CSA - October 27th Change...?

T4i

I shall try be as clear as possible.

I have a 3 yr old that was taken away from me by my lovely ex partner back in October 2007.

The ex is on benefits (:mad:) and has been for the last 10 years. When we split in October 2007 she told me that we couldnt make our own arrangments for payments as she is on benefits and we would have to involve the CSA so they can get her benefits right. Fair doos!

I've rang CSA twice now to ask them to take my money, but on both occasions they told me they have no idea how long it will be before the claim is actualy finalised and they can take my money. So I've setup a 'savings' bank account and put away £175 a month ready for when the CSA deciede to pulls ones socks up.

I see my child twice a week, on a Friday night after i finish work and all day Sunday (goodbye weekend lol), I take them out to theme parks and other recreational places quite often, supply them with shoes, clothes from M&S (i get a discount as my mother works there), school uniforms......blah blah blah.

As I understand it the CSA will not take into consideration that I already supply my child with things needed in life, so I still need to put away £175 a month for CSA.

Today when picking my child up my ex told me that the CSA is changing rules on the 27/10/08. She said the new rules would mean that she now has the choice of going through the CSA or doing financial arrangments privately.

She really suprised me by saying she would want £100 a month to support the child, as she knows damn well my child must get the best part of £300 a month spent on her anyway (not including the £175 i'm putting into the savings account). All sounds too good to me, i've read too many horror stories that are similar to me and reading about dads getting a letter saying they owe them 33k

Me and the ex get on, but she is the kinda person to try get as much money as she can for free (you know the types!), so i'm not sure if this is a way of trying to get £275 a month off me by tricking me into a rogue arrangment.

What would I need to do if I accepted to make our own financial arrangments that is 100% guranteed to stand up in court if it was needed? I don't trust this goverment at all, and when sums of k's involved i'm really not comfy unless I know for sure 100% that i'm going to be fine.

Any help would be appreciated.

Just for the record I also bring up my ex's first child, she is not mine but she knows me as 'Dad' as I brought her up from the age of 8 months. She gets just the same financial support (if not even more as she is older, aged 6, needs more expensive 'names', more expensive grown up presents etc etc). Would the CSA take into consideration this? Or would they not even acknowlage that she is part of the 'bigger picture'?

Thanks,
T4i

enemes

Hiya

I can see where you a coming from, and perhaps you do have reason to be suspicious. The bottom line is, if she is on benefits, she would only see £10 (or £20 a week on new system) from you, so it would be to her advantage to ask for a mere £100/wk thru a private arrangement, because she is assuming that DWP would never know about it. I think she is calling your bluff, in that she will accept £100 from you, and claim all of her benefits.

As for her other child, it shouldn't come into the reckoning. How do you know whether your ex is claiming for her from her biological father thru the CSA or whatever arrangemnt she might have in place?

The bottom line is, just make sure that if you go down the private arrangement route, make sure you have receipts/records of payments, which would prevent - hopefully - in years to come a lofty bill landing on your door mat.

Loopy_Girl

If she is on benefits then the most she can get to keep is £20.00 per week.

Lets just say for example you gave her £60.00 a week. She should be decalring this to the DWP who would adjust her IS to drop £40.00 a week.

If you pay through the CSA, when they finally get their act in order with the assessment (well done you for setting up a savings account btw ) then whatever the assessment is and whatever you will pay, they will only pass on £80.00 a month to her. Any excess from you goes to the state to compensate her being on IS as a lone parent.

The smarter PWC would close the CSA case, accept £80.00 a month from you and then let you pay extras and as when you want to.

At the moment as it stands, you are already in arrears as you don't know how much you should be paying. Hopefully the money you have been putting away will cover the arrears (to have an idea of what you should be paying to her, use the CSA websire as they have a calculator to use)

The first daughter will not be taken into consideration as she is not your biological daughter. Any monies paid to her are off your own back I'm afraid.

