British Gas prices to rise by up to 60%??????

paulonline123

backfoot wrote: »

SwanJon wrote: »

[irrelevent stuff]

In simple terms,there is adequate consumption history,fairly low usage, and annual cost can be reliably and easily assessed. On changing to Click 5, a near 25% saving would be expected but in fact BG have chosen to up the payments.

Astonishing !!

I dont know where you get your figures for click 5 saving you 25% and perhaps thats why your confused. Before the price increase (which is what your direct debit will be based upon) click 5 saved you about 3 - 4% on the gas and 10% on the electric if you paid by direct debit already which, of course, you did.

All that aside without looking specifically at your account I couldn't with any degree of certainty tell you why the DD has risen. In all honesty thats what the 550 million pound computer system is for and what the company does for a living.

What you were saying is that click 5 is more expensive and you were lied to effectivelly which is PLAIN WRONG.

At the end of the day i've tried to inject some sanity into the thread and will try no more, its bad enough to have to talk to people who willfully misunderstand through the day without doing it when I get home.

If you really believe that evil British Gas is ruining your life then I suggest switching and a tinfoil hat to stop the lazor beams we send to keep you with us.

SwanJon

backfoot wrote: »

The plan started February 2006 when the property was purchased|

So the next plan year would have started around Feb 2007 (depending n bill cycle), and the current plan around Feb 2008.
So, 8 months through the plan something changes, but as mentioned previously it might not have the immediate effect you are after.
To get an accurate DD, keep supplying readings, check your statemtns for estimates, check when your reassessments happen, or close the old payment plan and start again (just check nothing happens to your click tariff if you do, as Cardew says, somethimes the system isn't perfectly predictable.

PS, yes I am an employee - would you rather have no help?

1carminestocky

paulonline123, I know you are the expert here....but are you entirely sure about the %tage difference between standard tariff and Click 5?

backfoot

paulonline123 wrote: »

I dont know where you get your figures for click 5 saving you 25% and perhaps thats why your confused. Before the price increase (which is what your direct debit will be based upon) click 5 saved you about 3 - 4% on the gas and 10% on the electric if you paid by direct debit already which, of course, you did.

I used the consumption history both for gas and electricity in Moneysupermarket.com price comparison search engine.It showed a saving of £183 from a starting point of £741. I make that just under 25%.I also checked it on Energyhelpline and that came out with a bigger saving.

All that aside without looking specifically at your account I couldn't with any degree of certainty tell you why the DD has risen. In all honesty thats what the 550 million pound computer system is for and what the company does for a living.

I have worked with many computer systems which can produce erroneous results. They work on instructions given and if those instructions are wrong or biased to produce a result then that is what happens.Just because a computer system says something do you always accept it.Or indeed, because it is 'their business' does that make them always right? Not in my experience,and I think this is another example.

What you were saying is that click 5 is more expensive and you were lied to effectivelly which is PLAIN WRONG.

I don't believe I said anything like that. I said I expected Click 5 to reduce the charges. It is unarguable that this should have been the case. However,the DD's have been raised. What is wrong with querying that?

At the end of the day i've tried to inject some sanity into the thread and will try no more, its bad enough to have to talk to people who willfully misunderstand through the day without doing it when I get home.

I appreciate the time you have taken as well as Jon to try and offer some explanations and further query the facts. I have answered them fully. It seems like you claim the sanity in the discussion but have failed to answer in any way or give a valid reason for the strange rise in the Direct Debits.

If you really believe that evil British Gas is ruining your life then I suggest switching and a tinfoil hat to stop the lazor beams we send to keep you with us.

I don't think they are ruining my life. Where did I say that? These aren't massive amounts to me but they can be vulnerable people. I was simply raising the anomoly and got responses from yourself and jon.The discussion has gone on and now you are giving up and getting arsey because you weren't able to fob me off.I don't dislike BG anymore than any other utility. If I did I wouldn't have placed the business with them. I was sincerely trying to get to the bottom of it, but I am still left with the impression that they have done something to benefit their cash flow at my expense.

backfoot

SwanJon wrote: »

So the next plan year would have started around Feb 2007 (depending n bill cycle), and the current plan around Feb 2008.
So, 8 months through the plan something changes, but as mentioned previously it might not have the immediate effect you are after.
To get an accurate DD, keep supplying readings, check your statemtns for estimates, check when your reassessments happen, or close the old payment plan and start again (just check nothing happens to your click tariff if you do, as Cardew says, somethimes the system isn't perfectly predictable.

PS, yes I am an employee - would you rather have no help?

Jon,

I asked if you were an employee out of interest because you had shown knowledge of the system. I thank you for your help. Just because someone doesn't accept some of the explanations or challenges/discusses the situation further you don't have to blame the customer.You never know they may be right.

I will contact BG direct to see if anyone there can throw some light on the issue but I don't think I am likely to find an answer given the emphasis will be to get rid of me as quickly as possible.

backfoot

Cardew wrote: »

Before the Board Troll chimes in, SwanJon has posted several times that he does indeed work for BG and has posted consistently helpful advice on this Board - it is very useful to have insight from any Utility company employee IMO.

