Sky cards from XL Trading

halifaxflea

I hold the right to give an opinion on anything I wish.

I have at no point accused your company of breaking the law.

It is as pure and simple as that. As a result I have not libeled your company. Would you ask me to remove my comments if I had said I think the company looks great - no you wouldn't.

You have again accused me of libel, but I have not done so. Please retract that statement.

It is not against the law to post a negative comment about a company. I seriously doubt your legal team will persue this, as you are in the wrong.

I won't be removing my posts, as they do not breach rules, they do NOT accuse your company of breaking the law, and I will state again I DO NOT ACCUSE XL TRADING OF BREAKING THE LAW, but I am entitled to leave feedback as I see fit.

I would have no reason to defend your company, however if you would of given a reasoned response, and if the site had been more transparent and clear, and you had not been so agressive and trying to bully me into removing my comments, then I would probably of not said anything, or kept an open mind.

As it is, my dealings with YOU have meant I would never deal with this company again.

XLTradingUK

Tribulation wrote: »

I have no fear, by all means request that info. I look forwards to talking to your solicitor. I see you've got one person to remove their posts by using this threat, just shows what your company is really like.

Not at all - please ask Underlay if we have personally 'bullied' them into removing their posts - which we have not done.

Underlay has seen sense in the post and done the decent honest thing rather than carry this on - which I find a very honest and decent thing to do and more credit to them.

You have now - for some reason - jumped into this bandwagon in attacking us, I take it - you are not a client of ours as well?

I stand by what I said in my earlier post, you are not selling this card as any sort of backup, by your own sites wording it is really being sold for people to get Sky without paying, otherwise why would your site say

Not at all, we directly pay Sky for the cards.
This is the problem - people DO NOT know how and what we do at XL in regards to the Sky cards.. they just assume we get them illegally, and of course, being the net - have 'just got to post' about it.

I advise anyone not to give your company a single penny. I have a right to give this advice. I think what your company is doing is harming the paying members of Sky (and Virgin) by taking away money that they would have for further investment in programming etc had people that are buying your cards, brought from Sky directly instead.

You actually do not have the right to post a comment saying 'I advise anyone not to give your company a single penny!' - again - you are not a client of ours, so you are posting a defamatory comment about a site to ruin its reputation.

Just because you've managed to find a legal loophole where you cant get done for selling these cards, that doesn't make it morally right for people to buy them and I will continue advising people to avoid you like the plague.

No loophole exists mate. We get them legally from Sky.
The mere fact that this item is our most purchased - and sought - after product on the store indicates, people do not care what you think and will make their own minds up.

Again, nothing against your goodself - but we have to protect the site

I'm not going to say your doing anything illegal but I don't for one minute believe people are buying this card as a backup (why would someone pay £45 every few months just for a spare card on the off chance their legit one breaks) and I don't believe you do either.

Not going into this with you - as a business decision - people can buy it or not, up to them.. but we get them direct from Sky, legally and Sky get paid for the cards. Thank you.

What customers do with them - is upto them but they MUST use them in accordance with the T&C's on the site.

I'm a real hater of loophole exploiting companies and just as you apparently have a legal right to sell these cards, I have a legal right to tell people they're mad if they do so.

We sell something people want - and the problem is?
As long as it is NOT ILLEGAL we can sell it on the store?
The mere fact that we have not been shut down 'suggests' that we are doing nothing illegal - does it not, and we have been operating for a good few years now

You actually have no legal right to say 'avoid this company' because you do not know us, you have not bought from us, and you have purposely used posts in this thread to basically pull our reputation to bits... which is defamation mate any way you wish to play it.

socrates

If I were XL Trading I would ask for this thread to be removed.

If it is not and I was the person being threatened with legal action - and that legal action was pursued.

My next call would be to Sky Televisions legal team to see how they can assist me ......

XLTradingUK

socrates wrote: »

If I were XL Trading I would ask for this thread to be removed.

If it is not and I was the person being threatened with legal action - and that legal action was pursued.

My next call would be to Sky Televisions legal team to see how they can assist me ......

We have already asked for this to be removed - I think it needs to be in all honesty as it is serving no useful purpose, rather than smearing our business.

The OP has already stated above that he wished the thread not been created which just shows how much this thread needs it.

XLTradingUK

halifaxflea wrote: »

I hold the right to give an opinion on anything I wish.

I have at no point accused your company of breaking the law.

It is as pure and simple as that. As a result I have not libeled your company. Would you ask me to remove my comments if I had said I think the company looks great - no you wouldn't.

You have again accused me of libel, but I have not done so. Please retract that statement.

It is not against the law to post a negative comment about a company. I seriously doubt your legal team will persue this, as you are in the wrong.

I won't be removing my posts, as they do not breach rules, they do NOT accuse your company of breaking the law, and I will state again I DO NOT ACCUSE XL TRADING OF BREAKING THE LAW, but I am entitled to leave feedback as I see fit.

