Almay, Amivo, IBS what are they about?

Anthillmob · 23 October 2006 at 12:34PM

how much is amway washing powder these days? i distinctly recall washing powder or washing up liquid was £10. !!!!!!.

BFG_2 · 23 October 2006 at 4:45PM

Anthillmob wrote:

how much is amway washing powder these days? i distinctly recall washing powder or washing up liquid was £10. !!!!!!.

Good question, maybe one of the Amway disciples would care to share that info with us??

The Scamway take is that 'you're not just buying on price, you're buying personal service,blah, blah'...yeah right!!!!

BFG_2 · 24 October 2006 at 10:05AM

BMSGuy wrote:

Franchising was investigated in exactly the same way as Amway. It was not understood and the established businesses were frightened of it and tried to get it made illegal. Network Marketing is frightening to established businesses and noy understood by the masses for exactly the same reasons. It is different and doesn't conform to the norm.

Lies do not help.

Again, straight forn the Scamway book of indoctrination...

..compare it to a proper business model (franchising) to give it a veneer of respectability.

....claim that 'big business' was frightened and tried to get it banned

....explain how it's 'different to anything the world has ever seen before' and 'not understood by the masses' - coz Jo Schmo is stupid, yeah right.

Next you'll be claiming the media (eg NBC in America) are out to get you 'to protect the advertising revenue they get from the big businesses that see Scamways £10 a box washing powder as a threat to their £3 a box washing powder'.............oh sorry, I forgot the Scamway stuff has magical powers and the other stuff is killing our grannies (or is that the vits/water/frying pan)

Simple question for you - How much is a box of your powder???

BFG_2 · 24 October 2006 at 10:23AM

BMSGuy wrote:

Use cheapo and less of it! You are looking more stupid all the time.
Have you ever compared a cheapo with SA8? NO? Well I have and so have a lot of people.

You're right, a lot of people have ...inc this bloke in the states...he shows that comparing like with like Scamway powder is more expensive (40 odd percent IIRC)

AMway Claim: The SA-8 laundry detergent is cheaper to use. It's concentrated!
Truth: I did a price study, and found that the SA-8 is only cheaper to use against the small boxes of Tide, purchased in a supermarket. One 9.9 lb. box of SA-8 is equal to 150 loads, and at distributor price is $25.56 (includes 4% shipping). If you use only one scoop per load (two scoop are recommended for hard water), the price per load is $.171. The table below, shows the "Power of Buying Large Sizes" at Wal-Mart. Sure, if you are stupid enough to buy the 10 load box at Publix grocery store for almost $.32 per load, then you can save money with SA-8 at $.171 per load. Buying Tide at Publix is almost 87% more expensive than the SA-8.
If you really want to save money, buy the 23-lb pack at Wal-Mart for $.119 per load and save 43.4% over the SA-8. Even with the smaller 5.75 lb box at Wal-Mart, you can still save 10.7% over the SA-8, and you don't have to buy as many loads as the SA8 gives. If you buy the USA Detergents brand liquid, you can get down to $.093/load, or a savings of 45% over the SA8. Anyone who thinks they can retail SA-8 will be hopelessly uncompetitive at $.206 per load (no shipping included).
In addition, the retail mark up is only 20.7% (16.7% if the distributor absorbs the 4% shipping). The markup is just 2/3 of their widely touted 30% "immediate profit", and this is one of the famous Amway core products! (these prices may not be up to date and are for illustration only)

Quote from someone who fell for the 'conversion presentation' : "We have been purchasing core products (Amway). We were lead to believe (again lied to) that these products were competitive with retailers, plus receive a discount up to 30% - plus you got paid (3% back based on obtaining100 pv)". Site visitor

Anthillmob · 24 October 2006 at 11:03AM

and a pot and pan set costing £500 when you can buy the same for about £60 in argos.

Anthillmob · 24 October 2006 at 11:15AM

examples

7 piece starter set of pots and pans using a currency converter this will set you back £389.09

washing powder using the cc this will set you back £41.11

:rotfl: if you spend more than £5 on washing powder you are a fool!

BMSGuy · 25 October 2006 at 8:42PM

ManAtHome wrote:

Mick, I'm sure you're right, but from reading these posts, apparently

a) anyone using (eg) Tesco washing powder stinks
b) reputable water companies are pumping crap through our taps
c) vitamin supplements are essential

reads a bit like the people who knock on my door inferring that I'm too stupid and lazy to look for good value in whatever they are selling (eg perhaps not quite as ethical as they could be).

I'll try to reply to you one at a time, so bear with me!

first point no. Not anyone who uses tesco powder stinks but anyone who claims buy a cheapo and use less of it is heading down the path to stinkdom.
The critism was price for a box of SA8.
On many comparisons Amways products at retail compare on a cost per recommended use to virtually all of the retailed brands.
Cheapo powders are exactly that cheap. Less soap and of a lower quality that is why they are cheap.

2. Reputable water companies do pump crap into our mains. They, by law, have to maintain an average minimum standard. Any analysis of "drinking" water will show up viruses, bacteria, phosphates, chlorine, and thousands of other pollutants. Infants and people with lowered immune systems are warned against tap water. So for many the water is safe but that is because we have built up immunity. I am not claiming that mains water will kill you but BFG started the ranting on outrageous claims that I never seen in the Amway Literature. Our water treatment system purifies and filters the water at a very low unit cost. Safe enough for infants and people with lowered immune systems. If you don't want filtered water fine but don't claim that people who do and have done their research are being scammed.

