HTC desire connection problems and battery issues - I found the solution

bubblesmoney

EDIT: before reading the long post, i should add that i found the solution (which the tech teams failed to tell me about and they offered me to cancel the contract. with my solution i get a better signal (PRL) and better battery life too). see my posts #33 and 34 on page two of this thread for solution that i found
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Apologies for the long post but just thought i would warn potential buyers of the HTC desire about connection issues i have had.

If you have booked the HTC desire phone for delivery when stock arrives then consider cancelling your order, especially if you live / work in an area with and average to lowish 3g signal.

If you have already got the HTC desire and are having connection problems then read on because you might be eligible for a refund if it is your handset that is at fault.

I am about to cancel my two contracts (both with HTC desires) with three network and return my desire phones as they are unfit for the purpose as they have antenna issues and signal attenuation problems.

I have been having connection problems at one of my workplaces and lucky if i get a connection on all days and frequently varying connection strength. I had reported this issue to network / tech team a few weeks ago. Initially was told problem sorted as fault rectified at transmitter. Then later was told engineer says everything fine now and should work. But today after persisting in my complaints have been told they cant remedy situation and can discuss options including cancelling contract as they now agree that the signal is poor at my workplace and wont be able to remedy situation as no network work is planned at that postcode. They didnt have any comments on the HTC desires antenna though.

some others seem to be having network access problems with the desire and others with the nexus one and also hero as far as i am aware. All manufactured by HTC. I read online on loads of google and android and other forums about nexus one connection problems and hero connection problems and desire connection problems.

The following is what i wrote on three blog comments section which they have been kind enough to allow. The 3blog moderators are further kindly looking into the issue now as well.

I am just posting this here so that any people living / working in areas with poor to average signal and planning on buying HTC desire phones become aware of this issue that might affect them and make a decision suitable to them whether the phone is an appropriate choice. The same might apply for nexus one and hero owners both manufactured by HTC. I cant vouch for that as i dont own those phones but problems look similar from internet posts, so do your own research after reading my post.

extracts of my posts elsewhere regarding this issue.....

see if this helps you find the answer to your signal strength queries.

the signal strength is best measured in numbers like dBm or ASU etc. you can get this information on your HTC desire phone by pressing the menu > settings > about phone > network . when you get to this, you will see operator name, signal strength, mobile network type, service state, roaming details visible. see what the signal strength is and network type.

the bars seen on most phones at the top of the screen are just a crude way of estimating signal strength and are not standardised and different phones and manufacturers may have different numbers of bars and settings for those bars, so basically meaningless other than a crude measurement.

i have been having these issues with the desire and have been chasing the network (level 1 and 2 teams) regarding this issue. they say they have ‘fixed’ the problem and their ‘engineer’ says everything is fine. but at one of my workplaces (which will be my main workplace soon) the signal is poor to fluctuating, even though the postcode checker says it is good to excellent. i have pointed out that other networks (vodafone and O2) dont have signal reception problems at my workplace which i realised after i upgraded. the three tech teams keep parroting that postcode checker says the site is fine and engineer says its fine, which is nonsense. their engineer seems to be defying physics if they are suggesting (till recently even on monday, 2 days ago) there is no technical fault.

for mobile signals there is something called ‘thermal noise floor’ and if the dBm is falling close to -111dBm to -113dBm then the unit cant receive any signal as it will be too weak and similar to background earth radiation. the nearer the dBm to the zero value (since it is mentioned in negatives) the better the strength.

you might get good reception when around -60dBm to -80dBm in my experience, when it gets to -90 or worse like -110dBM you are almost losing signal as close to the ‘thermal noise floor.
the ASU is just a manipulation of the dBm, where ASU is equal to (dBm + 113) divided by 2.

the higher the ASU the better your signal, conversely the lower the negative value of dBm the better the signal. if the dBm is close to -111 to -113 then you are stuffed as it is the thermal noise floor and you wont get a signal.

mind you the signal gets further attenuated by many things including cases and your hand when you hold the phone !!!!! some manufacturers and models (nexus one, htc have been recently plagued by some of these reception issues, see many posts online). the nexus and desire antenna is at the base of the unit, precisely where you will hold the phone and further attenuates the signal. signals will get attenuated in all phones but some phones seem to attenuate them more like the nexus one and guess the desire too which i learnt unfortunately after buying it!

