It's STILL tough and not getting better - so how are we coping?

sammy_kaye18

Morning all

Just saw this article pop up whilst I was checking my email and thought I'd share it with you all.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/39542375/ns/business-us_business

It does make you wonder though just how well some of us OSers would be if ever we were found in that situation - I mean the woman who gets $435 of food stamps for her and her 6 kids - that equates to roughly £270 for the month (give or take a few quid) for 7 people. I can imagine that's a BIG push to keep them all fed etc.

I think a system like that would be far better for those claiming all these benefits - giving them food stamps to ensure the children are fed, possibly housing benefit to ensure they keep a roof over their head but all other forms of providing are then on the parents shoulders.

artybear

ceridwen wrote: »

Well one of the (unstated) reasons that women in my generation went to University was to find a suitable husband - Universities were very good "marriage markets" back in those days.

I sometimes wonder if thats still a bit of the thinking behind sending children to University - ie to meet suitable marriage partners.

I rather thought that most people who still bother getting married/living together in a "marriage" sort of way waited till their 30s now anyway...but maybe theres still some sort of unspoken thinking to that effect.

I think one has to adjust ones thinking in the light of how Society is these days (I would wouldnt I - thats what INTJ personality types do:rotfl::D).

I know my father came from a poor background (poor not because of HIS fathers salary level - but because there were too many children for that salary level to cope with adequately) and he believed strongly that education was the route out of poverty - but isnt so sure these days. I believed strongly (if a bit too late:(:cool:) in education per se - but these days I think the "University experience"/value of a degree has been devalued so much that its simply not worth what it once was - hence I would urge a child who was brilliant at something very "marketable" and that many others couldnt do (like maths/sciences/etc) to go to University still - but would be looking for some good-quality vocational training for any other children (you should see what some plumbers earn.......:eek::D). I wouldnt feel the need to put a female child into a suitable "Marriage Market" setting like I used to (having changed my thinking to adapt to the times.....). My one concern about putting children into vocational training would be how I could steer them towards a job that WAS vocationally-based but WASNT one that carried a high risk of damaging their health at work (so - no they could NOT be a roofer for instance - plead with Mama as they might....:rotfl:).

I dont really know quite what IS the route of poverty these days - except that it certainly ISNT being a footballer or WAG as some young people seem to think.

Um....I would strongly strongly disagree with the bolded bit and am amazed that a person can even think like that.

I did say, when posting that I believe only people who are capable and WANT to go to uni should go, however I dont think they should be 'put off' going just cuz of the monetry factor.

gailey_2

Im confused with news sems higher earning tax rate will decrease to 42k not 44k.
If hubby gets new job we will most certailnly lose our cb which means any gain in salary may not be so great.

But we have notice at least will spend next 2years 2011/2012 clearing all personal debts like credit cards and overdrafts and hopefully be in better shape financially to sustain the cut, dont want this change to hold back hubbys career as higher salary now means debts paid down quicker.

Theres also a change to childcare vouchers coing into place but not axed completly just high earners get less.

Thats all the child related stuff wondering wat else is lurking in spending reveiw that may effect us.

fatherinlaws car past mot 1st time , hubby reckons will save him pterol if uses car in week for work to counteract rise in petrol just been and and rise in jan.

still not been able to afford to plan for xmas.
still need to go down ikea.
stockpiling not doing so well either as so limited on space.
noticed lakeland do hanging shelves which hook onto back of door which may be solution in kitchen..

Had to chuckle at stuff under bed, I hide choc and biscuits from family as they dont last 5mins.

tempted to buy xmas chocs and tell mil to keep them hostage as we cant be trusted as few good offers right now.

we need new curtains for lounge , went in big primark homeware department other day really impressed some lovley stuff, so when we get spare cash living room needs brightening up its so bland.

got to do lots housework today fallen behind as felt so rubbish.

wondering what to cook today as not feeling too bad thinking quorn bol, fish pie and qourn curry maybe and having cookoff to freeze.

quite sunny here today, nboticed forcast rather optimistic for weekend hope they accurate.

Only problem with uni is at 18/19 you dont always know what you want to do.
Now im 30 got fair idea but cost of courses in college then another degree plus would require childcare prohibits me at present hoping open uni might have something suitable in few years need to look into it.

