When should children start pre-school?

Spendless

I agree that children are ready at different ages. As per my previous posts my own son was ready just after his 2nd birthday, too young for any playgroups round here to take him. And when he was eligible(at 2 and a half) i still had to stay with him until he was 3.(because of the playgroups rules, not because i thought he wasn't ready). This is why he attended a private nursery.

Things have changed here in the past few years and children can be left at 2 and a half (if they are potty trained)

One of my playgroups shut down at Christmas. Which leaves 2 others locally., incuding the one i withdrew my son from as i wasn't happy with it. That leaves me one playgroup.

This playgroup is open 4 days a week but due to the numbers of children they have you are only offered 2 days and they feed them in from the mums and tots groups that operates on the other morning and one afternoon. It's the same staff so if you've attended their mums and tots sessions they already are familiar with your children.

My LEA does feed children in after their 4th birthday, but they have done that since i started school (some 33 years ago!!). The nearest city to us does at least 2 intakes SEP and Jan. A few years ago they also did Easter, i don't know if they still do.

To the OP i'd look into when they can start and see if they have certain dates or if you can start when you feel your child is ready It doesn't sound like you have a lack of them like i do.

Best wishes

stardoman

I help run the nursery at my son's school - I'm a voluntary treasurer and on the committee that makes all the policy decisions.

Because we had a few spare spaces and OFSTED register you for the ages 2-5, we looked into accepting children before their 3rd birthday. We found that we couldn't because if we did we would have to remove all the toys which were for age 3+. We felt that this would hold our 3 and 4 year olds back, as they would have to play with things which were too young for them.

Do the pre-schools which include under 3s have different rooms, or have they removed the toys for older children? Or have they ignored this standard (OFSTED have a list of standards which registered childcare providers are meant to follow). This might be something else to look at.

Another thing is that the government is very big on inclusion these days and we have been told that we cannot refuse a child who is not potty trained. Instead we have to offer some facility to change the child. Obviously, this would be more likely if we lowered the age range to 2.5. however we do have a child at the moment who has colicac (sp?) disease which means that he has some bad days where he is unable to get to the toilet. This child wears pull ups on those days and we have an area where he can be changed discreetly.

Personally, I think we send children to nursery / pre-school too early these days. I also think that the older they are the more confident they are - if you force the separation too early I think this can make the child feel insecure. Many people told me I'd have trouble getting my younger child to go to nursery because he hadn't been separated from me since he was born, apart from the odd day when my husband looked after him. Yet on his first day he ran in without a backward glance and I was left standing at the door waving goodbye to his back!!!!! My friend's son, who has been to nursery since he was 16 weeks, still cries some mornings now and he is nearly 7.

Good luck with whatever you decide. Mandy.

Spendless

Mandy

do you mean toys that are labelled "not suitable for children under 36 months"?

at the private nursery each child was assigned a 'keyworker' and i'm aware certain areas were only for children in their actual nursery year.

I can't comment on our playgroups as i had to stop with son until he was 3. This has since changed.

It's interesting what you've said about potty training. I was always told that our nursery wouldn't accept them if not toilet trained. (son is now in reception year). My sister was worried about her twins going to the school nursery as the boy was still in nappies and got told what you've said that he couldn't be refused. He started at the school nursery in September (a different school to my son) and has been in pull-ups. He is just starting to use the toilet now as sister is worried about how he would mmanage when he is at full-time school in September.

stardoman

"do you mean toys that are labelled "not suitable for children under 36 months"?"

Yes I do. At my son's nursery there isn't another room which can be used - the building is quite small. So all the children would have to be in the same room. Also, there are different adult - child ratios for under 3s and over 3s. Over 3 it is 1 adult to every 8 whereas I think its 1 adult to every four 1-2 year olds.

Playgroups and toddler groups where parents attend are different, as the child remains the responsibility of the parent and so its up to the parent to ensure their child is playing with the correct toys. But when you've got 1 adult looking after 4 two year-olds you have to have the correct age range toys out for health and safety.

Mandy.

Spendless

Thanks

Taken from the private nurseries prospectus (sent to me last week)

1:4- children aged 2 years

1-8 - children aged 3-5 years

(it says "These ratios are taken from the full day care guildelines set by the Government")

I don't know if a playgroup would be the same as this

Just as a matter of interest - what toys are in your nursery that would be considered unsuitable for a child under 36 months?

From my own experience of buying toys,(my children are nearly 5 and 2 ) it tends to be when they have small parts.