i am awaiting a call today from tech support team again. i have investigated the issue in detail. MIND YOU I AM NO ENGINEER (I could have been one as i had the required scores to get into a good engineering college but decided to do something else instead). but just being a Three engineer doesnt mean they can defy the laws of physics and give some nonsense story to customers.

my phone at my workplace fluctuates between -105 to -111dBm at on of my workplace which is bang on the thermal noise floor so cant get a signal often. i have reported my poor reception and have been told signal is good as per tech support who were informed by the engineer. if it is not sorted after todays (wednesday) pending phonecall then i will video the signal strength shown on my desire and use it as proof that the Three engineer is giving some !!!! and bull story that defys the laws of physics as far as my knowledge goes.

there is no way the signal strength can be -111dBm and for three to claim it is an area with good to excellent signal. this is the situation when OUTSIDE the building with no obstruction. the signal keeps fluctuating at very low levels. my employer has about 7000 employees and probably the biggest employer in the city.

the nhs is europes biggest employer and mainly spread over about 200 nhs trusts. so most of these employees will be concentrated in those 200 spots in the uk. if three network cant provide a decent signal at europes biggest employers sites then i dont know what to say. poor three network signal is not just an issue at my workplace, it is also an issue at a few other nhs hospitals i know like nottingham etc where i know others having similar issues with three. THIS IS NOT A BUILDING ISSUE as other networks are working ok (vodafone and O2). On monday the tech support lady was trying to sell me a story that something might be obstructing the signal between the tower and my workplace even though it might not be visible near my workplace! hope the tech team sorts out the issue including teaching the engineer some basic physics and not expect all custoimers to be ignorant of physics. i might not be trained in the nitty gritty but have a laypersons understanding enough to know that i am being told nonsense by the tech team.

you can all do the following experiment with the desire phone and confirm for yourself what i say about reception and attenuation being a design fault which becomes more acute in weak signal areas especially. i will try to make a video and upload to youtube next week and post a link here and on various forums. so the proof can be seen about the poor signal and design fault that are combining to give reception issues for customers. hope dave from HTC (comes on three blog sometimes) sees this post as well.

THIS wont be an issue if the signal strength is good, but if it is weak then will be an issue because of the signal attenuation problems of the desire because of the design faults of where the antenna lies at the bottom of the unit where it will be covered by the users hand. signal should not get attenuated by 20-25dBm. i can replicate the issue now every single time i do the following test.

all of you can do this test and see the signal attenuation yourself on your desire phones. this will be more obvious in weaker signal areas.

do the follwing test yourself and see what i mean. Do the test at home and for best (worst actually interms of getting signal) results do in a weak signal area.

If you go to Menu > Settings > About Phone > Network you will see a display for “Signal strength”. Place the phone is sitting on the desk, the signal stays consistent. But when I touch my phone the way i would hold the phone to my ear or if i needed to type something, then the signal drops up to as much as -20 dBm or sometimes more. I am able to replicate this test every single time, whether the signal is incredibly strong or weak. This is what i mean about the signal attenuation in the desire and it being a design fault which is compounded by areas with weaker signals.

Please perform this simple test yourself and see for yourself. Video the same (like i will do now) and use that as proof to challenge the operator on the signal being good etc. The tech team needs to recognise that customers are not telling porkies and shouldnt be relying on dubious claims by site engineer. the site engineer cannot defy physics and say signal can be received when the signal is actually equal to the thermal noise floor level (the point at which signals cannot be distinguised from background radiation).

1. Go to the Menu > Settings > About Phone > “Network” screen mentioned above and make sure your phone is sitting on a flat surface. Allow it 30 seconds or so, just to make sure the signal strength stays pretty stable .
2. Pick up the phone straight off the flat surface with one hand the way you would hold your phone for voice calls and also repeat it separately by holding it the way you would for typing.
3. Within a few seconds, if not instantly, you should see your phone jump anywhere from -10 to -30 dBm. The ASU value will consequently fall too and i lose the signal when it falls to 0-1asu. This is a common problem at my workplace and there is noway the Three engineer or tech team or coverage checker can defy physics and claim signal is good.
4. Place the phone back on the flat surface and watch the signal strength increase.