Dont wish to overpush my kids want them to be happy.
However would be great if they could gain proffesional qualifocation rather than fall into retail like me and hubby did as gurantees them good income and most of times stable job. I think its about giving the kids tools to exceed whatever they chose to do in life.

That in part comes from school but think some familes to relaiant on school to instill everything but the parents and the home play important part like reading, helping them with their homework every nite.
Encouraging decent bedtime for their age and hearty breckfast so they can concentrate in school next day.
My eldest does a few extra curricular activities that she enjoys which is good not all academic, encourage them to be fit/active, enjoy sports, work as a team helps them form good working relationships in later life.

gailey_2

sammy_kaye18 wrote: »

Morning all

Just saw this article pop up whilst I was checking my email and thought I'd share it with you all.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/39542375/ns/business-us_business

It does make you wonder though just how well some of us OSers would be if ever we were found in that situation - I mean the woman who gets $435 of food stamps for her and her 6 kids - that equates to roughly £270 for the month (give or take a few quid) for 7 people. I can imagine that's a BIG push to keep them all fed etc.

I think a system like that would be far better for those claiming all these benefits - giving them food stamps to ensure the children are fed, possibly housing benefit to ensure they keep a roof over their head but all other forms of providing are then on the parents shoulders.

Americas a very different system sammy.

read few months back in sunday paper that job seekers are called 99ers as they only get 99weeks of job seekers allowance then no more.

Please dont chuckle to loud at my bad taste in programming but noticed few things from watching lots of american programmes.

watch bringing home baby and fe other baby progammes on discovery home and health.
Some of familes seems very ruch but others seem poor and live with their inlaws or parents.
Quite a few seem to have 2jobs as well just to get by or live in houses way small for their family.
Noticed this on extreme home makeover and teen mom.

I dont think they have generous welfare system over there think its very harsh.People over here dont seem to look at other countries and appreciate how good we have it.

They get food stamps,not sure about child allowance or housing.

The so called poor in uk seem much less poor than their us counterparts from what I see.
Its true living costs maybe lower but they have to pay their own healthcare although assume there must be safety net healthcare wise if they dont have insurance.

I guess at least with food vouchers they cant spend it on booze and fags.But there would be stigma I guess but we already have healthy start vouchers.

My observation on those from working in some deprived areas is they used to be milk milk opnly then extended to veg/fruit but very few chose to buy fruit/veg with them still primarily forumula and milk.

One of bosses in asda made sweeping statement about the booze ailse. that the amount of child/baby related stuff dumped in booze ailse as parents made a choice what was more important to them.
remember seeing programme cant remember name but family spending as little as they can at checkouts then at kiosk spending same amount on fags.

yes you can offer welfare but that child may not be better off if parenst decide to spend money on going out, gadgets and plastic surgury you cant dictate how they spend their money of if they spend it wisly.

The governemnt give benfits in good faith that people will spend as benefit intended I guess.

One thing I do agree should stay is school meals as those familes who get free if diet crap at home least they getting good lunch in school.

Maybe governemnt should look at how benefits can directly benefit the child and bypass the parents and food/roof over head seems a good start.

Primrose

BB1984 - Re your alarm going off without any seeming cause.
Some years ago this happened to us. There was no apparent reason - no thunderstorms, no power cuts, etc. so we called out the service engineer. He checked the whole installation and could find nothing wrong and then checked the passive ray/sensor box in the lounge and started laughing. "Are you very houseproud?" he asked.
"Not really I replied.
"Look here" he pointed. There was a big cobweb woven around the passive ray box and a huge spider tucked away behind it. It turned out that some passive rays are incredibly sensitive and even a spider walking over the sensor can set the alarm off. So that's one place I always remember to dust now.:rotfl:

Patchwork_Quilt

Thank you for the article, Sammy Kaye. I thought it was very sad. As for University, I think we should give subsidies to all students who are intelligent enough to go, regardless of background. They will pay it off in taxes as they get older and it will benefit the country. However, it will screen out the ones that can't think what to do next or who won't do well when they get there. I believe in education as a route out of poverty, having seen friends' children do very well despite circumstances but I have to say it's not always utilised. There are lots of bright kids in school messing around or looking out of the window wishing it was break time. Looking at the economic situation that seems to be developing, I just hope that more of them realise that this is no time to be wasting time.

katholicos

greengoblin wrote: »

I was referring to people in general, and certain people (not on here) I have met specifically.
To the second point of my comment: You are receiving your education in a structured environment. Someone has to mark and judge your work to ascertain what degree you get (1:1 , 2:1 etc) therefore receive a top end degree you must conform to certain formats such as dissertations etc.

