Kleeneeze or Betterware?

hurrah

PatrickD wrote: »

Two very good honest stories. The main point I think you have to take from this, is that the opportunity is exactly the same for everyone. Success or lack of it is mainly down to the motivation of that person. Most will have problems of some sort and it depends on how each person handles those problems.

Pat

What gives you the right to suggest people lack motivation. What qualifications do you bring to the table.

PatrickD

hurrah wrote: »

What gives you the right to suggest people lack motivation. What qualifications do you bring to the table.

I have as much right as anyone else to have an opinion, I suppose. As for qualifications? No written ones, but over ten years experience in direct sales. Not only have I seen people both with and without motivation, I've been that person myself at different times.
Any kind of home business/self employment takes a tremendous amount of self motivation to be successful. For most people, given a choice between going out for a couple of hours every night dropping catalogues, or sit down with a cup of tea and watch Emmerdale and Coronation Street, then most will choose the second and easy option. Its just the normal human way and I've done it plenty of times myself.

Pat

JennyJewell

Hi all
I have been a Kleeneze distributor in the past, (in fact if you read a lot of my posts on MSE I have been involved in loads of opportunities,lol)! Kleeneze worked for me at a time when I really needed it - it also caused stress a lot of the time too but to be completely honest most problems were caused by myself and my lack of discipline and ability to be the most unorganised person I know!
I'm just looking at the website now and can't believe all the products they sell now! Kleenze even sell skincare with organic essential oils
Can anyone enlighten me on start up costs please - I may be interested in re-joining for the right price
Many thanx
Jenny

SkintButHappy

Lol Jenny, the unorganized-ness rings bells! Ive had to learn to be organized and its a struggle! Still learning now!

Yep the new EzeSpa range got launches at this years showcase

I dont want to get told off for recruiting/spamming but what I hope I can say is that there are 4 different ways to get started and they vary in cost + how many catalogues you get.

The_Analyst_2

Jeanetteathome wrote: »

Firstly about the profit - to make £500 clear profit after all the expenses , all the costs the fuel and everything else taken into consideration you'd need to be doing loads of hours , far more than the few they say. Even £300 a month which they trumpet as *being easily attainable* will take every evening and every weekend to get, if they are lucky.

Some of the time is down time though e.g. you can easily package catalogues up while watching TV - it's using time that would otherwise be squandered. How many people waste the hours spent getting to work on the train but don't factor that in when they work out their hourly rate? Petrol costs obviously depend on how local you go. You could carry fifty catalogues on a bike easily enough, if you wanted to keep fit and save petrol.

Jeanetteathome wrote: »

About golds - you miss the fact that the gold can't just sit back , they too have to continue out there retailing to match their group or they'll lose out - the worst place to be I'm told is a Gold with a weak front line team but having one person beneath them get to gold , they lose a load then as they need to match it all the time. Get two go to gold and they get top be bronze.

I haven't missed anything. If you're a Gold you have a great incentive to put catalogues out cos you make a bundle more than your retailers and you make as much off your weakest retailers as they make themselves. Alternatively, you could forego immediate income, as you might in any other long-term business plan, by stacking your retailers one under the other so that they earn most of the bonuses on their own efforts and have more incentive to carry on instead of quitting cos of not making enough after costs. But instead, with the payplan and with rhetoric, the company encourages you to retail heavily, potentially in competition with your own local downline. There's so much emphasis on making money NOW that it seems to miss the point of network marketing completely. Surely the BEST position to be in is to be a Gold with another Gold about to break, then you have the beginnings of an MLM business and you can repeat what you did before to rebuild your own PSG and qualify on what will hopefully become a solid leg. In fact some years ago that was a standard way for big business-builders to bring someone very promising into the business, get them to Gold and gift them another potential Gold straight under them and try to break the two in quick succession.

Jeanetteathome wrote: »

The key here is that at no time can any of them sit back - spend more time with their family , go on nice holidays with all the supposed cash they make - they have to keep on recruiting , keep on putting out catalogues or they'll lose any bonuses they might make.

That's true of almost ANY commission-based work and also many businesses. At least with MLM there's a possibility of structuring your business so that some money still comes in.

SkintButHappy

I would like to say a couple of things also about the above quotes but my pc wont let me quote it for some reason.

When I get to gold, I personally am not going to sit back, nor would I want to. If I can carry on find more people and make MORE money it seems a no brainer to me. Of course you have to stay doing your own personal retail, thats where alot of your income comes from.

And regarding the last quote, I shedule in my downtime. I dont have family but I have a partner, a social life, and various hobbies. I let myself have 1 day of the weekend where I only do my deliveries (2 hours tops) and nothing else whatsoever apart from recieving any important calls and maybe making some though I try not to unless I have to. Those I know with family usually schedule say saturday as family day. Thats what most people do with fulltime jobs do anyway isnt it? The thing with being self employed is, if you have no time for family, YOU arent planning it in for yourself. The book lies with your weekly plan, YOU choose what to be doing when and if family doesnt come into it I would seriously have a look at your plan and wether your using your time effectivly enough on the days you DO work, in order to have that time off. Dont get me wrong when I was building my customer base I felt like all I was doing was delivering blooming catalogues. Now im mainly customer based and on most weeks only ever do retail on a Fri and Mon (and a little for stragglers tues) then I have PLENTY of time do get as much sponsoring in as I can manage and still enjoy at least SOME of my weekend. And I have a full time job!