If you want my opinion, she sounds like she is trying to get CSA from you, not declare it and also get her benefits. Whilst you wouldn't get into trouble by the DWP for that (you could say you assumed she was declaring), that is really something for your conscience to decide whether you want to be a part of.
At the moment you are under no obligation to pay her anything and as the assessment hasn't been finalised, any money you are giving to her just now won't be counted towards your arrears.

Hope that helps

T4i

enemes wrote: »

As for her other child, it shouldn't come into the reckoning. How do you know whether your ex is claiming for her from her biological father thru the CSA or whatever arrangemnt she might have in place?

I was with her for nearly 5 years so I know exactly her position with claiming for her 1st child. He has a claim in against her biological farther as he hasn't seen her after she was 6months old. Her real dad has paid her £10 so far for the last 5 years, she has his NI number and even told the CSA where he works, he is a welder on £12/hour but seems to have some sort of arrangment with his boss to avoid paying. He must owe her alot of money by now.

enemes wrote: »

The bottom line is, just make sure that if you go down the private arrangement route, make sure you have receipts/records of payments, which would prevent - hopefully - in years to come a lofty bill landing on your door mat.

This is what I'm not certain on. She doesnt have a bank account, only a post office account where her benefits go. I'm sure someone told me I can't transfer funds straight to her post office account. What is classed as a reciept? I have a funny feeling she would want £100 cash, but i aint stupid. Would a online bank statement be enough proof of providing for my child if it came to it. But then I think about bank statements, arn't they only held for 5 years? What happens if this claim takes 10yrs to go through, how would I prove the 1st 5yrs fininacial arrangment?

Also, if I can prove i've been paying £100 a month could the CSA turn round and say I should of been paying £175 so I actualy owe £xxx amount for the £75 less I have been paying via a private arrangment.

There just seems to be loads of holes in this system and its the non-workers of this world that seem to be able to exploit them and its the honest contributed worker that suffers.

Thanks for your reply.

Loopy_Girl

You are treading on thin ice with the 'benefits' and 'non worker' comments. None of which will endear you. I'm sure you will get the help you need but please bear in mind that alot of the lone parents that use this board and offer support and advice have been/are on benefits.

It's no picnic bringing up children on just over £120.00 a week.

Why are you going to give her money if your CSA assessment hasn't been done? Is she closing the file? Because if you give her £100.00 now, then you will pay twice as the CSA will expect the arrears.

No you can't pay into a post office account. Play hard ball and ask her to open a basic bank account and set up a standing order and call it 'maintenance for xxx'. You can only call s/o by a certain name, not d/d's.

Personally I think you are mad. She has got you over a barrell and she knows it...no doubt the threat of removed access will come to light if you fail to comply. Do not give her ANY money until your file has been closed and you are doing a private arrangement.

enemes

Its not ideal, but the safest route is to make sure that you pay through the CSa. OK, she'll only get the first £10/£20 per week, and sadly your daughter will lose out, but that is your ex's choice. The CSA take your money, but at least you can be rest assured that it won't come back to haunt you in the future.

It sounds like she is a master ( or mistress!) at playing the system ... don't worry, I have one too.

Loopy_Girl

You have a mistress? Lordy.....:p

T4i

Loopy_Girl wrote: »

(to have an idea of what you should be paying to her, use the CSA websire as they have a calculator to use)

£44 a week = £176 a month.

I put away £175 a month, I'm sure I can find the extra pound unless they take another 14yrs to catch up with me. More than capable from what I've seen of this CSA system.

I never understood all this 'farthers for justice' stuff on the news, but the further I look into this the more I completely understand where they are coming from. :mad:


Surely CSA should be for the dads that can't be arsed - don't want to have any part of their kids life, refuse to pay their upbringing. Not the ones who actualy do more than the mum's financialy, if it wasn't for me both of them kids would get to watch TV 24/7 or look at the same 4 walls.

Rant over! Frustrated!

enemes

Loopy_Girl wrote: »

You have a mistress? Lordy.....:p

Nope ... but I believe it is something that lies between the mister and the matress! :rotfl:

N71

T4i wrote: »

I shall try be as clear as possible.

