DMP Mutual Support Thread (Part Three)

loopylu36

andytwonames wrote: »

I guess it's the proportion of this loan compared to the others. The NR loan is over 26k and the rest of them put together are 31k so that's how the NR loan gets such a lot.

I don't know tbh, I've given up trying to work it out. My NR loan is the biggest too at £27k but they are actually getting a smaller payment than some of my creditors that I owe less too I'm told this is because it is calculated on the contractual payments rather than the balance outstanding.

I have moments at the moment ( )when I just want to give up altogether and let creditors do whatever they like, but then I think this time off work should be put to some good use. I need to be a bit careful at the moment, as I'm starting to feel like a bit of waste of space after being fired, so need to keep myself occupied so I can't sit and wallow for too long.

So, on with the good fight...

I have received a copy of my CCA from NR - well sort of. It is just one page when there is clearly more as it refers to clauses overleaf - there is no overleaf! Also it is not signed or dated by NR and is also clearly just a photocopy of a faxed copy (you can see the fax transmission info on the bottom - it was faxed by my solicitors at the time to them) So:

1. Is it enforceable if they do not have the whole document?
2. Is it enforceable as it is not signed by NR?
3. Is it enforceable as I suspect they only have a fax and not one with our original signatures on?
4. I suspect that the loan completed without the 7 day cooling off period being completed - does this help me? I am trying to confirm this at the moment.
5. As they have not supplied a complete document to me as yet, is the clock still ticking so far as the 12 + 2 days is concerned?

I don't want to avoid paying NR but I do want them to start playing nice! And like a lot of creditors, they seem to think that they are a law unto themselves when we all know better!:D

Thanks for any help.

compulsivespender79

Hi LoopyLu,

A CCA must contain at the very least APR, monthly repayments due, and credit/loan amount to be enforceable.
Signatures can be omitted from a true copy, as can several other things.

IS MY AGREEMENT ENFORCEABLE( Via section 127(3) CCA1974)
PRESCRIBED TERMS FOR THE PURPOSES OF SECTIONS 61(1)(0) AND 127(3) OF THE
CONSUMER CREDIT ACT 1974 Taken from sced.6(1983/1553) regulations
(If you just want to find out, skip the bits in between the stars it’s just some extra information)

**What do we mean by unenforceable?
In the Consumer Credit Act section 127 there is a provision for making an agreement unenforceable if it does not contain certain pieces of information.
Subsections 1,2,3,4 state which pieces of information these are, and everything mentioned there must be included within the body of the agreement, if one is missing the agreement is unenforceable.

How does unenforceable differ from enforceable with a court order only?
When an agreement is unenforceable it means that the court or the judge cannot make a ruling on it. The court cannot make it enforceable.
When an agreement is enforceable only by ruling of the court it means that the agreement can be stopped by the debtor but the court has the power to re-instate it and allow the credit to continue to enforce.**

The Prescribed Terms are these

A Amount of credit
A term stating the amount of credit

B Repayments
A term stating how the debtor is to discharge his obligations under the agreement to make the repayments, which may be expressed by reference to a combination of any of the following-
(a) Number of repayments;
(b) Amount of repayments;
(c) Frequency and timing of repayments;
(d) Dates of repayments;
(e) The manner in which any of the above may be determined; or in any other way, and any power of the creditor to vary what is payable.

C Rate of interest
A term stating the rate of interest to be applied to the credit issued under the agreement
D Credit limit
This may be a term or the manner in which it will be determined or that there is no credit limit.

---

Which of these applies to you depends on the type of agreement you have?

For a Running Account (credit card) agreement

BC and D Apply

For a Restricted Use Debtor Creditor Supplier

• Where the dealer is the supplier and the creditor is the one providing the finance.
• The money can only be used for the purpose it is given.
• There is no interest on the purchase (the cash price is the same as the total price)
• And there is no advance payment

A is applicable

For a fixed Sum Credit Agreement
A conventional credit agreement with none of the above restrictions

A and B apply

For a Hire Agreement

B is Applicable

This paper only covers section 127(3) of the Act agreements can also be unenforceable by contravention of sections 1 and4 this will be the subject of the next paper.
Please note that these Prescribed terms where not changed in any way by the 2004/1482 Ammendments although the form in which they appear on the agreement was. Subsection127(3) was repealed on the 6th of April 2007 so that unenforceability due to 127(3) will only apply to agreements executed before that date.

I've taken the above from a very helpful person on the CAG Forum. Have a look at my thread on there and it might help you a bit more (it really helped me!);

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/general-debt-issues/137503-trouble-lowell-financial-cca.html

Hope that helps,

CSx

edit: Don't know what's happened to the font - it was fine while I was typing it. Ooops!

loopylu36

Thanks CS.

