WARNING - Ryanair 'online check in' farce

Pollycat

Thanks for that, lucfgirl.

I apologise to jules1964.

However, according to at least 2 newspaper articles the plan is to charge 'within 2 years'.

Also, here's an extract from an article in the guardian from 2/6/09:

"We are serious about it," said O'Leary, who has acquired the nickname Michael O'Really within aviation circles for some of his more outlandish claims. He added: "We are flying aircraft on an average flight time of one hour around Europe. What the hell do we need three toilets for?"

He denied that Ryanair was considering the ploy to make a profit from toilet breaks. "It's not because we need to generate money from the jacks. But ... if you get rid of two [toilets] you can get six seats on a 737. They will all be scurrying to the toilet before the departure gate."

Asked if he would be interested in charging £5 a toilet visit in order to eliminate the need for the loo altogether, he said: "If someone wanted to pay £5 to go to the toilet I would carry them myself. I would wipe their bums for a fiver."

More pubicity? I'll leave it up to individuals to make their own minds up, but I know what I think.

PolishBigSpender

lemonade_lifestyle wrote: »

I found no problems with ryanair what so ever, and never have. So many people where trying to take more than 15 kg hold luggage or 2 hand luggages....and seemed surprised to be questioned??

And this is the entire problem - people seem to be absolutely incapable of following Ryanair's rules, yet expect to get their flight for nothing.

jules1964

lufcgirl wrote: »

It was in three different business sections of tabloids either yesterday or day before that Ryanair were planning to charge to use the toilets. I can't remember the exact quote but it said all planes were being converted to charge to use the toilet and it was pretty simple to fix. Also something like less people will use the toilet so they could knock a toilet out of a plane creating six extra seats and making flights even cheaper.

Don't quote me, but I'm positive I read that.

Thank you for your post.

JSF

Just back from Salou. I was there at 0800 for a 1015 flight to Liverpool.

There were 3 checkin desks at 0800 all closed, from what I recall

1. Liverpool departure 1015
2 London Stansted departure 1025
3. Dublin departure 1125

At 0815 they opened the Liverpool desk and refused to take the online boarding cards as it was a normal checkin desk. They then opened a bag drop desk at 0825 and directed ALL depatures to the one bag drop desk, despite the fact that the liverpool departure was at 1015 The liverpool desk was furthest from the bag drop with the result that the Liverpool flight ended at the back of the queue despite having been there well in advance of the 2hrs before. They then allowed Dublin and London passengers to bag drop before their 2hrs before departure time. Fortunately I managed to get to the gate on time. I think people got on the flight (it was held up for 5-10mins), however people who paid for priority boarding may have only just made it (and not been first on board) or even had chance to have a drink or do shopping.

First time I flown Ryanair, while the flight was fine however having a dozen waiting in 3 queues to check in normally with over 100 in one to bag drop seems crazy. 10kg hand luggage is not always an option and I was under 15kg, while amusing to see others having to move items between cases I really dont think its worth having to stand in a queue for over an hour to just drop a bag.

CarolynH

Edinburghlass wrote: »

At Edinburgh airport I always allow an hour and a half just to get through passport control then security and then the long walk to the Ryan Air departure gates and thats with hand luggage only.

Really????

peterbaker

PBS wrote:

Given that there are people on this forum with various personality related disorders, you might want to reconsider your comments.

Forgive me, but what really are you trying to say now, PBS?

Just because someone may have a hidden reason for behaving oddly or badly doesn't mean we have to stomach it in silence :rolleyes: We are allowed to state what we observe you know - it isn't a crime to do so.



Anyway back to the topic of the thread, it is clear that this Bag Drop initiative has been a complete moving feast from the outset. You PBS, I see waded in early with the suggestion that regular flyers like you knew exactly how it worked, but in another thread yesterday you clearly didn't know how it would work at Stansted for me ! You made some useful suggestions but basically for all of us that booked our flights and bags for summer holidays early in the year with Ryanair, there remains quite an uncertainty about what to expect from the Bag Drop experience at Stansted when we get there in the next few weeks :eek:

I notice that there still abounds a view that if you don't like some aspect of a provider's service you should just walk away and find another provider. That is an extremely short-sighted consumerist view, especially with a taxpayer subsidised market-leading provider. Furthermore, spouting such short-sight on a consumerist website is truly not very helpful to the cause.

