ASHP's and the maze of info

thills

Hi everyone,

I wish to install a CO2 & pocket friendly heating system in my appartment, there is no gas. It is purpose built, but in the 70s so not up to the latest codes by a long way. 80m2, first floor. South coast.

My initial feelings are not good, I find a market with little competition and therefore things are overpriced. A £200 hot water tank increases 5 fold for use with an ASHP. VAT lurks on top of every item... yet it is an investment in a greener planet?

I have to go this route, capital cost is high but it is simply not responsible to waste energy ad infinitum to avoid capital costs.

I'm thinking, Mitsubishi Ecodan ASHP combined with thermaskirt radiator system & domestic hot water.
Anyone out there done anything similar? any comments/advice?

Appreciated,

TH

Cardew

Welcome to the forum.

If you go to the beginning of this long thread, Samtheman has had a Ecodan system for over 2 years and has a lot of useful information.

http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.html?t=702257&page=26

There also have been posts in this section about thermaskirt radiators.

As ASHP water temperature is low, I would have thought there might be a problem with thermaskirt radiators providing sufficient surface area to heat rooms?

Will being on the first floor not provide a problem with the mounting of the external unit?

thills

Hi Cardew, thanks.
Yes, first floor adds a mounting problem, but it can bolt to the wall outside.
Thermaskirt claim its OK, you just need more metres. I'm not convinced yet.
Not every building is ideal for ASHP's to work at ultimate efficiency, but in the end you still get your heat for less £s & CO2 than any other electric heating.

ASHP's running on CO2 gas have hotter water... this is relatively new.

I read samtheman's info, a great help.
What gives you the best solution for "your" project isn't easy to determine, capital costs are important, not helped by VAT etc.

Cardew

thills wrote: »

Hi Cardew, thanks.
Yes, first floor adds a mounting problem, but it can bolt to the wall outside.

Surely it is not just the mounting?

Noise for your neighbours? Vibration?

Access for servicing?

thills

Valid points. It could go elsewhere though if needs must. At this stage I'm trying to understand what would do the best job for the best cost, then I can see how to best install it. Without a gas supply, I cant see any other options but ASHP's.

Fire_Fox

Do you have the freeholder's permission to attach the Ecodan to the building or make any holes in the fabric of building in order that the ASHP could function properly? Have you considered underfloor heating?

One of these might be worth considering, especially if you have high ceilings:
http://www.nuaire.co.uk/Product/Residential_Products/Positive_Input_Ventilation/Flatmaster_2000
Not a heater as such but, if it works as it claims (recommended elsewhere on forum), it will save both money and the planet.

thills

Hi Fire Fox, I would obtain all the nescessar permissions, including local planning, which you need for any ASHP. Underfloor.. quotes are > £4K for 75m2 for a "thin" system. Too costly I'm affraid.

thills

To be honest, I'm beginning to doubt the cost viability of air to water in small properties & flats, its out of proportion to the property value, hence that is why you never see it in new builds!!!

Cardew

thills wrote: »

To be honest, I'm beginning to doubt the cost viability of air to water in small properties & flats, its out of proportion to the property value, hence that is why you never see it in new builds!!!

On the contrary it is being used in new builds.

The great advantage of newbuild flats designed with ASHPs as the heating(and aircon) system is they have ducting into each room and the ASHPs can be roof mounted.

It is the retrofitting to existing flats that creates a lot of the expense.

Cardew

Since I posted the above, this was posted in the main ASHP thread.

I have recently moved into a new build flat made by Comer Homes which has an air source heat pump. All of the flats here have them. It is one main unit in the bathroom which then vents out to all the rooms in the flat via small round vents in the ceiling.

You can't control individual rooms - it's a system which heats up the whole flat at once. It's been fine so far but over the past 2 days i am really struggling to warm the flat.

thills

Yeah, the only one I know with ASHP (wet) is also at home freezing cold, but for us in the south, this weather is rare & for a year previously its been good & cost effective!! Mind you, dont think its the pump, coldest has been -1c, but the underfloor being undersized as the floor is warm.