Chip 'n' Pin - A Quick Guide Discussion Area

moggsy

James wrote:

The questions are:

Is it safer for a cardholder to PIN or to Sign?

Was the £1.3Bn expenditure worth it?

PIN is safer than signature. Sure there are processes which need ironing out but this will happen over time (such as the banks realising just because someone knows your PIN - doesn't mean you told them).

The money spent was worth it. There are cost savings that you haven't considered which are already saving the card processing companies money. Also bare in mind that the money spent went back into the UK economy (to people like myself) and didn't just disappear into thin air.

All round a great UK IT success I'm sure you'll agree.

Voyager2002

moggsy wrote:

PIN is safer than signature. Sure there are processes which need ironing out but this will happen over time (such as the banks realising just because someone knows your PIN - doesn't mean you told them).

The money spent was worth it. There are cost savings that you haven't considered which are already saving the card processing companies money. Also bare in mind that the money spent went back into the UK economy (to people like myself) and didn't just disappear into thin air.

All round a great UK IT success I'm sure you'll agree.

You almost fooled me! When I read the first paragraph I though you were being serious, but by the end of the post it was clear that this was an example of sarcasm. And yes, I fully agree with the point that you were making in your subtle way.

James

Story here

better read stil:

The ATM Protection Racket

(By Mike Bond, Security Research, Computer Lab, Cambridge Univ) 18 Nov 2006

moggsy

Voyager2002 wrote:

You almost fooled me! When I read the first paragraph I though you were being serious, but by the end of the post it was clear that this was an example of sarcasm. And yes, I fully agree with the point that you were making in your subtle way.

Well to be fair I was teasing James a little. I worked on the Chip & Pin implementation for a large retailer and have mixed views on it. On the one hand I don't think it's the end of the world like James seems to but on the other I know it has it's own limitations and problems.

However please don't under-estimate the amount of work that people have done behind the scenes in order to get Chip & Pin up and running. It's easy to sit back and judge from your armchair but there is a lot more to it than the customer sees. The technology and rules surrounding Chip & Pin are extremely complex and it has taken some retailers many years of work in order to create a solution for their POS system.

Also most of the problems James and others have raised are not about Chip & Pin per se, they involve weaker elements of the chain such as cash machines. However cash machines which read chips are slowly coming on line and this will help cut fraud even further.

Anyway Chip & Pin does seem to be reducing fraud and so myself and the thousands of others who have worked on Chip & Pin solutions must have done something right!

moggsy

James wrote:

Story here

better read stil:

The ATM Protection Racket

(By Mike Bond, Security Research, Computer Lab, Cambridge Univ) 18 Nov 2006

James, Chip & Pin actually combats the problems raised in the first article.

The second article although an interesting read is just one persons take on what could (and probably won't) happen in the future. This article stems from the success of Chip & Pin.

James

Esther Rantzen is Victim of Global Card Scam - Story here:

In the same article a police officer told a victim he no longer used his chip and pin card because he did not trust its security.

PO Worker Steals from Pensioners Using Chip & PIN.

Detail_Merchant

Barclays are to launch a contactless credit card combined with a London transport Oyster card.

Details here:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/business/6176269.stm

It will combine standard chip-and-pin technology for credit card payments alongside that of the Oyster card.

But it will also allow customers to pay for low-cost items in shops without the card having to touch a reader or the user having to enter a pin number.


I don't really think this changes any of the arguments about C&P, but it's an interesting development.

Regards,

Detail Merchant

James

Need to examine the T&C's closely.

They will of course be offering the same card in Chip & Signature form.

Alfie_E

Another one for you, James.

Chip & PIN terminal playing Tetris

James

Cheers Alfie:

Chip & PIN Fraud Alert.

Either APACS is being economical with the truth or there are an awful lot of subscribers to these forums telling porkies.

Bet lots of readers, especiall victims, would feel pretty miffed if they discovered they can opt out of having a PIN with their Credit Card - Chip & Signature Cards are available.