Help regarding my right to replace a PS3

Thanatos

Hi! My PS3 recently knackered totally. I phoned up Sony to see what they would do about it, but as its 2.5 years old they wouldnt replace it without charging me £145.

I could sell the broken one on ebay and add £145 to that and buy a new one, so wasnt exactly happy with this senario, so very calmly tried to explain that as an early adopter of their technology (Its the original 60 gig version) that perhaps as a gesture of goodwill they might be prepared to help me. They said no


So, all thats left is for me to try HMV who I purchased the thing off in the first place and try under the sale of goods act. (It was purchased by credit card so I can invoke section 75 if this doesnt work too)

Below is a copy of the letter I just emailed to them. Would anyone familiar with the Act take a look and see if I have missed anything (or mis-interpreted anything)? Would much appreciate any advice

Dear Sirs,

A Playstation 3 unit I purchased from your Brighton Churchill Square Store in April 2007 has recently started to power down immediately upon to turning it on, accompanied with a flash of a yellow light, followed by a continual flashing red light. I have contacted Sony customer services who have identified the fault as a known hardware failure that they are only prepared to swap for a refurbished model rather than repair. However, as the unit in question is now out of manufacturer’s warranty, this replacement would cost me £145. Obviously I am not prepared to pay for a second hand replacement item when the fault lies with the unit itself and not through any action on my part.

As Sony refuse to help any further, I have no real choice but to turn to you as the company that sold me the unit to ask for either a replacement model or a repair of the unit under the Sale of Goods Act 1979. As I am sure you are aware, the Act specifies that any goods sold must be expected to last a period most people would consider a reasonable amount of time. Obviously in this case, the unit is less than 2.5 years old and it goes without saying that a Playstation 3 is most certainly designed to last a lot longer than 2.5 years, especially when Sony Computer Entertainment president Kaz Hirai announced an anticipated 10 year lifespan for the console shortly after it was launched. While I happily accept he was talking about the length of time before the Playstation 4 would be released, it is obvious he was not expecting his customers to have to purchase 4 separate consoles lasting 2.5 years each to reach that target.

I appreciate that this query should be taken up in-store with the store manager, but I had a number of reasons for approaching you first. My main concern is that as I mentioned previously, the Console was purchased in your Brighton Store, however, I now live in Blackpool, so would be looking to take the unit back to my local store if that would be acceptable. Obviously, I have the original receipt and packaging and am sure I could find a copy of the Credit Card Statement showing the purchase if you feel it was required. My second concern is that, while I have every admiration for my local store manager, I would imagine it possible he would not be familiar in the finer details of complex legislation such as the Sale of Goods Act 1979 and confirmation in writing from yourselves that I am within my rights as a consumer to request a replacement unit (or repair) from yourselves may help smooth the process. My final concern is that the unit itself has a game still inside the machine which due to being unable to power up the unit means I can not eject it. I would request that this game be returned to me, although I appreciate that it may not be able to be done in store without the appropriate technical know-how, I would ask that when you return the unit to base, you could pass on this request and forward my details to them.

I would be happy to discuss this matter via telephone if you feel it would expedite this process. Unfortunately, I was unable to get through on your customer service line which was only giving out the engaged tone. I await your reply to my request with confidence, given your reputation for excellence in customer service.



Yours Sincerely,

Thanatos

Many thanks for any help or advice in advance!

*finger poised on the thanks button*

Esqui

Quite frankly, I think that's rather good.

No "EU legislation says it must last a bazillion years" or "It's my
right for you to give me a new one right now"....you're onto a winner there. Only possible problem is they may not just take your word that Sony have confirmed a fault and want you to prove that, but most people have heard of this happening before, so should be aware it can happen.

pinkshoes

A very well written letter, especially the bit about the president announcing a 10 year life span! I would perhaps quote Kaz Hirai and state the date this was announced. He is known as a bit of a nutter though isn't he??

As a PS3 owner, I would anticipate a 5 year minimum shelf life.

Thanatos

Esqui wrote: »

Only possible problem is they may not just take your word that Sony have confirmed a fault and want you to prove that, but most people have heard of this happening before, so should be aware it can happen.

Hmmm. thats something I hadn't thought of, although a quick call by themselves to Sony would confirm it. If they come back to me with that, I will have to see if I can get something in writing...

pinkshoes wrote: »

A very well written letter, especially the bit about the president announcing a 10 year life span! I would perhaps quote Kaz Hirai and state the date this was announced. He is known as a bit of a nutter though isn't he??

As a PS3 owner, I would anticipate a 5 year minimum shelf life.

The full quote was during an interview with CNN defending the very high price tag he actually said:

"I think that we are offering a very good value for the consumers. We look at our products having a 10-year life cycle, which we've proven with the PlayStation. Therefore, the PlayStation 3 is going to be a console that's going to be with you again for 10 years. We're not going to ask the consumers to suddenly buy another PlayStation console in five years time, and basically have their investment go by the wayside. So for all those reasons, I think at $599 we're offering a very good value to the consumers."

So I can easily point them in the direction of the quote in any number of places, although in hindsight, I link to the quote might have been an idea!

My interpretation of this quote is that the item itself is going to last 10 years, epecially as he is making this statement to justify a $599 price tag.
After all, saying they are going to "keep making PS3's for 10 years, but you have to keep replace them every 5 years and thats why we have priced our product so high" would be stupid... So I see it as a 10 year life of the product...