I'm not saying uni is a bad idea but it should not be set as the highest standard of intelligence. Many people excel themselves and broaden their horizons without ever going. From a personal interest view the world of botany, geology and zoology would be a lot worse of if it was not for so called "amateurs".
Granted if you eat, breathe and sleep geometry (or similar) you should go and good luck. But I don't think that "getting away from home, living on your own, meeting new people" is a valid excuse to go. Why can't people do that without uni?
Why spend 30K on something you can do it for free?

I'll shut up now:lipsrseal

We will have to agree to disagree, on certain aspects of this discussion, but i apologise to you if you feel my post berated you for having an opinion. So please don't 'shut up'...as in real time when we interact with people, we find ourselves a pretty diverse bunch, we humans....i think that makes life even more interesting

pagangirl

Finally caught up with all posts

[ quote Ceridwen ….. I reckon £500 per month for bills and living on is pr...ett...y good personally...and if someone is living on less than that...then get the kettle on...I'm coming round for coffee and to pick up tips...]


Will put kettle on - what time will you be round??? as currently living on average £345 month - job finished Dec 31st last, nuffin round here anyways..............

Yes it's a struggle, but find I can manage as doing lots of MSE'ing, wombling bills in local Mr T for more points, etc. Also cooking from scratch instead of coming in from work totally shattered and just shoving micro meal in and slumping in chair (like last year) and feel better for it too



hugs to all, specially those going through hard time right now
xx

Churchmouse

ceridwen wrote: »

One doesnt choose to get old - that just happens if one lives long enough. Now if I had chosen to get old on the other hand.....:rotfl: (or to make it even clearer - if I had chosen to get old rather than it being something that I know will happen to me anyway - then I would expect to cover the added expenses of doing so myself. Since I dont have much option BUT to get old then I see it differently). If having children was something that "just happened" (rather than being a choice for people - as it has been for some years) then I would agree with receiving financial help towards their costs - but they dont just happen basically....

(note to self time ceridwen = INTJs have to remember to communicate exactly WHY we think as we do - and not just think "That was the logical decision to come to - so of course people will understand it - even if they disagree").......slaps wrist for not explaining...



Hmmm...new phrase for the day "Getting old is life's default setting".:cool:

True, people choose to have children, by not using failsafe contraception( nature's default setting is to have children :cool:) People get old ( again nature's default setting as you point out) if they're lucky enough not to die of illness or accident, or by choosing not to end their life sooner. That is, not interfering with the natural path;) Don't know who you think will man the buses, serve in shops, run the hospitals that you and everybody needs if nobody has children. Without some sort of allowance, either tax relief or child benefit, only the rich will be able to afford children. Do you really think their offspring are going to be eager to work the sewers, sweep the roads, even climb up on roofs? Might have a surfeit of bankers, stockbrokers, solicitors and doctors though :rotfl:

rachbc

pagangirl wrote: »

Finally caught up with all posts

[ quote Ceridwen ….. I reckon £500 per month for bills and living on is pr...ett...y good personally...and if someone is living on less than that...then get the kettle on...I'm coming round for coffee and to pick up tips...]


Will put kettle on - what time will you be round??? as currently living on average £345 month - job finished Dec 31st last, nuffin round here anyways..............

Yes it's a struggle, but find I can manage as doing lots of MSE'ing, wombling bills in local Mr T for more points, etc. Also cooking from scratch instead of coming in from work totally shattered and just shoving micro meal in and slumping in chair (like last year) and feel better for it too



hugs to all, specially those going through hard time right now
xx

The single persons rate of IS for a 16-24 year old is currently £51.05 a week so yes I rekcon there are plenty of people managing on less than £500 a month for bills and living...