Halifax charges -£39

Walletwatch

catalonia13 wrote:

btw - what option do we have but to sign these contracts agreeing to whatever, If you don't sign you can't open an account, no account = no wages, 'catch 22' I think!?

Frankly, you may not have an option other than going with the bank that is most lenient on such charges. That however does not give you the right to spend something that wasn't yours in the first place. At least when you wrote out that cheque, you were spending money that wasn't yours.

I don't see this as a catch 22. Instead I would say, this should be a lesson to anybody it happens to the first time to:

1. Better manage your cashflows, so that you only spend to the extent you actually have money available in your bank (even there, keep a buffer of around £200 for unforeseen circumstances)

2. If you are a habitual overspender, get an overdraft in place, and make it a point to remain within the o/d limit (and not overspend on the overdraft as well)

I do not intend to sound pedantic out here. Nor do I intend to get into a debate whether such charges are legal or not (that is anyway being discussed extensively in another thread here) I have always maintained that these charges themselves are excessively high most of the time, but the best strategy should be to avoid them, rather than incur them and then fight back. You sign up to T&Cs confirming that you are liable for such charges, and whether such conditions are proven enforcable in a court of law or not, I personally don't see it as correct to sign on the dotted line without intending to honour the agreement at a later date.

I must add though that when one loses a job, or gets his salary a few days late on the odd occasion, it is understandable for one to go into o/d at such times. However, in my personal experience, banks have been very understanding, whenever I've had a genuine issue or some fees have been wrongly charged to my account.

Finally, why not turn the tables on them? Just stay within your available account balance, and handle your finances properly, and wait for the bank to scr** up on your account just once (we all know one doesn't have to wait long for that) Then write to them, copying somebody very senior like the Chairman or CEO of the bank, detailing what exactly has gone wrong. Maybe give the letter a professional touch, asking them to treat it as an invoice for an amount of £35 for the inconvenience you've had to undergo, and the administrative costs and bother, also quoting it as a quid pro quo for a similar charge they would levy in the opposite scenario. You will find that in most cases, banks take such letters very seriously, and compensate you for their lapses. I can tell you I have personally claimed an average of £30-50 a month over the past year or so, on a bank or any other service provider messing up (and I am not ashamed of it)

On the issue at hand, try explaining it to the bank as a genuine mistake you are sorry about. I suggest you do not take a hard stance with them - remember, you are interested in trying to minimise your loss for an unintentional mistake you acknowledge you've made, not leading a crusade against bank charges. Best of luck, and tell us how you get on.

catalonia13

Walletwatch - I hear what you say but have to come back on a couple of points you raised!
When I opened this account 7 years ago I was a single parent on benefits, they were the only bank who would have me so I had no option.

I do not feel when I wrote out the cheque I was 'spending money that wasn't mine' as I fully expected some expenses I was owed to be in my account on time to cover it (as they always have been) and had no prior indication that this was not to be the case.

I manage my money extremely well, down the the last penny, but to 'have a buffer of £200'? - I wish, I'm self employed now and on Tax Credits, I am very, very frugal but having that much of a 'buffer' is a long way down the road yet!

I have a free £100 o/d, I use it all the time but I never ever (except this time) exceed it.

I don't think you are being pedantic but you obviously don't live under the same financial restraint as I do!

and finally, some months ago I changed 7 of my 13 standing orders on-line, changing the amounts of some and the dates of other (being so careful (fanatical even) about my money this is something I do on a regular basis to avoid such charges) but the bank paid them all out at the original amounts/dates, causing me to go overdrawn, have insufficient funds for food etc and another charge (it was £35 then), I rang, and rang, and rang, and rang. I got NOWHERE, they refused to accept it was their fault, they simply were not interested, they did nothing, every member of staff told me something different and in the end I gave up out of sheer frustration. so I handled my finances properly, the bank screwed up, and I learnt a bitter lesson, the bank is always right!