And as for holidays, Im going to Miami for free next year I would definatly call that a holiday! Also if you get your royalty income going you can afford to say live abroad for 18 months whilst still getting your income (genuine example btw).

The_Analyst_2

SkintButHappy wrote: »

I would like to say a couple of things also about the above quotes but my pc wont let me quote it for some reason.

Just press the "quote" button then delete the text you don't want. If you want to quote from another post as well just copy and post the first quote then press the quote button again while looking at the second post. The important bit is the first bit with the username and number, but remember to close the quote with {/quote} using square brackets, instead of curly ones. Simples!

SkintButHappy wrote: »

When I get to gold, I personally am not going to sit back, nor would I want to. If I can carry on find more people and make MORE money it seems a no brainer to me. Of course you have to stay doing your own personal retail, thats where alot of your income comes from.

That's all well and good, but it kind of misses the point, doesn't it?
You could decide not to retail at all and sponsor loads of people front-line and make 16% off them until they reach 6% themselves. (Even then you'd still make a handsome 10%). True you may be spending a lot of that 16% on sponsorsing activities, but that's your choice - the point is the company pays YOU that 16% instead of giving a higher mark-up to the retailer. Is it any surprise that the retailers drop out, when they are effectively funding your sponsoring activities against themselves? By the way that 16% is based on the retail price. With respect to the wholesale price inc VAT that's a whopping 20%. Unless they hit a fairly big target level, the retailer only makes 26% wholesale-to-retail mark-up themselves and that's before admin, delivery, catalogue losses, petrol etc! What crazy kind of deal is that?




I assume the rest of your post is directed at the person I was quoting.

SkintButHappy

I tried that but it was only picking up half the text for some reason, not the bit I actually wanted to quote lol!

Misses the point? What point would that be exactly im just curious? For a start I thought you had to put a minimum of 150 bp (£180) PR on a month to keep your account active.

I would feel like an absolute fraud if I was coaching people to do, for example, £800 of retail every period and not even putting any books out myself! I feel leading from the front is best, I would not expect people to do what I wasnt doing myself. It all adds to the cheque......

6%? Minimum bonus is 10%

Why would my sponsoring activities be against my team? I recruit in a local, but large area none of my team live within retailing distance from eachother.

Some people are just happy to retail. simple as. And im more than happy to have them in my team. And im also happy to do my own retail as I enjoy it and have met some really lovely customers along the way. Of course sponsoring is now my main activity, but it doesnt mean im going to ditch the retail, and any in my team who have quit, well to be honest people quit their jobs everyday. Sometimes people just realise its not for them, or they get another job they would rather do. Or they dont realise that to earn money you need to actually put your books out! (lol)

SkintButHappy

and yes the rest was aimed at the person you quoted

The_Analyst_2

SkintButHappy wrote: »

Misses the point? What point would that be exactly im just curious? For a start I thought you had to put a minimum of 150 bp (£180) PR on a month to keep your account active.

That's changed from a few years ago then. I think it used to be to simply put in an order of any size every three months.

SkintButHappy wrote: »

I would feel like an absolute fraud if I was coaching people to do, for example, £800 of retail every period and not even putting any books out myself! I feel leading from the front is best, I would not expect people to do what I wasnt doing myself. It all adds to the cheque......

I tend to agree to an extent, although if you retailed your nuts off for several months then quit to concentrate only on team-building you'd still be legitimately able to say "I worked my way to here by retailing, now it's your turn". In any conventional sales organisation a sales manager has been promoted from being a salesman himself but rarely continues to go out selling once he has a team to manage. My point was there are enough bonuses for the Gold upline that they could, in theory, do quite well by having a wide front line of retailers and do no retail themselves. They may be having to spin plates, as it were, as retailers dropped out, but in time they could do it.

SkintButHappy wrote: »

6%? Minimum bonus is 10%

Depends if you're quoting with reference to the full retail price or the wholesale price exc VAT.

SkintButHappy wrote: »

Why would my sponsoring activities be against my team? I recruit in a local, but large area none of my team live within retailing distance from eachother.

Yours might not be in your particular case but it would be easy for a less caring sponsor to put his retailers in each other's way and if your upline is local and a big business builder then what they earn off your team is helping them sponsor other local competition - it's an inevitability of having big local retail.

SkintButHappy wrote: »

Some people are just happy to retail. simple as. And im more than happy to have them in my team.

Anyone who is happy to earn £21 per £100 of sales before costs when their sponsor can potentially earn £16 pounds from that same retailer's £100 of activity without those costs is obviously very welcome in anyone's team! More power to you if you can hang on to people like that. I'd feel like a bit of a fraud myself whether I was retaling or not, but I'm sure I'd manage to bite my lip somehow, especially if those retailers were not interested in sponsoring. I just think it's a warped pay structure that pays that much to the immediate upline in the first place. Not your fault, though.

SkintButHappy wrote: »

And im also happy to do my own retail as I enjoy it and have met some really lovely customers along the way.

For an additional 16% profit on your own retail I'm not surprised!