a hundred scroungers trying it on. It's these people that the OP suggests we report. Any investigations on genuine recipients will be very short.

GG

System

Gorgeous_George wrote:

If your application fails, surely you cannot have been entitled to what it was you were applying for.

GG

I am not sure about the disabilty benefit, but I know of a whole family claiming various benefits when they are not entitled to them. I am not just guessing at this, the family openly brag about it, like it's something to be proud of!!!

It's the done thing in their family.

i just cant believe that there isn't something in place to spot this kind of behaviour.