Turned Down for Jobseekers

Ossireo

Garry_Anderson wrote: »

Sorry - thought I made it clear - my daughter have never claimed before - she was asked about savings as though she was going for Income Based JSA - she didn't know any better so did no question this - I went to JCP and she had been put for Income Based JSA - what is difficult to understand?

BTW: I will argue with anybody that tries to 'steal' from my daughters - or indeed wife and self - hence confrontation with FSA.

Yes you have made YOURSELF clear in so far as you think £20 has been stolen from your daughter and I do understand being protective of family. You are assuming that your daughter has had an INCOME BASED JSA claim ONLY made (which is IMPOSSIBLE, it has been explained to you twice (and you don't appear to listen) that it is either a JSA(C) ONLY or JSA(C) + JSA(IB) claim that can be made ... there is no such thing as an JSA(IB) ONLY claim).

If your daughter actually HAS an entitlement to JSA(C) this would be paid over any JSA(IB) assessment (For a rough example - the award notice for a JSA(C) & (IB) claim would say, You are entitled to £60 JSA(C) based on your contributions in XYZ tax year. You are entitled to £40 JSA(IB) as worked out below which would show the amount deducted due to capital). It would then mention that the JSA(C) would be paid for a certain period of time.

JSA(C) is only paid for a specific period (it is not like Incapacity Benefit and cannot be ongoing) and when the £60 entitlement to JSA(C) exhausts in X number of days then the £40 JSA(IB) would start to be paid. Claiming both would never cause a negative effect on the contribution part of an assessment.

There are cases when a persons contributions for certain years need to be queried, in this case if there is a JSA(IB) entitlment they will pay this so the customer is not without an income then when the query is resolved and if a JSA(C) entitlement is available then the difference backdated will be paid.

There is no way that a JSA(IB) claim can 'steal' £20 off of your daughter if she has a JSA(C) entitlement, as there are limited circumstances which would reduce a JSA(C) assessment. Without further information from yourself none of the people on here or myself can further explain things that can make you understand what we mean as repeatedly saying 'they steal £20' says nothing unless you are disagreeing with the capital limits of JSA(IB) claims etc it also gives no information to the OP in any shape of form other then paranoia.

bestpud

Garry_Anderson wrote: »

Sorry - thought I made it clear - my daughter have never claimed before - she was asked about savings as though she was going for Income Based JSA - she didn't know any better so did no question this - I went to JCP and she had been put for Income Based JSA - what is difficult to understand?

BTW: I will argue with anybody that tries to 'steal' from my daughters - or indeed wife and self - hence confrontation with FSA.

Sounds like a simple error to me! For some reason, her records showed she hadn't paid enough contributions, or someone made a mistake. It happens!!

Nothing to do with 'stealing', or underhand tactics, and easily rectified without a big scene imo.

Oldernotwiser

Given that your daughter must be at least 24 if she's worked for 8 years then I'm amazed the JCP were prepared to talk to you about somebody else's personal claim. Now THAT warrants a complaint!

Garry_Anderson

Nothing complicated - why are people having trouble understanding:

1. My daughter was put on Income Based JSA ***only*** - i.e. it is not impossible, the advisor even said "the claimant can choose which to go on" (yet my daughter was not given choice as - like stated - she was put down for Income Based JSA).

2. I went with my daughter to help her and prevent any more "simple errors".

3. Had all her savings been taken into account she would have got £20 per week less i.e. she would have been deprived or 'defrauded' of legally entitled benefit.

4. Why *even ask* for all financial details if she was going for contribution based?

porrahman

Everybody who claims JSA makes a claim for Contributary JSA, If you have paid enough class 1 stamps this would be the JSA rec'd for up to 6 mths.

If the person has not paid enough class 1 stamps or has not been working they would be advised to claim Income based JSA as their claim to the Contibutary would fail.

It sounds like the advisor hasn't explained this very well as you seem to think that "They" are stealing from her.

Garry_Anderson

porrahman wrote: »

Everybody who claims JSA makes a claim for Contributary JSA, If you have paid enough class 1 stamps this would be the JSA rec'd for up to 6 mths.

If the person has not paid enough class 1 stamps or has not been working they would be advised to claim Income based JSA as their claim to the Contibutary would fail.

It sounds like the advisor hasn't explained this very well as you seem to think that "They" are stealing from her.

Thanks - but English is my first language, have good education and know when something is not right - like I say - it aint rocket science.

One big clue was when there was no denial from advisor about what had happened - she said it must have been 'mistake'.

BTW: As stated - my daughter has worked 8 years and is entitled to contibution based JSA.

LizzieS_2

Garry_Anderson wrote: »

4. Why *even ask* for all financial details if she was going for contribution based?

Simple, it is one form for everyone and covers both contribution-based and income-based. At the application stage not everyone knows for certain whether they will qualify for contribution-based. Also not everyone knows what other benefits they could claim in addition to IS (income-based makes the likes of CTB and HB quicker as the checks have already been done).

If the system was changed to make it easier for those living at home having a good NI history, there would be far more people out there who would end up having to go through the application process twice, and far more who get contribution-based and never know of HB & CTB etc.

I'm afraid you do have to look at the full picture covering all claimants rather than having blinkered vision based just on your daughters situation.

PS. The mistake was just that - theft could only apply if the person committing the 'wrong' made a gain themselves.

ALIBOBSY

Just to say re the JSA, the computer system is set up so that even if you process a claim as income based you are FORCED to go through the screen to process contributary based. It may be that the NI info for the cont based was wrong (happens loads of time) when I did processing I used to manually check the award by going into and checking the conts, but having done pensions and a number of benefits over the years I had more idea about conts. Also having done manual awards I didn't trust the computer in the same way a new processor might. I actually did a quick check of what the computer had calculated. Mind you I worked on the premise that i would rather do 20 cases with 100% accuracy rather than 30 with half wrong. These days the managers are no doubt pushing for more clearance because of the shear numbers.

ali x

Ossireo

Garry_Anderson wrote: »

Thanks - but English is my first language, have good education and know when something is not right - like I say - it aint rocket science.

Yet you are still failing to see the points of the various people that have tried very hard to explain stuff to you about how things are or may have been processed. Preferring to stick to your conspiracy theft theory. Also implying that we are not educated as well in your own special way :rolleyes:

Ali has said things perfectly, especially about the system forcing you to assess contributary based (I was same as you, actually processing clerical caseloads for a while when JSA originally came in, fun stuff, Mmmmm RITYs!! and I also agree with you on the accuracy side of things having followed that ethic myself, would rather get it right then have to rework - or deal with irrate fathers )

bestpud

Garry_Anderson wrote: »

Thanks - but English is my first language, have good education and know when something is not right - like I say - it aint rocket science.

One big clue was when there was no denial from advisor about what had happened - she said it must have been 'mistake'.

BTW: As stated - my daughter has worked 8 years and is entitled to contibution based JSA.

Perhaps she said it was a 'mistake' because it was!?

I know you say your dd knew no better, but tbh, I would hope someone who had been in the workplace 8 years would have enough about them to check the rules and regulations, and see for themselves what they may be able to claim? Does she really still require a parent to intervene?

Do people really just turn up and take what they are given, without any effort to research their entitlement first?

Perhaps it's just me but I like to have a pretty good idea before I apply!