I've said it before and it remains true that Ryanair is a huge beneficiary of tax concessions by UK Government (in allowing taxfree aviation fuel, for example). Ryanair is therefore heavily subsidised as a transport option by us as taxpayers. We therefore can and should voice our demands resulting from what we do and do not like about a foreign airline (which is what Ryanair is within the UK) which constantly challenges and abuses Fair Trading Laws.

Ryanair is to European Aviation what Global Warming is to the Polar Ice Packs. And we are the intrepid amateur low cost explorers who admire the views but in the main are totally ignorant of the thin ice from one season to the next until it breaks under us, excepting those of us that have habitually got our feet slightly wet or seen what happens to others who fall in (not funny when it happens to you though, eh rag31 ? )

In another thread I mentioned Pavlov's Dog as part of another analogy. It explains why people of modest modern UK airport experience do not allow massive 1980s style contingency times for every flight. Why should we when we have been led to expect and experienced much more fluent airport services as the norm? We learn to do the things that we get rewarded for doing. We learn that kicking our heels around Stansted for 3 hours waiting for check-in desks to open was not simply never necessary on Ryanair, and we learned it over a 10 year period at least . We learned that if a check-in queue was still a bit long with just an hour to go before the flight, Ryanair would open another desk, maybe two, and hurry you through. We learned that as long as you were in an active Ryanair check-in queue while it was open, they wouldn't close it in front of you.

Then comes the concept or Ryanair's concept anyway, of "Bag Drop". Now we Pavlov's Dogs need to learn new tricks or receive shocks :eek:


All this thread really highlights is a low-cost low-caring management implementation c*ck-up. The difference between BA c*cking up Terminal 5, and Ryanair c*cking up the OP's bag drop experience is that Ryanair's business philosophy is so ruthless that they will admit no liability nor even the remotest embarassment. And they employ people who are so anxious to keep their low cost job that they are prepared to propound the ruthless messages and dare to collect the hundreds of pounds in additional charges without showing the slightest emotion. Day in, day out. Let's face it, such people are themselves not fully developed personalities and can't possibly hold values that the wisest of us hold dear. Some will acquire better values as they mature. Others will always be lightweights who might be around in such numbers that they spoil our UK culture in the long run. Let's hope not.

Ryanair is in many ways pretty much the biggest airline in Europe. It has done it by exploiting the lowest common denominators and the common man's abilities to put up with poor pay and working conditions at one end and poor customer service at the other - the reward? Well it's about wanting something and how easily satisfied you are with what you get or what you experience or observe on the way. Some of us observe the same things, yet Customer A may think nothing of it, where Customer B knows it's a health hazard. A Butlin's manager once told me that the reason much of their accommodation was such poor quality was because the great unwashed simply accepted it :rolleyes:. Butlins had absolutely no problem with instant no fuss free upgrades for those customers who wanted more and expressed clearly what more should look like . They kept spare accommodation of higher quality at all their resorts just for that purpose.

The Ryanair story has been interesting to behold, and like non-stick saucepans came out of the Moonshots, there are no doubt many good things that have come out of Ryanair's rise and rise to the top.

But I have to tell you that, after swallowing that saucepan example of excellence for the last 40 years, I just learned from my cousin this last weekend that if bits of non-stick Tefal are getting into your system, they can be carcinogenic. Does that mean we now avoid them? NASA have surely improved theirs . I am sure the Space Station saucepans have long since featured Tefal which no longer gets flakey in the dishwasher .

So I say Hoorah for non-flakey saucepans , and
Down with flakey bag drop implementations

warehouse

Until you try ryanair you wont understand how despicable they are. You soon learn. They won't be in business this time next year.

lorweld

PolishBigSpender

peterbaker wrote: »

Forgive me, but what really are you trying to say now, PBS?

Just because someone may have a hidden reason for behaving oddly or badly doesn't mean we have to stomach it in silence :rolleyes: We are allowed to state what we observe you know - it isn't a crime to do so.

I'm completely lost. Perhaps something has been lost to me, but accusing people of having personality disorders simply because they don't agree with her is a rather crass and offensive thing to do.

