Chip & Signature Cards.

Jimney

Hi, Just been in H.Samuel manager told me i would not be allowed to use chip & signature card after feb 2006 as the banks will not guarantee to pay them. Is he right? I thought this would break disability laws.

James

As one who has 'opted,' for Chip & Signature Credit & Debit cards I received the following from Nationwide dated 14 October 2005. (extract):

You may have heard that from early 2006 you will need a PIN with your Debit card to complete purchases in shops and that your signature will no longer be accepted. We would like to reassure you that this does not apply to you as you have a Chip and Signature Debit card. You will be able to continue using your signature in exactly the same wasy as you do today. You should not be asked to enter a PIN.

Well done Nationwide!

Even The Press Release From APACS isn't very clear:

"If shoppers don't use their PIN, their card maybe declined and the option of signing can no longer be guaranteed."

http://www.apacs.org.uk/ (click onto News Room, then Press Releases for full text).


This is a slightly different message the the one that's been sPIN sorry sPUN in the press!

JoseChungsDoomsday

it should be noted that a shop can refuse any card paymnt is wishes, and as the rules are becoming more strict when it comes to fraud, you could see a lot of shop refusing chip & sig cards

Jimney

JoseChungsDoomsday wrote:

it should be noted that a shop can refuse any card paymnt is wishes, and as the rules are becoming more strict when it comes to fraud, you could see a lot of shop refusing chip & sig cards

This answers my question perfectly. I forgot a shop is not obliged to accept credit cards at all. Thanks to you both for answering me.

m277

This is happening because if your card is a signature card and if fraud is committed with your card then the shop is liable for any losses and not the bank. I got this from what my manager told me a few months ago.

saintstreaky

m277, I don't think that's right. From the chipandpin.co.uk website:

"What do I do if a customer doesn’t have a chip and PIN card?

There will be instances where cardholders do not have a chip and PIN card, for example disabled cardholders who are using chip and signature cards or UK and foreign cardholders who don’t have a chip and PIN card yet. A customer using a non chip and PIN card will automatically be prompted by the terminal to give their signature. As always, you need to undertake the usual security checks so that you are protected from any liability for fraud."

I believe store liability is only an issue if they haven't implemented Chip and Pin hardware or don't follow the correct procedures. The problem, IMO, is simply a lack of understanding by store staff, not helped by the confusing publicity from APACS who haven't done anything like enough to develop awareness of Chip and Signature.

Galstonian

While stores are under no obligation to accept any credit cards I don't think any will be implementing unilateral refusals to go against the guidlines being issued by the card issuers.

If they do then you could ask for written confirmation of their policy and complain to your card issuer and/or APACS but, as I said, I think it unlikely this will happen, its all FUD at the moment.

James

"The problem, IMO, is simply a lack of understanding by store staff, not helped by the confusing publicity from APACS who haven't done anything like enough to develop awareness of Chip and Signature."

Absolutely! Yet Sandra Quinn from APACS insisted quite sometime ago on National Radio that enough was being done to make people aware of Chip & Signature.

The following is an interesting read:

Does He Take PINs With His Chips?

http://www.theinquirer.net/?article=27304

M_Thomson

JoseChungsDoomsday wrote:

it should be noted that a shop can refuse any card paymnt is wishes, and as the rules are becoming more strict when it comes to fraud, you could see a lot of shop refusing chip & sig cards

Incorrect. As a poster says above, the rules will be after february 14 06 if it is a chip and pin card then the pin must be used. If the transaction turns out to be fraudelent and the shop has let the customer sign when it is a Chip and Pin card then the shop is liable for the fraud. If the pin has been used and it is fraud then the bank is liable. If the card is a Chip and Signature card and the transaction is fraudelent then the bank is liable not the shop. There is no way that shops will stop taking either chip and Signature cards or cards without chips until the whole world goes chip and pin. What about tourists who come from countries where chip and Pin is not used? Shops will not turn them away.

M_Thomson

m277 wrote:

This is happening because if your card is a signature card and if fraud is committed with your card then the shop is liable for any losses and not the bank. I got this from what my manager told me a few months ago.

That is also incorrect, providing that the shop has followed all the correct procedures and checked the signature correctly than the bank is liable for the fraud.

James

Here is the link from CardWatch, the APACS site advising retailers:

http://www.cardwatch.org.uk/faqs.asp?sectionid=1&fpid=113&fgid=36

My only gripe is that APACS are misleading the public into thinking they have to be disabled to acquire a Chip & Signature card - simply not true, ask them!