I will post this on other forums too now and will make a video of the test i descibed for actually showing signal strength and attenuation when phone is held, within the week or so and upload it to youtube and various htc desire forums and consumer forums as many will be having similar connection issues and will be being fobbed off by tech teams and HTC who dont know (atleast in public domain) what they are talking about apparently.

I accept i am a layperson but please give some credit to common sense and some rudimentary knowledge of physics to laypeople as well before fobbing them off saying network is fine as per engineer.

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after this post of mine on three blog, i got another call from tech support (they had said they will call me back on wednesday) and after again discussing with me my findings they agreed there was a fault and that cant be rectified and will call me back next week to give me time to decide what i want to do, either continue or cancel contract. The three blog moderator is kindly looking into the issue as well now with the CTO team.

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another post of mine following the discussion with Three tech team today evening (wednesday)...

i had a chat today evening with tech support when they called me after my prev post on here. after discussing my findings with them today they now tell me that engineer has said cant rectify situation so they are giving me option to end contract i think. they will call on thursday next week for my decision. they told me that the nearest cell transmitter of three network is just about 350 yards away !!!!! i am pretty sure he said yards and not metres, although i havent seen a transmitter yet. i admit i havent been looking for one though but guess would have seen it if it was obvious. They said i can end my contract or decide or continue but situation will continue with no plans on upgrades of coverage in the area for now.

I am in a decent sized city and the hospital is a big nhs hospital and the only one for the city with just a sattelite small unit a few hundred metres away. as i said the employer employs around 7000 employees as far as i am aware. if the network cant improve the signal at a citys main hospital within a mile or two of city centre then i dont know what to say.

whats more baffling to me was that they said the transmitter was 350yards away! and i get a signal strength shown as -105dBm to -111dBm with asu reading of 0 to 5 only with fluctuating signal all the time and i am told the engineer has told tech team that transmitter is ok and cant be upgraded anymore!!!! i enquired whether the situation was because of the tower being overloaded with too many customers and was told no that wasnt the reason.

anyway now after todays discussions it looks like my situation wont improve even if i change the phone. so now have to change the phone and network and will now most likely return both my desire handsets as not fit for the purpose of receiving calls or making calls in ‘poor’ signal areas.

Mind you i am told the nearest transmitter is 350yards away so i havent been able to get my head around how the signal is so low outside the building on the road. all nearby houses and buildings are either ground floor only or a max of 1st floor height with only one building of 3 -4 floors height (which is the new hospital building) the area is at an elevation compared to nearby areas so it is not a dip in height that is causing the problem. the building cant be the problem since i was outside the building and other networks (vodafone and O2) work even inside the building even in most of the deepest areas of the building but not all areas i am told.

will start exploring for a new phone and network provider now and will buy some PAYG sim cards of a few other networks to do some dry runs before i commit to another network now.

just some suggestions to Three network for the future.
1. improve network coverage in areas where companies have large numbers of employees concentrated in a small area (eg. nhs hospitals etc). if the network reception is good then most likely that majority of the employees at such places will switch to your network and their families will switch with them too. this isnt just an issue at my work place, my cousin in nottingham has the issue with three coverage in the main hospital in nottingham and has now been forced to get a PAYG from vodafone to get around this.
2. no point saying 98% coverage etc, as what affects consumers if mainly where they work and live and to a lesser extent coverage when they travel. so concentrate in areas with higher population density / large employers etc. i am sure you do already, but just baffling when i was told that no chance of improving coverage when i work with in 1-2 miles of city centre, with mostly 1 floor height buildings around except A 3-4 HEIGHT hospital building and transmitter 350yards away. common sense would indicate there was either a problem with mast height or something else with the transmitter but am told such decisions are made on commercial grounds. i just cant understand how it wouldnt make commercial sense to upgrade a tower or put a new tower at a place within 1-2miles of city centre and at the only major hospital in the city. apparently the tower has been attended to recently and they wont put a new tower as the present one is so nearby anyway.
3. check the signal reception AND attenuation of all HTC models especially (desire / nexus / hero etc and any future model from HTC with antenna at the bottom), please do the checks for signal attenuation especially in lower signal strength areas and dont stock any models of phones that have problems with signal reception in low signal strength areas as you will just get more customer complaints and returns. You might not notice it now but when the initial craze with the phone settles (i mean the desire) then mark my words you will without a doubt get many complaints and returns because of poor signal reception on the desire especially in low signal strength areas irrespective of the distance from the transmitting tower.