I would have no reason to defend your company, however if you would of given a reasoned response, and if the site had been more transparent and clear, and you had not been so agressive and trying to bully me into removing my comments, then I would probably of not said anything, or kept an open mind.

As it is, my dealings with YOU have meant I would never deal with this company again.

And I quote - right on top of the forum, under the lovely picture of Martin.

If you spot a spam, illegal, offensive, racist, libellous post or PM please email us at the abuse email provided

For easy reckoning.
Defamation = Form of Libel
Libel = is a) frowned upon by this forum because it gets them into trouble
b) ILLEGAL in UK law.

If you would have said, great looking site.. not a customer, but it looks good we would have said thankyou for your comments.

What you have said, without going over older posts once again for the complete duration of this pointless now thread.. is that you are not a customer of ours, but you will have your say on we do and being totally negative, and basically making comments trying to put people OFF coming to the site. This loses us business, hence defamation.

You have done that - YOU
You made a choice to post it, you live by it.

We have not tried to bully you into removing comments, so there again, you have printed a total inaccuracy.

We have merely threated legal action for defaming us and possibly losing us custom for something you know nothing about.

In any event, this thread will end up binned - so no need to worry about it is there

We can pursue this as
a: you make comments negatively on something you have not used, know nothing about, nor are you a customer of XL
b: You are clearly asking people NOT to use our services
c: You now accuse us of bullying - which is not the case.
d: If proven, you have lost us custom on the store - we are entitled to damages against you.. I do not write the law, but that is how it stands.

MSE can be pursued as well for the simple fact that they have let people post just random defamatory comments about our site - their report abuse button is conveniently directed to an email system which can 'lose' the email sent, and the fact that the forum runs in the pretense that the forum 'isnt moderated' when there is a modteam located on the forum?
Now that is dodgy coming from a forum supposed to be protecting 'us all' from scammers and ripoff artists do you not think?
Hence, we can pursue them if the thread is not deleted.

Think what you will - just don't jot it down on a large forum where we will pick up on it

halifaxflea

Thanks for the laugh XL Trading, but I have now come to the conclusion that you haven't a clue what you are on about.

I will leave it up to the mods to decide if my post breaks the rules. I am quite sure since I have not accused the company of anything illegal, but given my opinion on things I have seen that I am safe.

Its nothing personal against you or your company, but the damage of YOUR actions in this thread will probably have a bigger effect than what I say.

Basically you say I am alright to praise the company, but if I say anything negative you will sue me. I didn't realise this was a communist state.

XLTradingUK

halifaxflea wrote: »

Thanks for the laugh XL Trading.

I will leave it up to the mods to decide if my post breaks the rules. I am quite sure since I have not accused the company of anything illegal, but given my opinion on things I have seen that I am safe.

Its nothing personal against you or your company, but the damage of YOUR actions in this thread will probably have a bigger effect than what I say.

Again, nothing personal to anyone on here posting on this (we mean no personal offence at all) but it is our hard work and livelihood being attacked. We are sure you can all understand. No hard feelings. :money:

If we all leave it as this - we are more than happy to close the matter in its entirety.

All we are saying - please do not post negative comments which could influence other people WITHOUT any hard evidence that we are scumbags- that is all we are asking. Our client testimonials speak as hard evidence that we do what we say we do, no excuses.. no farting about.

The bigger effect is at the moment - again weirdly - this is bringing a lot more positive reactions from new clients to XL and a lot more traffic and a lot more work .. so in reality, I really should be thanking everyone as your negative comments are working for us rather than against us

Of course you can say negative things about us, just not one's that would unfairly influence potential clients to avoid us because of what 4-5 people on here (who don't use or know XL at all) have said.

Sometimes we have a slowdown on the store due to postage problems with Royal Mail - this is not our fault, but Royal Mail's but we get negative comments for it.. but it is not repeated anywhere otherwise we would have to protect ourselves once again.

I hope people understand that we really are the real deal and not some scam artists that people are making us out to be - evidently people believe us due to the large influx of new custom we are having at the moment.

halifaxflea

Unfortunately your actions and behaviour in this thread, plus other things I have seen and learnt from using Google, and enquiring about your company on another site I post on, makes me think that those posting concerns were in the right.

I have had no dealings with your company, and after today, I will make sure I never do. Its something I will advice people to avoid.

Threatening to sue someone for libel for posting a negative comment, aggressive bully boy tactics, and slanderous accusations are enough for me to say I would not recommend this service to anyone.

Its your actions and replies that have led to this. My original post was negative, but it raised points that could of been answered by yourself without threats, and if you had done this, then I would of readdressed my opinion, and probably given your company the benefit of the doubt.

However, now people can see exactly how your company, and you as a representative reacts to criticism. If that isn't enough for people, then I am quite sure others can use Google or other board to get opinions.

I am confident people are bright enough to make the correct decision. That is my final word on this matter, as frankly I have wasted enough of my day today arguing with you.