I have a 3 yr old that was taken away from me by my lovely ex partner back in October 2007.

The ex is on benefits (:mad:) and has been for the last 10 years. When we split in October 2007 she told me that we couldnt make our own arrangments for payments as she is on benefits and we would have to involve the CSA so they can get her benefits right. Fair doos!

I've rang CSA twice now to ask them to take my money, but on both occasions they told me they have no idea how long it will be before the claim is actualy finalised and they can take my money. So I've setup a 'savings' bank account and put away £175 a month ready for when the CSA deciede to pulls ones socks up. Did you base this £175 a month on what you think you should be paying? Will it be enough to cover arrears? When they finally finalise your assessment, even if PWC closes the case, most of the arrears will be owed to the Secretary of State, except £10 a week that will be owed to PWC.

If you haven't already, use the calculator on the CSA website to check you're saving enough.

I see my child twice a week, on a Friday night after i finish work and all day Sunday (goodbye weekend lol), I take them out to theme parks and other recreational places quite often, supply them with shoes, clothes from M&S (i get a discount as my mother works there), school uniforms......blah blah blah.

As I understand it the CSA will not take into consideration that I already supply my child with things needed in life, so I still need to put away £175 a month for CSA. No, these things won't be taken into account. All you legally need to pay is what the CSA assess you at - anything else you provide for your child is a bonus!

Today when picking my child up my ex told me that the CSA is changing rules on the 27/10/08. She said the new rules would mean that she now has the choice of going through the CSA or doing financial arrangments privately. Yes, she's getting the option of closing her CSA case (but the arrears due to the SOS will still be there), and making a private arrangement with you. However, its down to her to inform the benefits agency what she's receiving so she can adjust her benefits.

If you're not happy about this, you can apply to the CSA to pay through them. Not a lot of people know the NRP is entitled to use the CSA to pay rather than the other way round.

She really suprised me by saying she would want £100 a month to support the child, as she knows damn well my child must get the best part of £300 a month spent on her anyway (not including the £175 i'm putting into the savings account). All sounds too good to me, i've read too many horror stories that are similar to me and reading about dads getting a letter saying they owe them 33k If all is above board, she'll have her benefits adjusted to take this £100 into account, she's receive £80 of it and the SOS will get the other £20. If she wants £100 a month, thats all you have to give her - end of.

Me and the ex get on, but she is the kinda person to try get as much money as she can for free (you know the types!), so i'm not sure if this is a way of trying to get £275 a month off me by tricking me into a rogue arrangment.

What would I need to do if I accepted to make our own financial arrangments that is 100% guranteed to stand up in court if it was needed? I don't trust this goverment at all, and when sums of k's involved i'm really not comfy unless I know for sure 100% that i'm going to be fine. If you agree to this, pay by direct debit or standing order from your account - i'm pretty sure you can do this into a post office account - someone correct me if i'm wrong.

Any help would be appreciated.

Just for the record I also bring up my ex's first child, she is not mine but she knows me as 'Dad' as I brought her up from the age of 8 months. She gets just the same financial support (if not even more as she is older, aged 6, needs more expensive 'names', more expensive grown up presents etc etc). Would the CSA take into consideration this? Or would they not even acknowlage that she is part of the 'bigger picture'? This wouldn't be taken into account at all (unless you'd legally adopted this child). Would you know if they'd finally caught up with this childs dad and he was also paying her?

Thanks,
T4i

So firstly, check the CSA website and make sure you're saving approx the correct amount.

And i admire the way you're providing for your child (and the other one!!) and trying to do the right thing. (Thats not meant to sound patronising)

enemes

T4i wrote: »

Surely CSA should be for the dads that can't be arsed - don't want to have any part of their kids life, refuse to pay their upbringing. Not the ones who actualy do more than the mum's financialy, if it wasn't for me both of them kids would get to watch TV 24/7 or look at the same 4 walls.

Well, like any huge machine, there is no flexibilty and all NRP's are considered the same, which for good ones like you must be the real frustration.