Bulk LPG - Cheapest suppliers / supply route?

Greenfly51

Just a copy of my letter to OFT today for information. I will post any reply.

Dear Mr Heideman,

I believe that you are looking into the distortion of the competitive LPG market due to continuing acquisitions of the few suppliers.
In my postcode AB34 5HN I have been switched from BP to Macgas and I now believe that this is to become Flogas. The price of my bulk LPG has rocketed in recent years and now stands at 65p/ltr which I understand is considerably higher than some other suppliers. It is difficult to make comparisons with the few remaining suppliers as they all have different deals for different times.
It would be very helpful if there was a transparent and honest comparison and more competition.

johnnybebad2000

Greenfly51 wrote: »

Just a copy of my letter to OFT today for information. I will post any reply.

Dear Mr Heideman,

I believe that you are looking into the distortion of the competitive LPG market due to continuing acquisitions of the few suppliers.
In my postcode AB34 5HN I have been switched from BP to Macgas and I now believe that this is to become Flogas. The price of my bulk LPG has rocketed in recent years and now stands at 65p/ltr which I understand is considerably higher than some other suppliers. It is difficult to make comparisons with the few remaining suppliers as they all have different deals for different times.
It would be very helpful if there was a transparent and honest comparison and more competition.

Just for info, i just signed up with Macgas 2 days ago in the AB33 postcode and got 39.95ppl fixed for 1 year.

jdwsc

Hi any suggestions for supplier of LPG, west Yorkshire, Lancs boarder? About to can Extragas for poor service and rude staff.
Thanks

rembo

Thanks Little Vermin, you are a little star! I have contacted all the suppliers suggested and they are working to help me. One problem could be telemetry which some do not operate. However, we are all extremely grateful for your continued support. I will let you know how I get on, as I said previously getting the signatures are going to be the bugbear.
Anyway many many thanks for your help:rotfl:

LittleVermin

rembo wrote: »

.....I have contacted all the suppliers suggested and they are working to help me. One problem could be telemetry which some do not operate. ....... I will let you know how I get on, as I said previously getting the signatures are going to be the bugbear.
.....

Telemetry? I cannot see that this is too big a problem. Flogas just needs to take its kit away and so long as there's a meter with a dial on the tank set-up someone on the estate needs to email your new supplier with readings every so often. The supplier will then be able to estimate when to come out for a refill even if the meter reader doesn't tell them when the tank meter is at (say) 20%. Once the supplier sees the pattern of usage they'll not need too much info (but I'm sure you've worked this out for yourself - and they will have told you).

If you can't get everyone to agree on a switch and you have to stick with Flogas then you could contact your MP. You could tell them that the Competition Commission tried to sort out the bulk LPG 'market' (see here) and the OFT have done two recent relevant studies (check out posts by HateLPG and others). And of course send him a link to HateLPG's charts (which are now endorsed for accuracy by DAVID.T2 - who is in the industry).

You could also go for the nuclear option and write to Prince Charles - Flogas has a Royal Warrant - Flogas were dead chuffed. Of course the reply might be a damp squib rather than a nuke aimed at cuddly little Flo! But I bet you pay more than HRH and his mum do!
..

*****
PS "little star" - thanks - it made me laugh as I'm 6 ft 5!

rembo

Thanks again Little Vermin, well never would have believed you were that tall as you called yourself Little Vermin!
I have come to the conclusion that we will have to stick with them as there are three rented properties and four up for sale.
So I have written a long diatribe to the brand new Minister for Energy. I have said that 100% of the estate signing up and no change for two years is not possible, and anyway the government got their job on a much lower percentage and they are permitted to run the country. So why on this earth would we need 100% to run a stupid LPG system. Have also written to the OFT but I am now starting on the Competition Commission. Then I will have a go at my MP who is Francis Maude. Only another two years to go to be re-elected they might work for us now!!!
I still think you are a little star:T:EasterBun

rembo

Sorry Little Vermin I didn't realize that the bunny got eaten!:(

HateLPG

rembo wrote: »

...I have written a long diatribe to the brand new Minister for Energy....

Have also written to the OFT...

I am now starting on the Competition Commission...

Then I will have a go at my MP who is Francis Maude.

I like the way you're thinking :T:beer:

If you also happen to subscribe to Which? you might also want to consider drawing their attention to this matter too. I can say with absolute certainty, you won't be the first to raise concerns about LPG with them .

I was just looking back through this thread, as I was going to do a cut-and-paste job on an earlier post on the Consumers Association's surprising powers, but having read that post, I think it is worth posting a link instead. The bit about the Consumers Association is the last paragraph, but there are several bits there that are also relevant to other recent posts.

Note, further to that post, that the OFT have in the last year or so required certain suppliers (in particular Flogas) to modify their terms and conditions to prevent unfettered price increases (see here) and that even if your existing contract doesn't explicitly include clauses limiting price increases and/or linking increases to changes in wholesale price, you still have the same cancellation rights as new customers automatically conferred as if those clauses were stated on your contract (Para 3.c.).

So, it might well be worth going back over the pricing history of your contract and comparing recent increases to the wholesale increases as shown on the graphs on this forum (latest is here). If you can show that Flogas have imposed an unjustified and significant price increase (or increases) since the date of that undertaking (which was made some time between November 2011 and March 2012), you may well have a case to kick them into touch with immediate effect.

There is also some useful and interesting information and background reading from the OFT to be found on the page detailing the findings of their Investigation into certain domestic bulk LPG suppliers, which resulted in the above-mentioned undertaking.

Good luck!

rembo

Hi Little Vermin,
What an absolute mine of info you are. I will read learn, mark and inwardly digest the whole lot later. (Cooking beckons).
You will probably be amused that I shot an email off to Prince Charles to say that I was shocked to learn that he had conferred this honour on Flogas, and then continued on about their habitual overcharging. Betcha he doesn't reply! At the same time emailed Francis Maude MP and will go to visit him asap.
Again I am indebted to you Little Star. Like a diamond in the sky!!!;)
p.s. Competition Commission next on the list

fly-tarquinnius

39.95ppl fixed for 1 year.

That sounds really good, and encouraging for my renewal in a few months. There does appear to be a bit of good competitive pricing just now too - have a flyer from J-GAS recently offering a guaranteed 10% discount on existing suppliers price. Waiting for a reply still, and no doubt lots of t's and c's, but my neighbour is happy with them having been stitched up by BP in the past.

Greenfly51 wrote: »

In my postcode AB34 5HN

How lucky you are, a very lovely place where I used to live