Will look at your other thread x

WhoopieDoodle

Skipadee - thank you for your earlier post. It puts into perspective our debt problems

Maz, when I receive letters from different departments but the same company, I write 1 letter and CC it to all the relevant people.

Marru

I am doing my own DMP and would be grateful for advice as just finding my way around it. I sent letters end of January to all creditors to inform them that I am seeking advice and asking to hold action. End of February I sent letters to offer token payments of £1 each which I paid 1st of March and 1st of April. Now in the end of April I sent letter offering pro rata payments of £110 (for £37k loan in total). This is what the creditors have sent me:

NW cc, default notice dated 28th March, required action within 17 days, no other correspondence since except statement 15th April where interest and late payment fee were added

Lloyds cc, have stopped calls, no letters except normal statement mid April where interest and late payment fee had been added

M&S cc, 18th of April letter where they had reduced my credit limit by £400, statement where interest had been added and today I got default notice (that they are going to charge £12 of) requiring action within 14 days

NW peronal loan, no correspondence or calls, had added quarterly interest in 31st of March, today got default notice requiring action by 13th of May and kindly telling that interest will continue to be applied

NW od, same as personal loan but in addition they have added a fee of £30 charge for sending me the notice.

So, what should be my plan of action now? I was going to send them letters asking again to stop the interest but should I do something more now that 4 out of 5 have defaulted me?

The added interest is killing me but I am trying to stay calm and take it as it is and just go step at the time.

Marru

skibadee

Have just spoken to Payplan as requested last week to talk to someone about IVA as an alternative to my current DMP.....[ I know I said yesterday I wouldn't consider this....when I was in my forthright mood!!].....well I'm definetly not convinced now.....total debt is £55,000 approx.,....if I paid into IVA for 60 - 72 mths there would be an amount of approx £8000 which is in joint names still to be settled after.......going back to my previous post...with my health record and the current financial climate I still don't feel this is the right move somehow.....trouble is I think when you speak to these people they tell you how much of a better option it would be and how creditors wouldn't be able to hassle you.....main hassle at moment is 1st Credit and the fact Citi financial still haven't accepted....all other approx., 9 creditors have accepted....the thought of not being hassled is appealing....but do I really want to enter into this at the moment.....My gut feeling tells me '' no''!

WhoopieDoodle

Good news. Capital One have stopped adding interest/charges. Woo Hoo!

Now we need to remainder of our creditors to stop adding a million pounds each month! (okay, slight ex .. exagera? how the heck do you spell that word?)

TakeittotheLimit.

WhoopieDoodle wrote: »

Good news. Capital One have stopped adding interest/charges. Woo Hoo!

Now we need to remainder of our creditors to stop adding a million pounds each month! (okay, slight ex .. exagera? how the heck do you spell that word?)

Just watch out for them still adding £12 for a late default fee.:rolleyes:

andytwonames

WhoopieDoodle wrote: »

(okay, slight ex .. exagera? how the heck do you spell that word?)

Gerzagerayshun

I reckon

loopylu36

skibadee wrote: »

Have just spoken to Payplan as requested last week to talk to someone about IVA as an alternative to my current DMP.....[ I know I said yesterday I wouldn't consider this....when I was in my forthright mood!!].....well I'm definetly not convinced now.....total debt is £55,000 approx.,....if I paid into IVA for 60 - 72 mths there would be an amount of approx £8000 which is in joint names still to be settled after.......going back to my previous post...with my health record and the current financial climate I still don't feel this is the right move somehow.....trouble is I think when you speak to these people they tell you how much of a better option it would be and how creditors wouldn't be able to hassle you.....main hassle at moment is 1st Credit and the fact Citi financial still haven't accepted....all other approx., 9 creditors have accepted....the thought of not being hassled is appealing....but do I really want to enter into this at the moment.....My gut feeling tells me '' no''!

H Skiabadee

I think there are three points to consider with an IVA:

Firstly, as you say, if you default on it then you go b/r. And who knows what your financial position will be in 1, 2 or 5 years' time? At least on DMP you can reduce payments if absolutely necessary. I am worried about making my dmp payments at the moment as I have just lost my job, but I would be a hell of a lot more worried if I was on an IVA and missing a payment would result in b/ruptcy.

The second point to consider is that your creditors don't have to agree to your IVA. If your creditors are being difficult at the moment, then I can't see them accepting/agreeing to an IVA either. They will get less money back via an IVA than on your DMP afterall, so why would they? That's just my opinion tho (whether they would accept or not).

Thirdly, an IVA is a lot more damaging than a DMP - not just from a credit point of view, but for some jobs, becoming a parent governer, things like that, so you should make sure you look into these consequences.

I'm sure you have already thought of these things, but hope it helps to have another opinion.

Loopy x