Icelandic Banks - The thread for OFFSHORE savers

occamsrazor

expatfrance wrote: »

There seems to be some doubt as to whether the old compensation scheme or the new compensation scheme would be applied as the bank was put into administration before the new schem was announced.

"Delegates at the meeting were told their personal savings would be covered up to the higher value of £50,000, raised from the previous limit of £15,000 in an emergency sitting of Tynwald that morning.

John Aspden, of the Financial Supervision Commission said further details would be finalised at the Tynwald sittings on October 27 and 28.

For those with joint accounts, it was usual for each person to have a personal compensation entitlement, in this case making a total of £100,000 he said."

http://www.iomtoday.co.im/news/Heated-scenes-at-Kaupthing-meeting.4576662.jp

Minotaur

occamsrazor wrote: »

Everyone... I'm cross-posting this to the different websites as I feel it's important. If you need to see anything on the former Kaupthing Isle of Man website, Google Cache is still working and showing almost all the pages. Obviously though you cannot login to your account.

More importantly they've cached all the documents available there. I've downloaded all of them I could find, added some documents I'd saved previously, and have now uploaded them all as a single zipped folder. This contains all the account terms and conditions, brochures containing parental group guarantees, Derbyshire information, application forms, routing details, etc.

You can download it here:

http://www.mediafire.com/?sharekey=ab54fda9e7e7e3f9d2db6fb9a8902bda

Hope this helps eventually....

Occam, this is brilliant. Thanks once again.

May I make a suggestion.

What we need is a library of official statements, such as the press release issued today by the IoM government. http://www.gov.im/lib/docs/fsc/PressReleases/kaupthingupdate.pdf.

These provide the ammunition and the backup for any letters we write to the Treasury, the Prime Minister or MPs. In this case, for example, we can ask HMG to support the IoM’s representation quoting:
‘“The Isle of Man Government is determined to protect depositors with the local subsidiary by pressing the Government of Iceland, which has nationalised Kaupthing Bank, to honour the commitment given to its Isle of Man based affiliate. “Accordingly, we have made representation to the United Kingdom Government - which is responsible for defending the Isle of Man’s interests internationally – requesting them to press the Government of Iceland to honour Kaupthing’s guarantee,” the Chief Minster said.’

This is far stronger than a letter simply outlining our own woes.

Similarly if anything official appears from the receiver or from the IoM authorities that confirms (what is currently rumour) that
a) up to 60% of KSF(IoM) was with KSF(UK);
and/or
b) that it was the direct result of the UK taking KSF(UK) into administration that led to KSF(IoM) collapsing

then that is also good ammunition for reminding HMG that it has a moral and ethical duty also to protect its expatriate as well as its resident citizens from the result of its actions.
I, for one, am reluctant to write until I have more than just press speculation or unconfirmed statements via the media or blogs.

I would offer to do something like this myself, but I am technologically backward, and am also travelling extensively during the next three weeks (added to which my laptop has passed out -- troubles never come singly!)

The current three forums are fantastic; and thanks to everyone for all your information. But by their nature they are difficult to extract the hard facts from. Indeed a straigtforward list of links to a) official or semi-official statements that are backed up by a quoted authority; and b) to media reports would be immensely useful.

Having chapter and verse to quote is always best.

Minotaur

P.S. Has anyone yet had a reply from Anglo Irish IoM about whether it is or is not covered by the Irish Government's 2-year guarantee.

I haven't, and am getting rather jittery as I have some euros there on a fixed deposit and simply can't afford another disaster.

Monkeyface3604

Just seen on the BBC news that the total ammount of money caught up in U.K. seized Icelandic banks is 8 BILLION.
Now tell me what sort of impact is our 86 million going to make on that!!!

donal_f

Minotaur wrote: »

P.S. Has anyone yet had a reply from Anglo Irish IoM about whether it is or is not covered by the Irish Government's 2-year guarantee.

I haven't, and am getting rather jittery as I have some euros there on a fixed deposit and simply can't afford another disaster.

I am in the same boat. And I still haven't made a decision to take the penalty and get the money out or not. My thoughts are as follows:

- I believe the Irish Government covers all deposits with Irish Institutions. The reason for this is I'm Irish (but live in UK) and I know that Irish media and opposition party were getting a bit upset that the Irish Government were guaranteeing British deposit holders.
- Secondly, as my money with Anglo Irish Bank is less than £50k and there's now a 100% guarantee going forward - I feel there's a backup if Anglo Irish were to go bust.

However, as you've said, I'm a bit jittery and still considering my options!