Fedz

I did say to the OP about calling Halifax CS and ask for a goodwill refund but I understand the OP is questioning the amount being charged for a returned cheque due to insufficient funds.

Whilst this fee (£39) can be seen as excessive - they do have the desired effect. The fee isn't for a simple computer generated email but also includes the manual process of attempting to process the cheque in the first place.

This is why banks have overdraft facilities in place - for unfortuanate circumstances like this - if you live within this buffer zone on a regular basis then one has to consider increasing the overdraft and or paying close attention to finances.

Laws are in place to protect the consumer and rightly so. These charges are universal to all banks not just the Halifax.

I agree with other posters pointing out that one charge can then snowball into another purely because of the banks system of charging.

If I have upset the OP in any way I sincerely apologies, it is better to put it blunt in some instances rather than being cryptic.

Kind regards

catalonia13

Fedz - thanks for your apologies, accepted! I agree with you that if someone is asking for your opinion, sometimes it is better to be blunt, but I never asked for anyones opinions, just for help in composing a letter!

Fedz

Head the letter with your name, address and account number.

Dear Halifax Plc

Thank you for providing a fantastic banking service to-date.

It is with regret that I have to write to you today with a complaint of service(s) received.

Recently I have had a charge of £39 applied to my account in regards to an unpaid cheque due to insufficient funds.

I received an automatic generated email advising me of the above charge.

Whilst I find it understandable that due to my error I should be charged. I feel that the charge applied to my account is unrealistic and not proportionate to the actual costs incurred by yourselves and a lesser amount could be charged in these circumstances.

I emailed Halifax Customer Services on the 10th Aug. 2005 regarding the above and I promptly had an acknowledgement email advising this issue has been escalated to the 'bank account dept.'

Since this time I have not received any further communication from yourselves regarding the above complaint.

Can you please contact me as soon as possible with a progress update.

Whilst this issue is resolved satisfactory can you please remove the charge of £39 from my account.

If you require further clarification please do not hesitate to contact me.

Yours Sincerely

XXX

catalonia13

THANK YOU Fedz, thats a nice straightforward factual letter and probably a tad more polite than my own version would've been, tho I shall remove the first line (it'd be too hypocritical coming from me!) and I shalln't be putting no kisses on the end either!!

I'm joking now, I know they represent my name, it just struck me funny and I'm lol now!!

chickadee

I'm sorry to see this valid discussion being hijacked by unfriendly posts. There are occasions when ALL of us screw something up. None of us are infallible. Nor are the banks.

The point I would like to raise is that isn't there somewhere in law a precedent that states that contract terms are unfair if you don't have an alternative, i.e. if all the banks make similar charges for the same infringements, then you don't have the opportunity to choose one that doesn't impose these ridiculous punitive charges. Therefore as you have no choice, they are unenforceable.

I'm sure I remember a case about car parks from my business law course many years ago......but then again I could be going mad.

Fedz

No problem and thank you for accepting my genuine and sincere apology

Yes the kisses are your name that would be put a new meaning to customer <> bank relationship, Ha!

If you don't get any satisfactory result from them you should consider voice calling Halifax Customer Services and speaking to the customer relations manager.

I have always found it better to fax letters as I fear emails are easily lost and or over looked

Please keep us informed of any result and good luck!

MarkyMarkD

tinalives wrote:

It PROVES that the bank were unwilling/unable to defend their stance!!

Halfwit!!!

It doesn't prove that at all. There's no need to be offensive to other people even if they are provocative like THE ROCK.

All it proves is that they didn't attend in court. Previous posts from an Abbey employee stated that they didn't receive the notice of claim and hence didn't know the case had gone to court. The same post also stated that Abbey were going to appeal it.

MarkyMarkD

Catalonia

Getting back on track, you said in your OP that the charge arose because a BACS credit you were expecting arrived late.

It isn't Halifax's error, so why are you harrassing them?

The correct approach is to demand compensation from the person who made the BACS payment late.