1984ReturnsForReal_2

No it's not at all... we have to provide proof that the items are sent and that their payments are safe.. which in both cases, they are (tracking fully provided + we use fully verified accounts for PP and GC)

As we are moving premises, would you like us to print misleading information of our last location on the site just to make you happy? Of course not. We can be contacted by a wide variety of means at the moment (the phone system is being installed at the moment at the way!!) so this is not a problem at all.

Not an excuse at all we find.
If we could not be contacted, then that would be illegal.

　
If you think that you moving to new premises sometime or whenever in the near of far future is a good excuse for the omission of your address I suggest you speak to the DTI & get another lawyer. I believe they will both have a different opinion on the matter.
　
　
Whether you are in in the middle, or just about to move address is irrelevant.




This post stays by the way.


Also, a company reg number might be a good idea & are you VAT registered?

XLTradingUK

halifaxflea wrote: »

Unfortunately your actions and behaviour in this thread, plus other things I have seen and learnt from using Google, and enquiring about your company on another site I post on, makes me think that those posting concerns were in the right.

I have had no dealings with your company, and after today, I will make sure I never do. Its something I will advice people to avoid.

Threatening to sue someone for libel for posting a negative comment, aggressive bully boy tactics, and slanderous accusations are enough for me to say I would not recommend this service to anyone.

Its your actions and replies that have led to this. My original post was negative, but it raised points that could of been answered by yourself without threats, and if you had done this, then I would of readdressed my opinion, and probably given your company the benefit of the doubt.

However, now people can see exactly how your company, and you as a representative reacts to criticism. If that isn't enough for people, then I am quite sure others can use Google or other board to get opinions.

I am confident people are bright enough to make the correct decision. That is my final word on this matter, as frankly I have wasted enough of my day today arguing with you.

See - you are doing it again
Where on Google?

Tap in XL Trading and do a search.. the only negative thread about us is this one, unless I have a funky version of google that does not work the same as us. With that comment, you are backing up what I am saying to you.

All you are doing, is being negative - and offering people your own 'personal thoughts' into why YOU are not going to use us and to why other people should stay clear because YOU think so.

You just don't get it I think

If you wish to tell people to avoid us, go right ahead - but use word of mouth instead of a wider medium such as the net.. OR even better, why not let people make up their own minds about us? Unless you are some kind of messiah of course :rotfl:

People can see how I react - to your continued wave of personal attacks on our hard work on the site... and then if they thought about it, would they do the same?

Incidentally people reading this - the same prophets of doom on this thread I believe who have reported us to Nominet as well.... this is the class of people you are dealing with on this forum who have to cheap shot people from behind them and report them behind their backs.. all without any prior knowledge of what they are talking about.

Incidentally pt 2 - Nominet have been dealt with by the way in case the person who did this was wondering

Thanks for your comments though - we will indeed take the smaller good points on board, the negatives which you know nothing about - we will keep in the trash where they belong.

Have a good day though, and a great evening

underlay_guru wrote: »

Hi,

I would chase this customer who posted this on your facebook page:

Customer: "do you make a disk with the latest wiikey patch on? cheers"

XLtradingUK: "We can get hold of it for you - no worries "

Customer: "awesome, if you let me know when youre gonna launch it ive got the money waiting! i think the latest patch is 1.9g? if possible the disk should be a foolproof update disk that i can insert, and follow the prompts, update my chip and laugh at nintendo... for trying to make me pay £35 for a game! thanks again. "


...it appears they may be intending to break the T&C's.

The WiiKey patch is for the hardware they have installed in their system (we do not chip consoles or install chips by the way - before this argument breaks out) which they needed updating.
The WiiKey software is free to download on the net also.

Again, what customers do with their personal software is their own business but we do not aid piracy at all.
We are covered in this instance in our terms and conditions which states that we are not held legally responsible for any misuse of any product on our store.

We would just like to mention as well, that any abuse of our Facebook pages or any other misuse of any of our social networking links can also be prosecuted - Facebook already issue members details upon request (please do a google search for more info on this) .. just to stop any untoward silliness before it starts.

1984ReturnsForReal wrote: »

If you think that you moving to new premises sometime or whenever in the near of far future is a good excuse for the omission of your address I suggest you speak to the DTI & get another lawyer. I believe they will both have a different opinion on the matter.

As discussed previously, we would not like to post the old address which would be printing information which is misleading to clients.. Customers have our address at all times when ordering.
No loophole - just the law.

Whether you are in in the middle, or just about to move address is irrelevant.

I think you may need to consult some legal advice about that mate just to clarify it.

This post stays by the way.

As you wish, nothing bad in it as far as I can see!
As long as you don't go mental and start libelling us in someway or form.

Also, a company reg number might be a good idea & are you VAT registered?

We are not a limited company as of yet, but it is something we are aiming for hopefully next year - which would actually be better for us in the long run as posts on here have stated.