I've been thinking about this since your post, and the playgroup i attended with son had things like a kitchen, an easel for drawing, the chunky jigsaws etc.

jellyhead

the university nursery that my son went to part time had a few different rooms, they took babies and went up to reception so they also covered the nursery curriculum for the children who were old enough for nursery. they had different rooms for different ages. it was all fun though, nothing like a school. actually the nursery he went to was all about playing too, i don't think they learned much, they can start to learn letter sounds, the alphabet etc. when they enter school, they're not expected to know much before reception, just colours, shapes etc.

because he started reception so late due to his developmental delay i'd been going through the alphabet with him at home, he missed out on the first 2 terms of reception. he'd had portage and speech therapy etc. so i had a lot of help with what to teach him and how to go at his own pace etc. i hated sending him into reception when he wasn't quite 5, he seemed so young, hadn't been talking long etc. but he's a july birthday and everyone has to be in year 1 the september after their 5th birthday so he HAD to go into reception for that summer term or he'd have missed reception completely. i wanted so badly to keep him in nursery and let him join reception the following year, he was a few weeks too old though.

i'm a volunteer in school and see quite a few reception children who wet themselves or are too shy to ask permission to go to the toilet when they need to. lots of them can't fasten their own coats or shoes. some of them go only a day after their 4th birthday and there's just no way they're ready. i'm on a course at the moment being run by the SENCO and she's concerned about the number of children who bypass the foundations of learning letter sounds etc. because they're just too young to learn, then the curriculum gallops ahead and they're special needs forever because they can't catch up. i suppose sending 2 year olds to pre-school might teach them a bit of self sufficiency regarding coats, shoes, toileting etc. but it doesn't alter the fact that they're just too young to be reading and writing.

the baby i'm carrying now will have a july birthday, bad planning but it took a while to conceive. i think it's horrible that this baby will start reception year a few weeks after the 4th birthday, it's just so young. nursery school is great but formal learning is not so good. this isn't just because my first child had developmental delay, i've seen it in lots of children who don't have any learning difficulties, 4 years old is just so young. i think we should change the school ages, start older (6 maybe, but with nursery school before then) and finish older (i don't think anyone is mature enough to leave school before 18).

anyway, i'll stop ranting. like others have said it all depends on your child and also what this pre-school is like, some are more fun than others. my nephew went to a lovely playgroup when he was 2.5, it was run by the church, you left them for 2.5 hours each day, 3 or 4 days a week.

Spendless

jellyhead- i hope it'd be optional for starting children earlier than 6 at school for people like me with livewires.lol

When i looked round the school my son is at, i did comment to the head that it must be hard to go from nursery where they play, to reception where they work.

She did answer me that sons school is not quite like that,some things have been put into nursery year so there is still playing time in reception year.

Sons reception year have got a little bit of playground cornered off with a playhouse in it for example.

At the time i was choosing between this school and another which at that time didn't have an attached nursery.

The head said that they were able to do this as they did have an attached nursery. I beleive this system is called something but i don't know what.

jellyhead

well i think there should be nursery until the age of 6 for livewires lol! maybe even a full school day in a playful learning environment, but no stress. my son's report card for reception year complained that he couldn't use a dictionary, he was 4 years old. there's a list of 45 words they're expected to learn, but other words are also introduced in their reading books. some children aren't 5 until the end of reception and it's hard work for dyslexic 4 year olds or those who don't learn to read at 4. i know a girl in year one who wasn't five until the day before she started year one. she's not got special needs as such but is classed as special needs because she can't keep up with the rest of the class. she cries her eyes out every morning because school is so bewildering for her. maybe our school is a bit more 'academically focused' (results obsessed) than others. their year 2 SATS results are quite high, more than 70 percent of children get A or above, my boy was only 6 when he took them. the current year 2's have already started SATS practise papers to 'bring them up to scratch', and will probably have booster lessons outside of school hours, poor little kids :-(

some kids probably liike all of that to start early but it's not nice for the ones who still want to be having an afternoon nap with a teddy bear and a dummy lol!

RCB28

Just thought I'd pop my two penny worth in too!

My son (born late August) started pre-school (at his school) the year before starting reception because I felt as he was going to be possibly the youngest in his year he needed to get to know some of his future classmates and get used to the school itself. He had also only been to Parent and Toddler group before this and I needed to get him used to leaving me. It was only 2 afternoons a week (lots of fun - gluing, singing etc. no formalities) and I felt this was enough as he was only just 3. It worked out extremely well, despite him getting upset by the separation at first, he enjoyed it and the first day of school was not a problem at all - and he started full-time at just 4! He is now in Year 1 and loves school, despite people's concerns about younger children he is doing very well both socially and academically, you wouldn't know he was the youngest at all!

My daughter (March baby) - started nursery two mornings a week at 2.5. I did this for our joint sanity and for her to meet some friends, some of whom will go to her school too. She will start the school's pre-school in September at 3.5. She also currently attends a parent and toddler group close to the school with me once a week.

The most important thing in my opinion is get the children mixing with others that will most probably be at their school - it will make that transition so much easier. A Parent and toddler group is also ideal to get to know the other moms...essential in my opinion, we have a good network of contacts at our school and we all help eachother out when needed.

Ofcourse, having said all this...every child is different and only a parent truly knows what will suit!!

purplepatch

Wow, so many replies since I was last here! Many thanks, there is plenty of food for thought. It's good to hear peoples' first hand experiences and to see that I am not alone in my misgivings about sending her too early.

My instincts are telling me to at least leave it until she is 3, but I am going to visit both preschools and find out for myself what is what, and see what they suggest.

I am fortunate (depending on your viewpoint) to be able to be a full time mum and am so enjoying the experience. It seems a shame to give part of that time up if I don't have to when she is still tiny.

Thanks again. I will report back once I have more news.