3. Vitamins. I didn't say they were essential. They are a suppliment to help us in our modern lives. Most of us eat poorly and supplimentation can help. But it is a choice. Are our vitamins more expensive than the real competition?

I will have a sensible conversation with anyone on this. Nutrilite produce 6 billion tablets and capsules per year that are sold through 3 million IBOs in over 80 countries and territories. That is every year.

Take them yourself and see how you feel in 3 months. If you don't feel a tangible benefit to your overall health you can have a refund.

We have an endorsement from Asafa Powell, who uses double X as part of his training regime. His claim is that it was the only thing he changed prior to him setting and equalling the world record for 100m. Now maybe he is lying and maybe he says it for sponsorship but with the rigourous testing that athletes go through would he endorse something even remotely dodgy?

As I have repeatedly said price is not the only factor. BFG obviously has some beef with Amway. If it was just the prices I am sure that he would get bored and leave the "fight" to someone else. I just he would reveal his real agenda. I have lots of customers that buy at retail and repeatedly. Lots of them ring me before I supposedly "scare them and badger them into buying to shut me up". Now they go to supermarkets already for the stuff that we don't do so why don't they buy the cheapy powders and liquids instead? I will let you answer that.

Today I saw a customer that has had Amway products for over 20 years. She loses distributors for whatever reason but contacts Amway for another. Why does she do that do you think?

I apologise for becoming insulting to BFG. It is unexcusable. All I want to know is his agenda. So please get off of the price and come out with it.

BMSGuy · 25 October 2006 at 8:50PM

BFG wrote:

Mick

The DTI are pretty useless (their nickname is the Department of Timidity and Inaction!!!) It's better to take a look at the actions that the US has taken against these organisations - typically Better Business Bureaus and State Attorneys...have a google for them.

I'm not saying Amway products in and of themselves are the main scam, it's more to do with the business model.

Scamway/Scamivo vitamins are just as rip-off/useless as all other expensive vits - just much more expensive;

their magic water cleaner (so your kids don't get poisoned) is the same as the other useless water filters (just much more expensive)

their magic frying pan (with a lid) is the same as other frying pans - just much more expensive (and it's got a magic lid)

their magic washing powder does just the same as Tesco's own brand - it's just a lot more expensive

The people who are most affected by the Scamways of this world are not the occasional granny who buys a packet of washing powder but the poor suckers who are sucked in believeing they can have a wonderful lifestyle (look at the claims/pics on the websites) just by selling products...oh and recruiting others.

These people plug away for months, some for years, being told by the upstream (their bosses/recruiters) that everyone else is making thousnads, you just have to try a bit harder.....but it never comes.

Read any of the accounts on the web by real people who fell for it .....see previous links in my postings.

Something like 60% fallout in first 6 moths, 98% fallout in 2 years..shows how many join and realise it won't work.

Of course the Scamways supporters will just tell you 'they didn't try hard enough', but the amusing thing is that every person who defends Scamways etc does it using the virtually the same mantras as taught to them during their life a Scamway convert.

Ask any proponent of Scamways to show you their IR accounts for the 'big money' they earn....... deafening silence.

Many people compare Scamways etc to a religious cult...with it's dogma and a virtual 'kill the unbelievers' stance...I'll let you make up your own mind.

I'm all in favour of people joining any business opportunity/scam, just so long as they do it from a position of having all the info to hand to make a fully informed decision.

Lots and Lots here.

Ok. I think you don't like the route to market, is that it?

Has an IBO ever tried to recruit you?
What did they say?
Did you see the presentation?
What information was left out that you felt that you needed?
When did you see the presentation?

You keep using the term scam. How is Amway a scam? Please don't jump on the price band wagon again. Scams are not judged by their prices. Something can be low cost but a scam or the most expensive on the market and best value.
I think one of my original posts stated that the perception of the business is based upon who shows it to you.
Who showed it to you and why didn't you report them to Amway. They do take action over incorrect behaviours.

BMSGuy · 25 October 2006 at 9:00PM

Anthillmob wrote:

how much is amway washing powder these days? i distinctly recall washing powder or washing up liquid was £10. !!!!!!.

Price? Is that your issue?

Well don't buy the products, nobody will force you.

Washing up liquid.
We used to wash up twice a day (before the dishwasher)
We used to buy dish drops in a one litre bottle once every six months. That is £12 of washing up liquid per year
How much is Fairy? How long does it last?
£1 per bottle? Lasts for 1 month? I don't know as I haven't bought any for 12 years!
That works out at £12.
Oh! Rip off scam burn me at the stake!
My soap powder lasts between 2 and 3 months. thats about £60 per year how much does Persil cost? How long does it last?
Yes on a cost per box or bottle the products can seem to have a scary price. But once given all the information to make an informed decision only an ill informed and biased individual would bring up a pricing issue.

BMSGuy · 25 October 2006 at 9:03PM

BFG wrote:

Good question, maybe one of the Amway disciples would care to share that info with us??

The Scamway take is that 'you're not just buying on price, you're buying personal service,blah, blah'...yeah right!!!!

Your prayers have been answered. I have shared my experience with you. Personal service is products delivered to your door at a convenient time at no extra cost. That's Amway for you.

I bet you say something about the retail price in your reply.

Almay, Amivo, IBS what are they about?

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