The HTC Desire phone is excellent in all respects except poor hands free speaker quality and volume and now what i discovered to be poor signal reception and signal attenuation and consequently limited or no access to making calls or receiving calls in weaker signal areas. In good signal areas i am very pleased with what the phone does and very happy with it. Unfortunately in real life there will be loads of areas with lower signal strength and the htc desire performs poorly in these areas as in my experience and by the looks of it others experience as well it struggles to get a proper signal.

initially i thought the phone was ok and it was the network that was the problem because i tried the simcard in my old sony erickson and got same problem. but looks like in my case it was the phone and the network because one cant have a transmitter 350yards away and still get next to nothing signal and be told the transmitter is ok!!!!! The signal drop i can demonstrate at home as well where i dont have reception issues now. the signal drop is consistently of the order of -20dBm to -25dBm when i hold the phone like i would for receiving calls. My phone is not covered in any case so it is not a phone cover that is dampening the signal reception, it is the design fault of the htc desire phone itself that is the issue that compounds the problem in weaker signal areas.

if i had an option an external case which acted as an antenna i would have tried it as i like what the desire can do when it works that is! it is an amazing piece of kit badly letdown by a poor handsfree speaker and now the antenna issue. battery issues will be common to all smartphones and i have no complaints about that now as have learnt how to get the most out of it for my needs but i carry the charger with me every day to work.

unless something amazing happens to improve my reception at my main work place (i will send the postcode by email to the moderator) it looks more than likely that i am forced to cancel both contracts with three network and return both the desire phones and look for another phone and network. i dont fancy having to buy a PAYG and carry a second phone because three reception is poor (worsened with the desire in low signal areas), i would rather move networks and carry just 1 phone. i dont fancy going to vodafone due to their recent change in FUP and 500mb internet bundles for every extra £5 (when 3 network gives 2gb addon for £5extra and tmobile gives 3gb as standard anyway for android sets), so will explore Tmobile, O2 and giffgaff (which is O2 owned) now. i was willing to wait if it takes times for transmitter upgrades but am told there are no such plans and they wont consider another tower as the present one is just 350 yards away as per tech team today.
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So any buyers or potential buyers of the HTC desire or nexus 1 or probably i guess the Hero too be aware of antenna signal attenuation issues and this might affect you making or receiving calls in areas of average to poor signal strength. This will not be an issue in areas with strong signals.

I really like the HTC desire phone when it works and the speed on connection and multitasking etc etc when it works but a phone basically needs to be able to get a connection and be able to make and receive calls in moderate to poor signal areas too. One morning when i needed to make urgent calls i was stuck as i wouldnt get a signal and couldnt make or receive any calls. This isnt a situation i would want to be especially since i have a less than 2y old child in nursey and need to be contactable by the nursery incase my child isnt well. Probably if three could sort the local signal strength out it wouldnt be an issue but they have indicated today that no work is planned in the area. so have no option other than to cancel contract after i have found an alternative.

So i am again on the hunt for a good smart phone and another network provider with a good signal at my residence and workplaces. Short listing the iphone4g (but most probably i might still buy an android phone instead as the iphone 3gs will feel like !!!! after using the desire for a month now, i dont know how the iphone 4g will be though) and samsung galaxy s and dell streak for now. will buy few PAYG sims from other networks to do dummy runs at my home and workplaces as the network coverage checkers are not worth the accuracy. Apologies for the long post again.

jd87

Well that's far too long for anyone to read. All I know is all different makes of phones have problems getting signal and the iPhone is notoriously bad.

I think coming on here and screaming "CANCEL YOUR HTC!!!!!" based only on you own personal experiences, in one area of the country, is a bit silly.

bubblesmoney

jd87 wrote: »

Well that's far too long for anyone to read. All I know is all different makes of phones have problems getting signal and the iPhone is notoriously bad.