Anyway back to the topic of the thread, it is clear that this Bag Drop initiative has been a complete moving feast from the outset. You PBS, I see waded in early with the suggestion that regular flyers like you knew exactly how it worked, but in another thread yesterday you clearly didn't know how it would work at Stansted for me ! You made some useful suggestions but basically for all of us that booked our flights and bags for summer holidays early in the year with Ryanair, there remains quite an uncertainty about what to expect from the Bag Drop experience at Stansted when we get there in the next few weeks :eek:

If you really want to know, why don't you call Ryanair and find out? I'm not familiar with what's happening at Stansted because I don't live near there - I can tell you for a fact that Ryanair in Poland are adopting the attitude that the relevant T&C's which you agreed to at the time of booking are still in force. I suspect the very same is happening at Stansted - but as with all interim arrangements, things may be changed around at no loss to yourself.

I notice that there still abounds a view that if you don't like some aspect of a provider's service you should just walk away and find another provider. That is an extremely short-sighted consumerist view, especially with a taxpayer subsidised market-leading provider.

The easiest way to show disatisfaction with something is not to use it. There is absolutely no point in howling and complaining about Ryanair, especially when so many complaints (as this website will show!) are actually the result of customer stupidity rather than being Ryanair's fault.

Furthermore, spouting such short-sight on a consumerist website is truly not very helpful to the cause.

Just what do you expect Ryanair to do? They are offering flights at a ridiculously low price in many cases, allowing people to travel to far flung destinations for a price that they could only have dreamed about. I remeber the bad old days in the 1990's when a flight to London would cost at least 300 pounds return. The same flight now will cost me no more than 100 pounds.

I've said it before and it remains true that Ryanair is a huge beneficiary of tax concessions by UK Government (in allowing taxfree aviation fuel, for example). Ryanair is therefore heavily subsidised as a transport option by us as taxpayers. We therefore can voice demands about what we do and do not like about a foreign airline (which is what Ryanair is within the UK) which constantly challenges and abuses Fair Trading Laws.

British Airways, Virgin, Flybe, Monarch, Easyjet and others have all abused those so called laws. All of those are coincidentally flying the UK flag and are registered in the UK. Need I remind you how BA and Virgin colluded over fuel surcharges? When the UK flag carrier operates in such a disgusting way, how can you complain about Ryanair?

I also remind you that Ryanair subsidise many UK airports. Where would Birmingham, Edinburgh, Bournemouth, Bristol, Durham, Derry, Glasgow Prestwick, London Stansted and more be without Ryanair? Struggling badly, I expect. Prestwick was virtually saved by Ryanair - the writing was on the wall and closure was imminent until they did the deal with Ryanair. Stansted frequently makes concessions to Ryanair - why would they do this if Ryanair wasn't so important to the well being of the airport?

Ryanair is to European Aviation what Global Warming is to the Polar Ice Packs. And we are the intrepid amateur low cost explorers who admire the views but in the main are totally ignorant any thin ice until it breaks under us, excepting those of us that have got our feet wet or seen what happens to others who fall in (not funny when it happens to you though, eh rag31 ? )

Do I have to remind you that BA have asked workers to work without pay, while Ryanair are continuing on without needing to insult their staff in such a way? Or need I remind you that Ryanair offer a much better chance of 'taking the left seat' than BA ever will?

Ryanair opened up many, many markets in Europe - and many of these markets are heavily reliant on Ryanair. Look at their operations in mainland Europe - how many people discovered beautiful cities that were previously unheard of due to Ryanair? The answer is a significant amount.

In another thread I mentioned Pavlov's Dog as part of another analogy. It explains why people of modest modern UK airport experience do not allow massive 1980s style contingency times for every flight.

Two important things happened that differ the 1980's to the 2000's. 9/11 and 7/7. If people are still so naive as to expect lax security controls, then they deserve to miss their flight. Any amount of common sense should tell you that European security controls have been significantly toughened up, and as a result, they should allow extra time.

Why should we when we have been led to expect and experienced much more fluent airport services as the norm?

Again, I refer you to 7/7 and 9/11.

We learn to do the things that we get rewarded for doing. We learn that kicking our heels around Stansted for 3 hours waiting for check-in desks to open was not simply never necessary on Ryanair, and we learned it over a 10 year period at least .

It might not have been neccessary, but in today's economic climate, the inconvenience is allowing Ryanair to survive where other airlines are in serious trouble. The fact that BA is desperately seeking a merger with Iberia should tell you everything - the airline industry is in trouble as a whole and things need to change.

We learned that if a check-in queue was still a bit long with just an hour to go before the flight, Ryanair would open another desk, maybe two, and hurry you through. We learned that as long as you were in an active Ryanair check-in queue while it was open, they wouldn't close it in front of you.