It is surely better to have some informed views from people with knowledge of BG proceedures, than the usual screaming abuse of BG/NPower/EON/EDF etc that does nothing to answer your question.

On the face of it does seem an error for them to increase the DDs, even taking into account that BG are probably anticipating a rise in Click 5.

My reading of the posts from SwanJon and Paulonline123(another BG employee I believe) is that they are offering possible reasons for that increase in the DD - most of those reasons your subsequent posts demonstrate don't apply.

It is well accepted that BG's computer accounting system has many faults, however I suspect most are from the wrong data inputted, rather than an inherent problem with the program. Rubbish in = Rubbish out!

I don't have a problem with who they work for.See my response below.I think it helps to understand though why they may take up a stance which tends to favour the company line when the evidence is quite the opposite. The problem with many Customer Service issues is that Customer Service reps often fail to see that the customer can have a valid complaint. They become all defensive about their employer and their systems and can't believe they have got it wrong or assume the customer is on the make.

I note you are adamant about the Npower sculpting issue (and I support you) but their Customer Service reps aren't budging until you take it further and further.

1carminestocky

I also don't have a problem with who they work for, either, Backfoot,and I have made it entirely plain they are frequently an asset on here. All I have ever stated is, in my opinion, they should make it entirely clear which energy company they work for (maybe by placing it in their signature). It's not rocket science but I'm frequently labelled a troll by the board's Chief Inspector Dreyfus and that is demonstrably wrong.

backfoot

I am new to this Board and I note there are people with undoubted knowledge of the systems and procedures. I don't know the history of who has upset whom but I dare say I will pick it up.

I have like you just challenged the company line presented back to me. I think the intentions have been good but it still doesn't add up so I have continued to query it.It's a bit like these Customer Service problems be they banks/utitlities/shops the companies hate to be proved wrong and thats the stance they start from. Good customer Service appreciates the issue from the customers viewpoint.

I don't see that as troll like.

paulonline123

1carminestocky wrote: »

paulonline123, I know you are the expert here....but are you entirely sure about the %tage difference between standard tariff and Click 5?

Yes I am sure. What he will have done is check the prices AFTER the price increase when in fact his direct debit was set up BEFORE. Compared to what he would have paid if he hadn't gone on click 5 it probably is 25% total over the two (or more like 15% on the elec and 37% on the gas) but before it certainly was not that steep a difference.

I would venture a guess at saying when he entered his info into these comparison site he gave them his yearly spend rather than his yearly usage and this also always skews the figures.

I'll give you an example, not gonna be exactly the same as in all probability he lives in a different area.

My gas after the january price raise was:

6.151 tier 1 click 5 5.968 tier 1
2.580 tier 2 click 5 2.504 tier 2

My electric:

23.603 tier 1 click 5 23.707 tier 1
9.922 tier 2 click 5 8.002 tier 2

Now you also have to factor into that that before the January price rise or for most people roughly one full bill the standard rates were cheaper than that:

My gas before the january price raise was:

4.266 tier 1 click 5 5.968 tier 1
2.173 tier 2 click 5 2.504 tier 2

My electric:

15.764 tier 1 click 5 23.707 tier 1
8.894 tier 2 click 5 8.002 tier 2

Don't pay much attention to tier 1 rates as the amount charged at tier 1 halved but from the tier 2 rates you can see the difference (or lack thereof).

Now as I said this isn't exactly the same as yours but its representative, some elec areas are slightly more, some slightly less.

Its pretty obvious from it that it is not at all 25% as you were told by the comparison sites.

The simple inextricable fact is this. Did it save you money before? YES. Is it saving you money now? YES. Will it save you money in the future? YES!

My last post was a little sarcastic and arsy as you said, just woke up and my apologies.

backfoot

paulonline123 wrote: »

Yes I am sure. What he will have done is check the prices AFTER the price increase when in fact his direct debit was set up BEFORE. Compared to what he would have paid if he hadn't gone on click 5 it probably is 25% total over the two (or more like 15% on the elec and 37% on the gas) but before it certainly was not that steep a difference.

Yes that is exactly the relevant comparison. BG's standard rates go up while Click 5 hasn't as yet.

I would venture a guess at saying when he entered his info into these comparison site he gave them his yearly spend rather than his yearly usage and this also always skews the figures.

No, not correct. I absolutely used the annual consumptions in KWh. I quoted the figures in an earlier post and you can run them through the pricing models or calculate it long hand. You will see that the 25% saving is correct.

The simple inextricable fact is this. Did it save you money before? YES. Is it saving you money now? YES. Will it save you money in the future? YES!

Using the annual consumption it is easy to calculate the annual cost on the standard tariff. It shows that even after the latest increase,the DD's were just about right,especially taking into account the built up credits. After the switch the saving of 25% should have been the only possible change,not an increase in the DD's.

My last post was a little sarcastic and arsy as you said, just woke up and my apologies.

Accepted. However, I also hope now that you can accept that from the detail provided that BG have made a mistake in this case and that I have a good case for having the DD's reduced,or alternatively when BG raise the Click 5 costs then the DD's can stay at these increased rates without further change.