WWYD? Request to loan in-laws money

Sea_Shell

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/82010565#Comment_82010565

I'd assumed Feelings of Guilt.

IWasHereBefote

Fear, Obligation, Guilt

https://outofthefog.website/toolbox-1/2015/11/17/fog-fear-obligation-guilt

RAS

Check out Dave Ramsay. "Choose guilt over resentment every time." And "offer tools not cash.

familyfortune

There is so much here that’s out of your control which must be incredibly frustrating.

And the finances are so complicated that they can be argued almost any way you want. Interesting thought that no one commenting on the thread thinks lending your in laws money is a good idea. And it does seem that overall there’s a gravitational pull in the family towards financial complexity and challenge which is problematic.

It seems that your PIL have a lot of choices which is great - although from what you say they aren’t seeing them as choices and are making excuses not to consider them. Is there space to sit down and brainstorm all of the options, put them all on the table and go through pros and cons for each option? It is interesting that their first choice is the one that inconveniences your husband rather than them. They are seeking to transfer the burden of the worry from them to him. And by extension to you. Do they see this clearly? Do they fully understand the burden and risk they are putting on him and on your family? So for example to save them tax or to enable them to get £15k extra for a house, they are asking your husband to potentially incur a significant tax burden. I think they are looking at the issue very narrowly whereas looking at it more broadly would be more useful. If they are motivated by a rational tax-based argument then this could open up a discussion that could be more about rational allocation of resources rather than concerns about lending money and/or not being paid back. And at the very least there is a chance to foreground the emotions that are being disguised as rationality (e.g. the not wanting to sell the family home, and/or being very attached to a particular number in terms of what something can be sold for). Some kind of third party could be very useful here - is there a tax advisor or financial professional who might be able to ask some of the right questions? You mention that there are professionals in the mix who are already concerned about the situation, could one of them potentially help? Family members tend to mind their Ps and Qs more when an outsider is involved.

For you though, the thing to consider is what parts of this mess can you control. You can’t control what your husband does and if you do force a decision on him then you risk anything that flows from that decision being your fault (I mean to him, I know what his family thinks is less of a concern). When of course your view (quite rationally) will be that it’s your PIL’s choices that caused the problem.

I’d encourage you to think about what YOU can and can’t live with and communicate that to your husband so that at least he has a clear idea of the consequences of his actions. But be clear that the decision has to be his. If he is risking your relationship and your trust he needs to know that. You might consider working with a counsellor or coach yourself on this even if no one else in the family would consider it. It’s your job to protect your own wellbeing, especially if in the context of a big complicated family individual members tend to get trampled over.

I’d also ask, in the spirit of considering all options, is there a way for you to be ok with this? E.g. are there any legal guarantees that would mean you could live with it? Rather than lending them money, could you buy them out of a share of the family home (generously priced in your favour) as one example? That way you’d have some kind of guaranteed return on your money down the line. I’m not saying this is the right answer but it is worth putting your thinking hat on to see if there’s an option that could be financially advantageous to your family in the medium term that meets their needs. If they say no that also tells you something.

Good luck though. I think you’re gong to need it!

IWasHereBefote

Thanks. They are 5 hours away from us (the other siblings are all there too) and DD is in the middle of her GCSEs so we won’t be sitting down with any of them anytime soon.

FIL won’t take advice from anyone - DH and sibling have worked out how to make him think ideas are his in the past and hoping they can do the same here. BIL mentioned FIL still has a load of shares which are sitting high right now so they could access money in other ways.

DH is so soft he would likely give away any share in any home (which I have absolutely zero interest in having) in future however it came to him.

RAS

DH needs to make explicit to PIL that finding £40k for them will cost him £100k because of tax. And maybe that would need to be factored into any 2nd charge securing his contribution. In practice, he'd never get his money back but at least he'd get a portion of the penalty returned.

Or maybe it would be better if one of the other siblings explaining the true cost of his offer?

lincroft1710

FIL is selfish, autocratic and seemingly incapable of logical thought process. Lend him the money and YOU'LL NEVER SEE IT AGAIN!!

(please show to DH)

MayDogsandCoffee

TBH I am not sure why you husband (or siblings for that matter) are trying to sort out the mess, The In-Laws are not taking advice, let them get on with it and bail themselves out. If he were to loan / lose the money then he is taking away from his family, wife and children, and their future, which is more important to him?

strawb_shortcake

If he's head of the family perhaps he needs to act like it and not rely on handouts from his children

IWasHereBefote

DH has taken to speaking to them when I am not around. He spoke to them last night. FIL has been throwing his weight around with the BIL that lives in the inherited house and demanding that he moves stuff to the family house immediately so they can get inherited house on the market. BIL has kicked off and has become “obstructive” and says he doesn’t understand the sudden urgency. Peacekeeper BIL is trying to sort that out (FIL and obstructive BIL have always been like oil and water).

DH suggested they focus on the family home and getting that on the market. FIL said that wasn’t happening and they would withdraw from the sale before doing that. 🙄

I’ve suggested to DH that someone needs to get their head around the numbers at this point as it sounds like the new house is actually more expensive than DH thought, and it’s highly unlikely they will get top dollar on the inherited house so I think the gap will be ridiculous (as we have no idea what cash they have access to).

And I’ve again pointed out that they are grown, competent adults who have been completely idiotic in their handling and approach to this, and that we (because it is not just DH affected) are not responsible for fixing it. They need to do everything in their power to sort it out. If they need £5-10k from us to get it over the line I can live with that (just about) but no more. And if they lose money getting themselves out of it, well that’s on them as well as a natural consequence of being so bloody blase about a massive legal and financial commitment.