Since when? Ryanair have always operated the strict cut off to the best of my knowledge, dating back to 2002 when I took my first flight with them. In fact, this was one thing that differentiated them - they can and would punish people who chose to abuse the regulations. Ryanair may have opened extra desks - but that was then and this is now. The whole operation is much more professional now - you know that if you don't allow plenty of time, then you'll be punished. And this is the way it should be.

Then comes the concept or Ryanair's concept anyway, of "Bag Drop". Now we Pavlov's Dogs need to learn new tricks or receive shocks :eek:

It's your obligation to learn these so called 'tricks'. If you want to fly with them, you learn. Simple. Likewise, if you fly BA, you have to learn to expect hideous delays and the loss of your baggage.

All this thread really highlights is a low-cost low-caring management implementation c*ck-up. The difference between BA c*cking up Terminal 5, and Ryanair c*cking up the OP's bag drop experience is that Ryanair's business philosophy is so ruthless that they will admit no liability nor even the remotest embarassment.

And this business philosophy should allow Ryanair to emerge from the wreckage that is the airline industry relatively intact. Perhaps you might like to ask BA workers about how secure their pension fund is?

And they employ people who are so anxious to keep their low cost job that they are prepared to propound the ruthless messages and dare to collect the hundreds of pounds in additional charges without showing the slightest emotion.

They have a job to do. The job doesn't need personality or empathy - the rules and regulations are there in black and white. If you turn up late, then you don't fly, it really is that simple. Likewise, if you can't obey the baggage regulations, then you pay. Or if you can't print a boarding pass in advance, then you pay. This is the condition of being able to fly hundreds of kilometres for a very low price.

Day in, day out. Let's face it, such people are themselves not fully developed personalities and can't possibly hold values that the wisest of us hold dear.

Their values are about getting the job done that they've been employed to do. They arent employed to emphasise with an idiot - they're employed to process people as quickly and efficiently as possible. You know nothing about them as people, so how can you comment on their personalities?

I would suggest that someone who is able to keep their business and personal lives seperate has a rather well developed personality.

Some will acquire better values as they mature. Others will always be lightweights who might be around in such numbers that they spoil our UK culture in the long run. Let's hope not.

So you wish for the UK to be ran by people who cannot follow instructions, who spend their time emphasising and not making money, therefore driving businesses into bankruptcy and thus causing a nation of people reliant on the welfare state?

Ryanair is in many ways pretty much the biggest airline in Europe. It has done it by exploiting the lowest common denominators and the common man's abilities to put up with poor pay and working conditions at one end and poor customer service at the other - the reward? Well it's about wanting something and being satisfied with it.

Ryanair became the biggest airline in Europe by flying people at the lowest possible price and seeking to aggressively save money/make money wherever they could. Why do you think other airlines are failing badly? They simply failed on both those counts.

warehouse wrote:

Until you try ryanair you wont understand how despicable they are. You soon learn. They won't be in business this time next year.

I fly Ryanair all the time, they're undeniably the best option for most travel from Poland to elsewhere in Europe. Never had a problem, and I don't find them 'despicable'.

As for them not being in business at this time next year - perhaps you might want to look at the problems facing Virgin and BA before you go passing judgement on Ryanair. I'll be amazed if British Airways survives as an independent company beyond the end of this year.

rag31

PolishBigSpender wrote: »

I'm completely lost. Perhaps something has been lost to me, but accusing people of having personality disorders simply because they don't agree with her is a rather crass and offensive thing to do.

Saying that people are personality-challenged is not the same as saying they have a personality disorder, actually! And it wasn't because people didn't agree with me (I have four children, I am used to the kind of behaviour displayed by some of the posters in this thread! ), it was because they were rude, unhelpful and well to quote yourself 'crass and offensive'. A quick read back through the thread should confirm this if you've forgotten what you and a couple of others said.

I agree with everything peterbaker says - a very intelligent and well thought out analysis of the thread and general concerns.

I think that on a 'moneysaving' focussed website people flagging up possible unexpected charges (yes, even if they are in the small print or on a company's website they can still be thought of as unexpected) or poor value for money is what you would expect, not people rubbishing these concerns at every turn and barking at them to stop using the provider.

If we saw this sort of response to concerns over unfair/hidden charges and poor value for money on every other thread on MSE I don't think it would be as popular and valuable as it is.

Becky