That said, its hardly concrete evidence, so I went for the more obvious life span of the product in my letter rather than saying he says the units themselves will last 10 years.

And yes, he is a fruit loop.

nell35

My son's PS3 (60Gb model) has the same fault as Thanatos' only that it is 6 months younger.

Initially I phoned Sony who informed me that an amount of £147 would be due if I accepted a refurbished machine. No way I said. I have since e-mailed 'Game' customers services 2 weeks ago and have yet to get a reply.

I quoted the EU 2 year warranty which may have frightened them off!!

Excellent letter anyway, do you mind if I copy it and send it to Game? This time I'll do it the old fashioned way - by registered post!

This seems to be a common problem with the 60Gb model, you would think that Sony would recall them and rectify the problem! Although I have read that other PS3 owners have been lucky in getting a replacement machine without paying a penny. Why have they stopped?

Thanatos

nell35 wrote: »

My son's PS3 (60Gb model) has the same fault as Thanatos' only that it is 6 months younger.

Initially I phoned Sony who informed me that an amount of £147 would be due if I accepted a refurbished machine. No way I said. I have since e-mailed 'Game' customers services 2 weeks ago and have yet to get a reply.

I quoted the EU 2 year warranty which may have frightened them off!!

Excellent letter anyway, do you mind if I copy it and send it to Game? This time I'll do it the old fashioned way - by registered post!

This seems to be a common problem with the 60Gb model, you would think that Sony would recall them and rectify the problem! Although I have read that other PS3 owners have been lucky in getting a replacement machine without paying a penny. Why have they stopped?

You are more than welcome to copy this letter if you feel it may be of help to you

There is a huge amount of information on this specific fault on the internet, and it is a known problem to Sony. I saw several forums mentioning people were getting them replaced for free, which is why I wanted to push Sony as far as i could before going back to HMV, however they wouldn't budge, even with gentle prods about how Microsoft extended their warranties to 3 years when they identified a fault with their machines (the famous red ring of death). I even mentioned I specifically chose the PS3 over the 360 because the PS3 was supposed to be the more reliable machine and that perhaps I should purchase a 360 to replace my broken PS3 as Microsoft would still repair my product for free as the same time scale, but nada.

That said, the woman I spoke to handled the call very well and remains polite throughout, so i found it very hard to do my usual ask nicely once, then ask firmly, then turn into a raving maniac ranting down the phone technique

nell35

I had that same nice woman on the Sony phoneline and also found it hard to moan loudly. She said to me that Sony were not liable but the shop where I |bought was and that I would have more luck with them.

So what does the shop do with a broken machine - send it back to Sony!!

Bonkers I say.

Thanks again for that letter.. Hopefully it'll work for both us PS3'ers.

Thanatos

Little update - no reply from HMV (despite a chase up email on Thursday) Will phone them on Monday - they only open Mon-Fri 9-5

Thanatos

Another small update - Phoned HMV this morning to enquire why I had no responce from the initial email sent last Tuesday (4th Aug) nor the email requesting confirmation they had recieved the first email on Friday (7th Aug).

The woman on the phone apologised and assured me she would pass on my suggestion about sending acknowledgement emails to confirm reciept of a query.

However, I summerized the problem for her and she replied that they would only replace an iten within 12 months. I explained that I was not trying to get the item replaced under the manufacturers warranty, but the Sale of Goods act. She explained I would have to chase that up with Sony. I explained that the Sale of Goods Act was covering a transaction between the consumer and the company selling the goods, but I dont think the fully understood as she kept going on about 12 months and contacting Sony.

Although she remained poliet throughout, it's a real shame that a dedicated customer service helpline does not train its staff on commonly used legislation protecting the consumer... that said, it is what I expected from a phonecall, so I did not go away disappointed.

She did confirm that as she was not authorised to give me a replacement that a reply to my my email would be forthcoming by close of play tomorrow (11th Aug).

I tend to think this may be a good sign, given the following points:

1. There was no queue phoning the customer service line at 9:30 on a Monday morning. Given this, I think it unlikely the email reply has been held up due to staff shortages or processing time. I think it more likely it has been refferred to a legal department or something to see where they stand.

2. If point 1 is correct in the assumption the complaint has been forwarded to an area specialising in the law, they should find in my favour, as from what I can tell the law is completely on my side in this matter.

3. The lady I spoke to made it quiet clear the email was being dealt with by someone with more authority than herself when she explained she couldnt authorise a replacement unit, but I should wait for the email reply (although I tend to think she thought my chances were low! )


anyway, I will let you know more when i hear. Am going to look up the small claims court process, just in case I need it!

Tozer

Again, good letter.

Did you pay by credit card? You may find a claim against your card issuer to be a path of lesser resistance. And if you need to issue proceedings, you should do so against the card issuer as well on the basis of their joint and several liability.

Thanatos

Tozer wrote: »

Again, good letter.

Did you pay by credit card? You may find a claim against your card issuer to be a path of lesser resistance. And if you need to issue proceedings, you should do so against the card issuer as well on the basis of their joint and several liability.

Yes, I did purchase with a card, so thats the next avenue - just waiting on HMV first. I figure I should wait for an initial responce first, then if they say no, whilst arguing my case with them, involve the credit card, as I imagine they would get on to HMV too in an attempt to reduce their losses.

Once I have exhausted both lines of refund or repair with the section 72 and sale of goods acts, I will attempt to go down the small claims route. Still researching that at the moment.



If anyone has experience taking a company to small claims, I would be interested in your story...