I think coming on here and screaming "CANCEL YOUR HTC!!!!!" based only on you own personal experiences, in one area of the country, is a bit silly.

i am not talking about one area of the country, i am talking about the phone and the antenna where even on picking up the phone the signal strength consistently drops in average to poor strength areas by about -20 to -30dBm, this is too big a drop in my and nexus one owners experience if you see many posts online about this. this wont be an issue for owners who use their phone in good signal strength areas, but will be an issue for many who use the phone in n average to poor signal strength areas.

if you get access to a HTC desire then try what i described and see for yourself the drop in signal strength. you can try this with a nexus one as well and see on the signal strength page how much the signal strengthy drops when you pick up the phone.

picking up the phone is something basic in a phone and if the signal drops by more than 25% then obviously it is a design or unit fault. it cant be a unit fault as i have 2 desire phones and the problem is there with the nexus one if you see reports online, both manufactured by same manufacturer. so it will be an issue for making buying decisions for anyone who will use the phone in average to poor signal strength areas because if the signal further drops by 25% when they lift the phone then it is an issue they will be affected by.

tech support werent even aware of how to read the signal strength on the desire. i had to tell them on the phone yesterday as they werent aware it could be seen on the phone. they werent aware of the signal drop issue on the handset and the antenna being in the base etc etc etc which damped the signal by 25% soon after one lifts the phone.

Jo_F

I have a HTC Desire, and we live in a not so great area when it comes to reception for any carrier, (though some are better than others), and to be honest, I haven't found a problem at all.

The only time I have seen a definate dip in reception was when I was in an aircraft hanger in Somerset, but the phone was still picking up a weak signal, and it was enough to make/receive calls and texts, and although the wifi signal was also ver low, that still enabled me to receive emails.

I don't think it's right to tell everyone to reject their phones, areas, carriers and other factors come into play. The same happens with most phones, doesn't matter on the brand.

LeeSouthEast

What Jo_F said. I live in patchy 3G area at home, phone still works fine. Have a Three aerial on the roof of work building, so get a good signal there

balt

Haven't noticed any problem with mine, there are bound to be bad signal areas with all phones.

Oscar_The_Grouch

jd87 wrote: »

Well that's far too long for anyone to read.

Not really - it was just informative.

I live in an area with patchy signal strength and am also looking for a new phone. I am looking mainly at the Desire and the new iPhone 4. As a result of reading this thread (completely), I will check the Desire out carefully before I buy.

A friend of mine had a 3 phone. We travelled to work together and he always had signal problems on one stretch of motorway and would completely lose signal when other phones in the car (o2, virgin & T-Moble) worked fine, so this is not an isolated issue but may be linked to 3's network only.

johnnyroper

although the OP has identified a potential aerial issue on the desire,my missus has had a 3phone previously and the signal issue is not an isolated incident,even in big cities it would struggle.
kind of reminds me of the old days of one2one when they were absolutely dire for signal the voicemail constantly got used but if i remember correctly the voicemail cost a fair bit to use?? the crafty so and so's.

butterbeanmash

I cancelled my contract with 'three' because of the signal problems with my HTC Hero. They are aware that the HTC phones all have a problem. I believe that this is caused by the firmware that 'three' remove from the phones that allow you to use 2G networks in low signal areas as a priority. The problem is that the phone will hang on to a 3G signal as long as it is able to make and recieve calls, but the signal won't be good enough for data.
I have since unlocked and rooted my phone and am now able to apply the latest radio and the 'GSM auto (PRL)' setting detailed here:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=670999
I have not had the data connection drop in six weeks. Previously I could barely maintain a connection.

parallax_20

I have been having connection problems at one of my workplace

I'm not quite sure Three or any network would take that as a valid reason for cancellation. If you couldn't get a signal at the registered address (Home) then you could have a small case. Also networks don't guarantee any continuous service (T&C), generally to cover their backs from low signal areas caused by obstructions/landscape which is out of their control.

Generally speaking, if your phone picks up a signal, regardless of the strength, they've provided a service to which you have to pay for.

You could try forcing it to use 2G in weaker areas, this helps to avoid drop outs when switching between 3G and 2G whilst on a call. But Three don't like their phones to be stuck on 2G all the time, but hey ho.

Its a shame really, a good phone let down by the network.

butterbeanmash

parallax_20 wrote: »

You could try forcing it to use 2G in weaker areas, this helps to avoid drop outs when switching between 3G and 2G whilst on a call. But Three don't like their phones to be stuck on 2G all the time, but hey ho

They dislike it so much they remove the settings to do it!