Fight_4_It

I just spoke to an insider in a London Bank back office in the payments section. He was able to access the Banker Almanac for Monday and Tuesday. All KSF (IoM) payments went first through KSF UK, as an MT103 message, being an Agency Bank it would be forwarded another UK main street bank, KSF UK uses NATWEST, (not HSBC) as their clearing Bank in the UK for BACS and CHAPS payments who would forward this on to sent to the account holder for credit. I just spoke to someone in the payments team with HSBC back office in the UK who could check some of previous cleared payments. BACS and CHAPS arrived from NATWEST through HSBC. The payment came from KSF LONDON after it was sent from KSF (IOM).

AS I understand there were several things happening at that time. Kaupthing LONDON from was in the process of getting shut down. All assets where being seized by Darlings orders, the outgoing payments in the system were stopped. At the same time all UK banks were setting up sanctions to stop or ‘quarantine’ payments from ICELANDIC Banks. Payments could not get through if they did. We did not stand a chance of getting the payment here in the UK, this week. The sad thing as I am told is that even if the payment message is found now, the funds are not attached to it, because the credit cannot be cleared by the receiving bank now because the credit no longer exists. It’s not worth the paper it could be printed on. This is why sanctions were being put in place, because UK Banks did not want to get caught with crediting funds to customers they could not get credited now.

The only good side of the argument is, that the payment message was cleared and with KSF (UK) and in the UK system. The only reason we did get them is because the UK Gov stopped the KSF from forwarding it. We need to prove this however. Even though KSF IoM cannot give us details of the MT103 they were able them into APACS system to begin with. The onus is on KSF UK, not KSF IoM and they will have records of every MT103 with credit and show if that credit was taken into their banking system, that came from KSF(IoM)
CHAPS payment to another IoM Bank made it because it went through HSBC Douglas without a problem. Other clearing to Foreign Banks were SWIFT. USD was cleared through Deutsch Bank, USA. EUR though Deutsch, DE. But as is for payments in UK, the UK Government is solely responsible for the loss. The credit was there when payment arrived at KSF London. Meanwhile KSF UK customers get there money back 100%. But ….
The biggest trouble is problem is KSF IoM holders like myself we are either ex-pats or foreign nationals, using the important tax advantage of the offshore system. So, along with the non-dom debate, we don’t get much sympathy, or support here. It just drops between the posts. I think we need IoM and Tony Brown to help prove this and we must all band together to fight this issue and as UK residents remitting funds to the UK that actually arrived here and were stopped by protective measures of UK for the purpose of protecting UK account holders (us) In this process we should not be frozen out of the FSCS or other UK Government compensation. We need good knowledgeable help to rage this war with the help of the press to make it known. – James (UK)
-(pasted from my comment http://www.iomtoday.co.im/your-shout/Financial-crisis-and-IoM.4544715.jp)

Further udate: According to APACS all payment were stopped going into or our of KSF UK since Monday. KSF (UK) payment from Monday are now going out (confirmed) from ING as booked by Kaupthing Edge UK customers. ING claims they have KSF payments from KSF UK, but QUESTIONS remains if KSF (UK) was suspended how can we find out if they received any of KSF (IoM) payment instructions sent by MT103, and were these transfered to ING or not?

occamsrazor

James - please visit the KSF Action Group Site to post your useful information in the forum:
"Status of in-flight transactions from KSF IoM"

http://www.ksfiomdepositors.com/cms/?q=node/18


http://www.ksfiomdepositors.com/cms

Dubaidu

Regarding the new site [EMAIL="ksfdepositors@gmail.com"]ksfdepositors@gmail.com[/EMAIL] - I have found I could not post any messages -having first registered and logged in and writing message there was only a "preview" or "save" button to press - no "submit reply" or "post" message coming up for me. (They are asking everyone to give the amount of their losses on a thread for that). Also on other threads - the same thing. Anyone else experienced these problems? Hope they are sorted. I expect there are still alot of people with money in KSF in far flung off-shore places who still don't know what has happened and will not know until they try to access their money. Therefore the more publicity about this - the better.

occamsrazor

dubaidu - The save button will submit your reply (assuming you registered and are logged in). Also it seems there is some behind-the-scenes work going on to try and save our money and maybe publicity at this time could be counter-productive.

gomann

Jersey is twitching into the 21st Century, with as yet unformed proposals to protect Jersey residents banking with Jersey-based institutions [all 47 of them :rolleyes: ].

Our Chief Minister proudly claims that only those institutions in the "Top 500" can get a license to operate here ... as he's a multi-millionaire, I wonder where he banks?

"If a Jersey-based institution fails, we could use the "Rainy Day Fund" to compensate ..." or words to that effect. Frank, you have £600M in the fund ... how far do you think that would stretch, given the wealth of some of out local "residents"?

Oh ... but the Jersey Government [The States] will be applying political pressure. I bet Iceland and UK are really worried about that :rolleyes: